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My money is on the GS next year and the RT following year. I also think the K1300 will go away for some other version, hopefully a sports/touring model of the S1000RR engine so the bike will be light. And, the new director of BMW motorcycles in Germany wants some changes including going back into the cruiser market, yikes. The only BMW that will make it there would be the original drawing of the six cylinder bike out now but in a naked street cruiser version as we saw first. That would be hot. I know plenty of people that say right now they would be interested. I also heard from a dealer source last week that the rumor is the possibility of the water cooled twin being 150 HP! I'll be surprised if it is that high, maybe 130 or so. But on the other hand "they" don't want ducati to leave BMW behind in the twin HP wars.
 

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four12 said:
I can think of a lot of farkles to add to a bike, but a water closet never crossed my mind.
That is for the long distance rider whose bladder is smaller than the fuel tank :D
 

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I was attracted to the BMW Boxer bikes specifically because they were air/oil cooled, not water cooled. I'm sure they'll be faster and more efficient, but I'm not interested.
 

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four12 said:
I can think of a lot of farkles to add to a bike, but a water closet never crossed my mind.

Is the bidet an option? :confused:

Hmmm... for the GS crowd, the hot water would make a great shower in the boondocks. :wave
 

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ka5ysy said:
Is the bidet an option? :confused:

Hmmm... for the GS crowd, the hot water would make a great shower in the boondocks. :wave
Toilet, shower.........why stop there? Surely those smart Euro engineers can come up with a way to use the engine heat to brew a little espresso..............and why not generate a little steam so that you could have a latte if you liked? Now THERE is a farkle that would sell in Seattle.......even to the adventure tourers! Of course, adding a lot of caffeine and horsepower at the same time might be a mistake.

Seriously, it seems wrong somehow to water cool a boxer, but I suppose it's inevitable. Hopefully the result will be something worthy of the tradition.
 

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jrhSeattle said:
Seriously, it seems wrong somehow to water cool a boxer, but I suppose it's inevitable. Hopefully the result will be something worthy of the tradition.
It also seemed wrong to water cool a Porsche, but I'd never go back...
 

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jrhSeattle said:
Toilet, shower.........why stop there? Surely those smart Euro engineers can come up with a way to use the engine heat to brew a little espresso..............and why not generate a little steam so that you could have a latte if you liked? Now THERE is a farkle that would sell in Seattle.......even to the adventure tourers! Of course, adding a lot of caffeine and horsepower at the same time might be a mistake.

Seriously, it seems wrong somehow to water cool a boxer, but I suppose it's inevitable. Hopefully the result will be something worthy of the tradition.

Funny you mention coffee machines... I get so much grief from my HD buddies about "where is the espresso machine??" that I actually bought a small aluminum one-cup version and keep it in the top case. When anybody starts that business, I look them in the eye and say "Hey, this is a BMW... that is a standard feature on this bike" and pull out the espresso pot. The looks on everyone's face is priceless, and things get really quiet... :histerica
 

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Soon, I hope. Water cooling is not new to BMW, more HP, wet clutch, maintenance is a drain and fill, it's a good thing. Don't worry the boxer won't loose it's charm.
 

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New2rt said:
Soon, I hope. Water cooling is not new to BMW, more HP, wet clutch, maintenance is a drain and fill, it's a good thing. Don't worry the boxer won't loose it's charm.
Water cooling isn't a prerequisite to having a wet clutch (Harley has them). That said, a wet clutch would be a welcome addition.

The issue I have with water cooling is that it's one more system to break down, and it complicates taking things apart. There's a beautiful simplicity to air cooling that I prefer on a motorcycle, in spite of all the practical advantages that water cooling offers.
 

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05Train said:
Water cooling isn't a prerequisite to having a wet clutch (Harley has them). That said, a wet clutch would be a welcome addition.

The issue I have with water cooling is that it's one more system to break down, and it complicates taking things apart. There's a beautiful simplicity to air cooling that I prefer on a motorcycle, in spite of all the practical advantages that water cooling offers.
From what I've read and seen it will have a wet clutch not because of water cooling just as a change by BMW. So yes nothing to do with WC.

Can't argue simplicity but the boxer is air/oil cooled with a duel oil pump and thermostat to control the oil flow to the oil cooler. Trade one for the other, maybe they'll use both, time will tell.
Hopefully they'll maintain the boxer engine look and not turn it into a block of aluminum.
 

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05Train said:
Water cooling isn't a prerequisite to having a wet clutch (Harley has them). That said, a wet clutch would be a welcome addition.

The issue I have with water cooling is that it's one more system to break down, and it complicates taking things apart. There's a beautiful simplicity to air cooling that I prefer on a motorcycle, in spite of all the practical advantages that water cooling offers.
A Wet clutch? One of the reasons I wanted a RT is that it has a DRY clutch.
As a trucker for the last 25 years, I love the way it shifts, match the revs and shift, No clutch required! There is a reason a truck transmission runs over a million miles with out repair, I have driven two of my own Peterbult"s 1.2 mill, and 1.5 mill with out a clutch or engine rebuild.
 

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Skidmarc said:
It also seemed wrong to water cool a Porsche, but I'd never go back...

It's all about emissions, mostly noise but also breathable stuff.

Water jackets are great noise absorbers.

If it has a wet clutch it's because BMW is finally addressing spline problems.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Seems the "what will we get" is as big a question as "when will we get it?"

The WC is inevevitable and sorry to say to the pureists that the thought and change to a water-cooled boxer just doen't bother me at all. In fact, I just can't wait.

I can do without the espresso/coffee maker.

Sorry New2RT, I expect a wet clutch, but I could be wrong. It just makes sense considering the cost/weight compared to a transmission integrated with the engine case.
my preference is a seperate transmission case with a wet clutch).

I've heard several comments like Beechs' that we'll se the GS next year and the RT the year after. Is there some rationale behind that belief? If BMW has the engine ready why not update both models at once? It's not like BMW can't handle introducing more than one new model the same year. What am I missing in this "one at a time" rationale? The only reason I could see for delaying a WC RT would be trying to" market" RT riders over to GTL market. That doesn't make sense to me since BMW has already committed to a WC boxer .
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Hey BMW, I don't want to wait two more years for a WC RT. Do it before Honda does aserious update to the Wing or 1300.
 

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JonfromCB said:
I've heard several comments like Beechs' that we'll se the GS next year and the RT the year after. Is there some rationale behind that belief?
Rationale is that's the way they did it with Hexhead, i.e. R1200GS appeared in 2004, RT, etc., in 2005.

This is reflective of limited engineering/development resources and desire to limit concentration rather than spread it too thin. GS probably provides most rugged "user testing" as well, probably a customer base more tolerant of failures, and it is, of course, the best selling model.
 

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JonfromCB said:
Seems the "what will we get" is as big a question as "when will we get it?"

The WC is inevevitable and sorry to say to the pureists that the thought and change to a water-cooled boxer just doen't bother me at all. In fact, I just can't wait.

I can do without the espresso/coffee maker.

Sorry New2RT, I expect a wet clutch, but I could be wrong. It just makes sense considering the cost/weight compared to a transmission integrated with the engine case.
my preference is a seperate transmission case with a wet clutch).

I've heard several comments like Beechs' that we'll se the GS next year and the RT the year after. Is there some rationale behind that belief? If BMW has the engine ready why not update both models at once? It's not like BMW can't handle introducing more than one new model the same year. What am I missing in this "one at a time" rationale? The only reason I could see for delaying a WC RT would be trying to" market" RT riders over to GTL market. That doesn't make sense to me since BMW has already committed to a WC boxer .
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Hey BMW, I don't want to wait two more years for a WC RT. Do it before Honda does aserious update to the Wing or 1300.
Not sure what you're sorry about. They showed the engine, transmission, and clutch in the BMW magazine.
The transmission is a bolt on like it is now and it does have a wet clutch.
Transmission to be built in China, that's the rumor anyway.

They seem to use the GS as a beta, same when they went to the cam head.
It will also have radial front brakes.

If my wife grows tired of riding, doesn't look that way, the WC GS would be at the top of my list.
 

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Risky said:
A Wet clutch? One of the reasons I wanted a RT is that it has a DRY clutch.
As a trucker for the last 25 years, I love the way it shifts, match the revs and shift, No clutch required! There is a reason a truck transmission runs over a million miles with out repair, I have driven two of my own Peterbult"s 1.2 mill, and 1.5 mill with out a clutch or engine rebuild.
It's not a truck, it's a bike. I do a lot of parking lot rodeo stuff, as well as a fair amount of riding in traffic. A wet clutch is brilliant in those situations, as they're damn near impossible to kill.
 

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They can toss the WC and the wet clutch as far as I'm concerned BUT I have to wonder why they haven't gone to self adjusting valves since we are in the 21st century. The RT makes plenty of power, so I wouldn't think routine valve adjustments are gonna make that much difference....
The advantage to WC over oil/air is emission driven and the only real benefit is more consistant power delivery (no fade as it warms). Just thinkin out-loud
 

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Discussion Starter #20 (Edited)
lkchris said:
Rationale is that's the way they did it with Hexhead, i.e. R1200GS appeared in 2004, RT, etc., in 2005.

This is reflective of limited engineering/development resources and desire to limit concentration rather than spread it too thin. GS probably provides most rugged "user testing" as well, probably a customer base more tolerant of failures, and it is, of course, the best selling model.

Hopefully they won't do things in 2013 the same way they did 9 years earlier for either
reason: a. because that's the way they did it last time, or b. because they still don't
have the engineering and/or development resourses.

Consideing the rate at which they've been introducing new models the last few years
I would think a better rationale for a model year delay would be normal model life
cycle. One thing is for sure. They only have limited time to meet EU polllution standards.
 
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