BMW Luxury Touring Community banner

1 - 20 of 29 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
786 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I am looking to see how often you have found it necessary to adjust the valves between 6k and 60k miles, and were they any that were more than 1 or 2 thousandths out? Is there a point where it is not that likely they need further adjustment? Thanks!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,404 Posts
Valves settle in?

yechave said:
I am looking to see how often you have found it necessary to adjust the valves between 6k and 60k miles, and were they any that were more than 1 or 2 thousandths out? Is there a point where it is not that likely they need further adjustment? Thanks!
I had several intake valves that were slightly out of spec (tight) at my 60K inspection.

I don't think you can rely on them not changing after a certain mileage, if that's what your thinking. Are you hoping that you won't have to check them after a certain mileage? Personally, I wouldn't risk doing that, checking according to BMW's recommended intervals is probably a good idea.

I have checked mine according to the recommended sched and have never had one that was far off. IIRC none were ever too loose, always on the tight side, and were brought into spec by going to the next thinner "bucket".
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,836 Posts
Wayne ,

Last winter Jan. of 07 I set all I & E valves at the loose end of spec. By August of 07 and 24K later a recheck revealed 0 change. Yesterday I checked the valve spec still no change. The odometer has over 130K and My spec did not budge in over 34,000 miles.
Seems to be stable, I will check at 24K intervals, 12K intervals come to soon.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
588 Posts
I think on my 137,000 mile 2000 K1200LT, the valves were adjusted early on by my dealer at maybe at 6,000 or 12,000 miles. I then checked them myself at 12,000 and eventually 20,000 mile intervals and they never needed adjustment. But I think that is not the norm.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
7,795 Posts
I have 28k with no adjustments required.. still "in spec" across the board.

Now, I do not "high rev" without a load on the engine... do not do WOT just to hear it "sing".... no "throttle blipping".... etc... not that this type of activity damages the bike... just part of how I operate my bike.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
259 Posts
Valve Adjustment

When I had my first valve check, the technician commented that it appeared to him that I did not ride the bike hard.

I asked him how he could tell and he explained that all the valves were in spec and as long as I continued to ride conservatively, i.e., no burn-outs, wheelies, stoppies or jack-rabbit starts, I could pretty much expect the valves to remain in spec for the duration.

FWIIW
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,193 Posts
I did a valve adjustment on five valves for the first time at about 125k and none were more than a thousandth out of spec. I find this simply amazing. I have owned VW's Porsches and plenty of motorcycles that would not go more than 3k without adjustment.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
786 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I ride very conservatively. While I have no idea what services have been done, the original owner towed a trailer and I would assume he put on the most miles and I hope did the valves when suggested. I am about the fourth owner from what I can tell. The last guy had it for six months and did very little service.

It has 42k now. I intend to take it apart come spring (probably will have another 1500 miles on it by then) and change the fuel and air filters, charcoal canister (as a precaution, and don't want to remove it), check the vacuum hoses,install wiring for aux lights (not sure what yet), make or buy a mount for the Magellan Crossover to go on the Stingray or get the Copilot shelf (anyone has a used one PM me please), & change both shocks. The motor sounds good and runs really well. We will have around $10k in this at this point.

I did not want to take it apart to check the valves to find it then needed to go to the dealer anyway to adjust them. Don't need the expense and did not want to deal with the long wait to get an appointment. I never had to adjust the valves on any other bike I owned, that I can recall.

Greatly appreciate the replies. I feel a bit more confident believing it should be good for at least another 12k before I check the valves. If I last that long, I will be pleased.

Thanks!
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,882 Posts
yechave said:
I did not want to take it apart to check the valves to find it then needed to go to the dealer anyway to adjust them. Don't need the expense and did not want to deal with the long wait to get an appointment. I
Beleive me, if you get as far as checking the valves, you are almost there. I have done it, and I am no grease monkey. All you then need to calculate is what size buckets you have in there, what you need in there and put the new ones in. Very little expense compared to what you will be spending if it all goes pear shaped.
Mind you, has anyone know of a damaged engine because their valves were not checked?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
3,180 Posts
When I talked to my Service Manager on this topic and expense at 12,000 he said do not worry about it. At 12,000 we will go over it and listen with a stethoscope and if it sounds fine go to the 18,000 and do it then.

This is why I like this Dealer because he also feels the BMW maintenance schedule is aggressive, and believes that listening, checking the fluids well when drained, visual inspection, and how I feel the bike is running a better gage of maintenance. He told me flat out he will do what he feels in his opinion needs done, and if breaks in warranty, he will fix it, period.

I would think the biggest issue, that I was not aware of until someone on this Forum posted is the LT valves wear tight.

Now a loose valve you can hear pretty well.

I am not totally sure of what symptom (s) of a tight valve would be?

What, combustion wise, would a tight valve create?

I assume that a tight valve is one that is dropping farther into the cylinder, thus getting closer to being able to strike a piston?

I want to get the first one out at the dealer, but from then on I would like to do it. As others have said 12,000 is pretty quick and I sure can live with 18-24,000 checks if it seems safe to do so.

I guess on a used bike you have to do it once to see where you are as a point of referance anyway.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
12,165 Posts
LAF said:
When I talked to my Service Manager on this topic and expense at 12,000 he said do not worry about it. At 12,000 we will go over it and listen with a stethoscope and if it sounds fine go to the 18,000 and do it then.

This is why I like this Dealer because he also feels the BMW maintenance schedule is aggressive, and believes that listening, checking the fluids well when drained, visual inspection, and how I feel the bike is running a better gage of maintenance. He told me flat out he will do what he feels in his opinion needs done, and if breaks in warranty, he will fix it, period.

I would think the biggest issue, that I was not aware of until someone on this Forum posted is the LT valves wear tight.

Now a loose valve you can hear pretty well.

I am not totally sure of what symptom (s) of a tight valve would be?

What, combustion wise, would a tight valve create?

I assume that a tight valve is one that is dropping farther into the cylinder, thus getting closer to being able to strike a piston?

I want to get the first one out at the dealer, but from then on I would like to do it. As others have said 12,000 is pretty quick and I sure can live with 18-24,000 checks if it seems safe to do so.

I guess on a used bike you have to do it once to see where you are as a point of referance anyway.
Tight valve clearance is only a couple thousandths, so has no bearing whatsoever on valve to piston clearance. Tight exhaust valves however, can cause premature burning of the valve/seat, which when started will cause valve work to be needed far ahead of normal, which is probably well in access of 250,000 miles if kept adjusted properly.

The reason is that all solid lifter cams are ground with "clearance ramps" which take up the normal clearance fairly slowly until all the clearance is out, then rapidly open the valve. That is to reduce both impact damage and noise. If the valves are allowed to run below normal clearance range, the valve starts to open slowly (relative) on the clearance ramp before being opened on the fast opening ramp. This slow opening causes hot exhaust gasses to blast through the tiny gap at ultransonic speed for much longer than in normal valve opening, and that starts to erode the seating surfaces. Those very tiny, microscopic size erosion pits then fairly rapidly enlarge until you have a noticeable valve leak, which progresses quickly to badly burned valves and seats requiring a valve job.

The valves and seats in the LT engine must be pretty darned robust though, becausee for the several years I have been on this site, I don't recall anyone requiring a valve job! Maybe because we usually preach "don't let your valves run tight!", and most heed the warnings.

Loose valves are not as much of a problem, but on the LT engine (or any cam over valve design) the normal pattern is for them to wear tight, not loose.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,681 Posts
Checked them myself at 12K and 24K, they have barely moved but still in spec.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
3,180 Posts
Thank you VERY much on that explanation.

I was assbackwards.

I understand now that it is the valve not opening enough. And because of the overhead cam on the buckets wearing on the buckets not opening the valve to it's full throw. Which how far is that in one of these? I mean how far doest the valve open into the cylinder?

I also now see how the valve seats would wear by not allowing the full fill by the valve being short, and I would think on exhaust not allow all the spent gasses out, and overheating that seat. Intake I think would be poor gas mileage, not getting proper air fuel mix, and dropping the gas out of suspension.

Also I see it would seem to depend on which valve, exhaust or intake as to how it would affect combustion.

Seems pretty complicated on a 4 valve a cylinder bike. It also confirms to me that a proper valve check will be the ONLY way to know.

Again I thank you for the education it is valued, and helps me grasp the mechanical aspects of this motorcycle.



dshealey said:
Tight valve clearance is only a couple thousandths, so has no bearing whatsoever on valve to piston clearance. Tight exhaust valves however, can cause premature burning of the valve/seat, which when started will cause valve work to be needed far ahead of normal, which is probably well in access of 250,000 miles if kept adjusted properly.

The reason is that all solid lifter cams are ground with "clearance ramps" which take up the normal clearance fairly slowly until all the clearance is out, then rapidly open the valve. That is to reduce both impact damage and noise. If the valves are allowed to run below normal clearance range, the valve starts to open slowly (relative) on the clearance ramp before being opened on the fast opening ramp. This slow opening causes hot exhaust gasses to blast through the tiny gap at ultransonic speed for much longer than in normal valve opening, and that starts to erode the seating surfaces. Those very tiny, microscopic size erosion pits then fairly rapidly enlarge until you have a noticeable valve leak, which progresses quickly to badly burned valves and seats requiring a valve job.

The valves and seats in the LT engine must be pretty darned robust though, becausee for the several years I have been on this site, I don't recall anyone requiring a valve job! Maybe because we usually preach "don't let your valves run tight!", and most heed the warnings.

Loose valves are not as much of a problem, but on the LT engine (or any cam over valve design) the normal pattern is for them to wear tight, not loose.
 

·
Wrencher Extraordinaire
2005 K1200LT
Joined
·
14,559 Posts
LAF said:
Thank you VERY much on that explanation.

I was assbackwards.

I understand now that it is the valve not opening enough. And because of the overhead cam on the buckets wearing on the buckets not opening the valve to it's full throw. Which how far is that in one of these? I mean how far doest the valve open into the cylinder?
You still are a bit Lee. The valve seat is what wears on the LT not the bucket. As the seat wears the valve stem is now "approaching" the bucket and if close enough it will not fully seat - thus burn more valve seat away. That is why the valves wear tight rather than loose.

Think of it as the valve is not closing enough. Hope this clears it up.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
3,180 Posts
jzeiler said:
You still are a bit Lee. The valve seat is what wears on the LT not the bucket. As the seat wears the valve stem is now "approaching" the bucket and if close enough it will not fully seat - thus burn more valve seat away. That is why the valves wear tight rather than loose.

Think of it as the valve is not closing enough. Hope this clears it up.
Got it................ :eek:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
533 Posts
Still good.

Had my 99 LT checked at 50,000 miles and still good. No adjustment needed
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
3,180 Posts
rab1967 said:
Had my 99 LT checked at 50,000 miles and still good. No adjustment needed
Have you owned it since new?

I ask because I wonder if in it's life it had them checked or adjusted?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
533 Posts
2nd Owner

I'm the second owner, but I called the shop that sold the bike to the original owner, Bob's BMW, and they went over the service records with me. Other then fluids, filters and some of the normal wear and tear stuff, that's all that been done to the bike.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
3,180 Posts
That is great and encouraging news for sure.

Good for you.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,424 Posts
Unless Raffy had to do a bucket swap on old Red Rover before he sold her to me, mine were in spec until we went down in September at 124k miles.
 
1 - 20 of 29 Posts
Top