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Discussion Starter #1
I'm just doing some prep. work for our upcoming tech. session and have been reviewing the old threads. There has been quite a bit of discussion about documenting this procedure - step by step but I haven't seen it posted anywhere. If it has been posted can someone point me in the right direction?

From the service manual there are several steps to removing the slave cylinder. Are all of these steps necessary? It seems to me that the manual normally makes things a little more complicated than necessary. Where are the short cuts?

1. Remove left fairing section, battery cover and spoiler.
2. Remove right and left front and rear footrest plates.
3. Remove the exhaust system.
4. Remove rear caliper and inductive sensor.
5. Remove rear wheel.
6. Remove rear wheel drive unit.
7. Remove Swing Arm.

I know that steps 4, 5, 6 and 7 are necessary but what about the first three?

Thanks for your help.
Kevin
 

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kevincook said:
I'm just doing some prep. work for our upcoming tech. session and have been reviewing the old threads. There has been quite a bit of discussion about documenting this procedure - step by step but I haven't seen it posted anywhere. If it has been posted can someone point me in the right direction?

From the service manual there are several steps to removing the slave cylinder. Are all of these steps necessary? It seems to me that the manual normally makes things a little more complicated than necessary. Where are the short cuts?

1. Remove left fairing section, battery cover and spoiler.
2. Remove right and left front and rear footrest plates.
3. Remove the exhaust system.
4. Remove rear caliper and inductive sensor.
5. Remove rear wheel.
6. Remove rear wheel drive unit.
7. Remove Swing Arm.

I know that steps 4, 5, 6 and 7 are necessary but what about the first three?

Thanks for your help.
Kevin
We have done 4 or 5 now without doing the first three steps. It takes a little patience and finagling to get the swing arm out, but the time is far less than doing everything you have to do to get the exhaust system out.

You do remove the right side fairing piece in front of the right side case to get to the bottom rear shock bolt easier.

Hopefully you won't run into an EXTREMELY tight swing arm pivot bolt, which has happened on two occasions. Usually they are tight, but do pop loose with a 1/2" pull handle on a 30 MM socket. We have had two REALLY tight ones though, Ken had one on Coni's bike, and we had one on a bike here in SoCal. Took a 4 foot pipe on a 1/2" pull handle, thougt we were going to break the pull handle, but it finally let go with a BANG.

If you have a source to borrow one, get a 3/4 drive pull handle and socket.
 

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As Dave noted, steps 1-3 are not required. I did remove the exhaust for one bike and it was a lot easier to get the swing arm out. It did mean a little extra work and there is always the risk of breaking or stripping a header bolt which could turn a simple job into a PITA.
 

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David and Michael have you covered. I have two more comments though.

On Coni's bike, the swingarm bolts were previously put on with generous use of red loctite. We actually stripped the threads getting one loose, and had to replace the pivot bolt and have the swingarm retapped by a local dealer. It could easily have left her bike disabled until a new swingarm was ordered.

Also, you don't have to remove the exhaust, but it does help to remove one of the bolts (from the left footrest plate, I think). You'll see it as the one bolt that is in the way when you try to get the swingarm out. On the way out, you can pull the whole drive shaft, then rotate the swingarm out right (longer) side first. On the way back in, it is difficult to get the driveshaft fully seated with the swingarm in place. We ended up putting the swingarm mostly into place (shorter side first), then sliding the driveshaft in and grabbing the front u-joint with a couple of fingers to guide it onto the tranny output shaft. Once it is lined up, give it a good whack with a soft mallet or a block of wood and be sure it seats fully onto the tranny shaft and that you feel the front snap ring click into place on the shaft. If you don't feel it click into place, the driveshaft will work its way loose, and can easily damage itself and the tranny shaft as it slips backwards while under power. After it is fully seated, then rotate the swingarm into place and secure it with its pivot bolts.

Hopefully, the manual and previous pics will help explain what I'm referring to, as will direct experience once you get everything apart.

Good luck, and let us know how you get on.
 

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meese said:
--------------On Coni's bike, the swingarm bolts were previously put on with generous use of red loctite. -------------------.
That is a good reminder. DO NOT use Loctite on the swing arm and final drive pivot parts! Seems that some severely misguided BMW mechanics insist on using Loctite on everything. The service manual does not specify Loctite on these parts, and it should not be used. If it was used previously, not only is there a danger of stripping something, the Loctite has to be completely removed from the housing and pivot studs in order to get the proper light torque setting on the pivots before tightening the locking ring. You have to be able to spin the pivots in with two fingers, or you cannot get a correct torque reading.
 

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dshealey said:
That is a good reminder. DO NOT use Loctite on the swing arm and final drive pivot parts! Seems that some severely misguided BMW mechanics insist on using Loctite on everything. The service manual does not specify Loctite on these parts, and it should not be used. If it was used previously, not only is there a danger of stripping something, the Loctite has to be completely removed from the housing and pivot studs in order to get the proper light torque setting on the pivots before tightening the locking ring. You have to be able to spin the pivots in with two fingers, or you cannot get a correct torque reading.
Not only is loctite not specified, it flat is not neccessary. The last slave I helped with we needed to loosen up the swing arm when we noticed the flexible boot was not fully seated and couldn't get at it. We had properly torqued the pivots and were surprized how hard it was to loosen them. In fact, there is a warning in the manual that mentions the possibility of very high torque to break them loose. They stay put by design without the help of loctite.
 

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Swingarm

One extra caution; Do NOT try to use a 12 point socket. You need a 6 point Impact socket or the socket will break, stipping the cornres on the pivot hex.
 

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I did find it helpful to warm up the swing arm studs that were "hard to break" by heating them with a propane torch on LOW FLAME.
 

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Discussion Starter #9 (Edited)
I noticed that after removing the swing arm the manual says to siphon off the clutch fluid.

1. What is the correct procedure for doing this and how much fluid do we need to siphon off? Do we empty the system?

2. The manual also states to drain the final drive before removing it. Is this necessary?

3. What is the Optimoly MP3 used for coating the splines? Do I need to pick this up at the BMW dealer?

4. Also it says to coat the inner and outer sealing surfaces of the flexible gaiter with Staburags NBU 30 PTM. What should I use here?

Thanks,
Kevin
 

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kevincook said:
I noticed that after removing the swing arm the manual says to siphon off the clutch fluid.

1. What is the correct procedure for doing this and how much fluid do we need to siphon off? Do we empty the system?
It is best to siphon out the fluid from the master cylinder, and have paper towels or something to catch the fluid that will come out of the line when you disconnect it from the slave cylinder.
2. The manual also states to drain the final drive before removing it. Is this necessary?
I have never done that, just be sure you keep the unit relatively upright, such as placing it in a small cardboard box or something to keep if from turning over and spilling oil out the vent.
3. What is the Optimoly MP3 used for coating the splines? Do I need to pick this up at the BMW dealer?
BMW is selling a new lube now, and this is what we have used in the last few tech parties here in CA.
http://ascycles.com/detail.aspx?ID=2657
4. Also it says to coat the inner and outer sealing surfaces of the flexible gaiter with Staburags NBU 30 PTM. What should I use here?
I have never put anything on them.
Thanks,
Kevin
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Thanks David,

If someone isn't going to replace the slave cylinder do we need to disconnect the pressure line in order to get the slave cylinder out or is there enough slack in the line to leave it connected?

Kevin
 

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kevincook said:
Thanks David,

If someone isn't going to replace the slave cylinder do we need to disconnect the pressure line in order to get the slave cylinder out or is there enough slack in the line to leave it connected?

Kevin
Pretty sure there is enough slack in the lines. That would certainly save some time and effort, not to mention a little mess. :D
 

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Discussion Starter #13
OK, I ended up getting started on this project a little early. I'm considering it homework for our upcoming tech session, that and I noticed that my clutch fluid was a little low yesterday and I'm afraid to ride until I have investigated the problem.

I started tearing the bike down and managed to get to the point of removing the swing arm in just 45 minutes. Pretty straight forward.

The problem is that I can't get the swing arm out. There is a small "threaded insert" that is behind the left footplate that is in the way. I either have to drop the exhaust down which everyone says isn't needed. It looks like if I disconnect the driveshaft I can swing the driveshaft and swingharm out together. I can't figure out how to remove the driveshaft from the transmission. I'm assuming there is a clip somewhere but I can't see it.

What am I doing wrong?

P.S. it looks like I actually have enough room to remove the slave cylinder with the swing arm just pulled back but if it is going to come out easy from here then I'd prefer to do that.

Thanks,
Kevin
 

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kevincook said:
OK, I ended up getting started on this project a little early. I'm considering it homework for our upcoming tech session, that and I noticed that my clutch fluid was a little low yesterday and I'm afraid to ride until I have investigated the problem.

I started tearing the bike down and managed to get to the point of removing the swing arm in just 45 minutes. Pretty straight forward.

The problem is that I can't get the swing arm out. There is a small "threaded insert" that is behind the left footplate that is in the way. I either have to drop the exhaust down which everyone says isn't needed. It looks like if I disconnect the driveshaft I can swing the driveshaft and swingharm out together. I can't figure out how to remove the driveshaft from the transmission. I'm assuming there is a clip somewhere but I can't see it.

What am I doing wrong?

P.S. it looks like I actually have enough room to remove the slave cylinder with the swing arm just pulled back but if it is going to come out easy from here then I'd prefer to do that.

Thanks,
Kevin
You can get a screwdriver into the universal at the rear of the tranny and pry the joint off the splines of the tranny output shaft. There is a "circlip" spring wire that snaps into a groove to keep the shaft from "floating" to the rear, and when you re-assemble (reverse of removal, put the swing arm part way in, put the drive shaft through it) you have to insure you have popped the drive shaft fully forward so that the spring ring has snapped back into it's groove. Then finish installing the swingarm.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Thanks David.

I went out to the garage this morning before I left for work and tried as you suggested. The shaft came right off and the swing arm slid right out.

I'll drill the hole this afternoon and reassemble the bike.

Thanks,
Kevin
 

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OK. Here's another guy fully into this mess. Except I've got to replace a pressure line as well so I have to thread it from the front on back. Anyway, I've got everything apart except the right side swingarm 30mm nut. The left one came right out, but the right side is a bugger. I have the little snap rings out, but I noticed that there are 2 small holes drilled in the right nut, but not the left. Am I supposed to do anything in there to free this thing up before trying to remove it?
 

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kevincook said:
Thanks David,

If someone isn't going to replace the slave cylinder do we need to disconnect the pressure line in order to get the slave cylinder out or is there enough slack in the line to leave it connected?

Kevin
The lines are indeed long enough to remove the cylinder without removing them. I have tried reattached the lines before installing the cylinder just to make it a little easier to start the threads before tucking the little sucker into tranny. Worked fine (undecided whether it made the connection any easier but certainly long enough to make it possible).
 

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Sofitel505 said:
OK. Here's another guy fully into this mess. Except I've got to replace a pressure line as well so I have to thread it from the front on back. Anyway, I've got everything apart except the right side swingarm 30mm nut. The left one came right out, but the right side is a bugger. I have the little snap rings out, but I noticed that there are 2 small holes drilled in the right nut, but not the left. Am I supposed to do anything in there to free this thing up before trying to remove it?
No. Seems some have been overtightened, or a previous removal had someone put Loctite on it. Maybe heat the aluminum around the outside of the nut a little with a heat gun, or very carefully with a propane torch. Get it hot to the touch, but not so hot it burns you. If there is Loctite there (not supposed to be) that will loosen it.
 

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They dealer mechanic who did my clutch last week carefully explained to me that the swingarm threads were damaged from the pivot bolt being overtightened, and how there was no Loctite on the bolt either. He assured me that he put it together properly, using Loctite, of course. It was too late, so I let it go and just rode away. :(
 

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Discussion Starter #20
I'm in a holding pattern until after work today. I'm waiting for my buddy to finish machining the 30mm socket for me.

My slave cylinder was leaking and my new one arrived last night via UPS at 6pm. When I removed the old cylinder the fluid that drained out of the lines was a clear yellow. I was expecting red brake fluid. What is the yellow fluid? Is that a special BMW brake fluid?

So if I know that my slave cylinder was leaking but my clutch hasn't started slipping yet what does that mean? Will the clutch start slipping eventually or did I catch it in time? There was a little pool of fluid in the mounting boss when I removed the cylinder.

Thanks,
Kevin
 
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