[cwarren]

Hi all,

I'm in the market for a K1200LT (or alternatively a Goldwing - but I'm not as thrilled with that bike). There is a 2008 with 13k miles at a local dealer for $13,900. I don't believe there is a service history with the bike and I called another dealer to find out what could be found out about the service history without actual records. It seems that only in a specific scenario will I be able to find out what has been done on the bike. So, for this question, assume that I will not be able to figure out what, if any, service has been done to the bike.

The bike has passenger armrests which I want/like. No floorboards which I will likely buy from Darius(?) on this board. It has a comm system built in which I want/like. And a nav system which I like and would use but could take it or leave it. I don't believe it has anything else "extra". I may only keep it for a few months to take a long trip on and then sell it again (I have a 2001 Triumph Sprint ST but that is not great for two people touring). I realize these questions are all highly variable, but I just want the collective "gut reactions" from this board.

1. Is $13,900 "reasonable"?
2. The other dealer I talked to said there are issues with final drive, ABS, radio, and clutch(?) seal. He said each of those could run $1000-$2000 each. How frequent are these major problems (roughly) and (roughly) what might I expect over the short term?
3. What could I expect to resell it for in a few months with a few thousand more miles on it?
4. Would a 2009 or newer (with original and/or aftermarket warranty) be a better (necessary) choice? If so, what do the aftermarket warranties run generally?

Thanks in advance - as usual - the newbie apologizes for rehashing the same old sheet and I did search the board for some of these questions/issues.

Chris

 

[deputy5211]

OK price, but not a 'DEAL."

Aftermarket warrany is about $1500 +/- based on which level of plan, plan add-ons, and deductible amount. That's what I paid for my Interstate Diamond plan with 0 deductible for three years. Paid for itself many times over.

Depending on how good of a negotiator you are, maybe you could get dealer to include a similar plan if you buy at the asking price. That would be a deal. If dealer says he would lose money on that deal, ask to see his records for the purchase/trade of the bike. Worst he could say is no.

Remind him that any warranty work will be done by his shop, if local, and he will make a bunch more money on that to make up for it.

just my two cents... flame suit on... flame away!

 

[jackd]

If there is a BMW dealer near you take a look at what they have and price review prices accordingly. When I bought mine many years ago from a non-BMW dealer the local BMW dealer looked up the service history for me. I was a potential service customer. It would not hurt to ask. If they don't want to cooperate then try another dealer. I went back to that dealer to have the next service done and have an evaluation done after I purchased. That service department got my initial business and a warranty claim I had later. Bottom line is I was establishing business ties. My LT was only 18 months old with a few thousand on the ODO.

Price and condition comparisons are very difficult without close personal inspection. You have been looking for an LT and if you intend to purchase and resell quickly you should expect to take some portion of the use as your cost, unless, of course you buy it at less that current market. If there are no or not many LTs for sale you might turn it quick if you price it aggressively but the later in the season you sell the less likely it will sell, unless you are in a ride all year area. Your profile doesn't say where you reside but buying now would indicate that you are just coming into riding season.

If the LT has resaonable mile to year ratio and looks good , not abused, a season of use should not produce the kind of repair problems you are fearing. The ABS diagnostics run at every startup and the engine management software monitors the whole package. If you have someone with a GS911 that you can use to check the codes on the floor that should indicate a fairly solid start.

You could include a 'my mechanic' clause in your contract and take it to a BMW dealer for a code readout and evaluation. Ask the BMW dealer what they would charge. Can't hurt and if they don't want to cooperate then maybe you have one of those dealers that you don't want to be associated with and try for a GL...

 

[andres]

Chris,

$13,900 doesn't seem unreasonable. Remember that there is a 12,000mile service on these bikes, and if you can get the dealer to do the "12,000 mile service with annual inspection" it would be a good deal. The service with inspection will run more than $1,000 on its own. It involves changing all fluids, and I would suggest you specifically request changing coolant, brake fluid and clutch fluid.

The dealer comment about the issues with the FD, ABS, radio and clutch seal is probably valid, but these issues have been exaggerated a great deal. If any of these happens to you, it will be painful. But, I'm on my second LT and have not experienced any of these (yet). I've also had two R1100S's both with the servo ABS system and similar FD, and no problems there either. The most expensive item to replace would be the ABS unit. The way to avoid failure is to ensure the brake fluid is regularly replaced (every two years).

The prices fluctuate a little depending on the season, but there seems to be a market for used LT's. If you sell the bike within a few months with the mileage still below 20,000, you should be able to get close to $13,000 considering it has navigation and communication systems installed. However, you may be pleasantly surprised by the bike and decide to keep it.

Buying the last year of a particular model is normally good. These bikes underwent some changes in 2005 and were discontinued in 2009. Expect to pay $10,000+ for a 2005 in good condition and around $16,000 for a 2009 in good condition, and by good I mean with full service history and low miles. There is no difference between the 2005 and the 2009 models, although the 2005's typically do not have Xenon headlights. It seems these became popular from 2006, and chances are good the 2008 will have that. The choice of a particular model then boils down to mileage and what you are prepared to pay.

As far as aftermarket warranties go, I consider them a waste of money. Some people consider it similar to insurance. The bottom line is that these warranties are sold at a profit and somewhere someone is making money out of it. They make money from rumors and insecurity. Many things in life conform to the Pareto 80/20 principle, and I think these do too. So, for the insurers to make money there should be an 80% chance that the warranty never gets called up, which means there is an 80% chance you won't need the warranty. The list price for a new ABS pressure modulator is around $2,500. Good used units can be had for about $1,000. Compare this at a probability of 20% to the cost of the warranty at a probability of 100% and then decide.

There are pretty economical alternatives for repairing the FD and replacing the radio on this site, if you ever need that. My advice would be to not let the dealer comments about these failures influence your decision. Buying an LT with 13,000 miles gets you a bike that is not quite run-in but with at least another 100,000 miles of life ahead, it wouldn't have been a lemon, and any early failures have probable been taken care of already. If the 12,000 service was done and all fluids changed, the price isn't far off.

Good luck!

 

[cwarren]

Thanks for the advice! Turns out the bike is on consignment and is a 2006. I will use your input to help me decide my course and how to negotiate. If things go my way - soon I will be a full fledged lurker on this board.

Greatly appreciated

Chris .

 

[DanMartin]

Thanks for the advice! Turns out the bike is on consignment and is a 2006. I will use your input to help me decide my course and how to negotiate. If things go my way - soon I will be a full fledged lurker on this board.

Greatly appreciated

Chris .

Ahh, a Houstonian. Which dealer, Wild West or Gulf Coast? I might go as high as
$10,400 for an '06. I am on the west side of Houston, Hwy 6 at Beechnut, come on by.
I can bore you with LT info.

Dan Martin

 

[andres]

For a 2006 the price is somewhat high. But then the bike has the GPS and COMM system and low mileage, and you can expect to pay more for that. If the 12,000 service was done a fair price at the dealer would probably be below $13,000. But the price depends on the value to you. I recently bought a 2006 and was prepared to pay more since the bike had all the options I wanted. I had a 2006 before and have seen a few since, and yes there are 2006 bikes available as low as $10,000 but without service history, without the COMM, without GPS, without Xenon, without the duplicate keys, without owner manuals, etc., and probably neglected. My philosophy: If it comes with a full set of keys, both FOB's and all the owner manuals, there is a good possibility it belonged to someone that cared.

 

[Beemerick]

...I may only keep it for a few months to take a long trip on and then sell it again (I have a 2001 Triumph Sprint ST but that is not great for two people touring)

Chris, if you do buy it (or another LT), I would be willing to bet that you keep it longer than "a few months".

 

[Mikebeem]

Chris
You are collecting the information on this bike. You listed some of the problems. (beware)
Resale value (bad). To much for an 08.
You want a bike to ride and be next door to maintenance free. Keep doing your research
You will come up with the answer.

 

[gbob]

Chris
I an not able to pencil this plan out . Bikes are like diamond wedding rings in that they are worth far more when one is out to purchase than when selling one . BMW are a very small % of the market.
Buying one for a couple months costs =
Purchase price
sales tax
title / regristration fees
insurance for 1 year . most only write by the year
maintenance costs = small for a couple months
repair cost risks ? could be nothing or enough to make one sick , be an informed buyer
Get help checking one out , most people on this sight love to look at BMW's and most will help with information .
I must agree that after you own one you will become attached if you like motorcycles .

welcome to the asylum my friend !

addicted BMW owner Bob G

 

[Munmi]

You said consignment? Try a lowball offer. It worked for me. Seller was in a bind a was looking to unload.

 

[casualemt]

I can't imagine that you are dealing with a BMW dealer...BMW has a database that keeps records of all service done by BMW by vin number, and the service department gladly will look that up for you...secondly, it is hard for me to believe that a BMW dealer is going to forewarn you about all the big expensive repairs that are possible with the bike, unless the salesman is trying to steer you towards another bike (I guess?) lastly I have seen '05s going for less than 10K and can't imagine that an '06 is going to be that much better, as suggested above, try a lowball offer, you can always go up, but not down..My experience with the GW and the LT is the LT is a bike you become attached to for many reasons, and the ride is the best, the GW will do what you want to do, and you can just dump it when you are done, the LT is more like your favourite pet....who wants to get rid of their favorite pet?

 

[beatnickfly]

Geez, $13,000+ for a 2006?? I have my 2005 for sale at $8700, can't even get a nibble. 41,000 miles, every option except the armrests for the pillion. If I wanted armrests I woulda' bought a Barca-Lounger !!
Look it up in the MOA Flea Market ads.

 

[Rocketsled]

As a datapoint, my '05 was $9500...34k miles, two weeks before end of tax season/Xmas/fiscal records...it was a trade on a 1600 and had been sitting on the BMW dealer's lot for 120 days.

 

[cwarren]

Re: Pre-buy advice 2008 K1200LT - UPDATE

First of all, thanks for all the input! Secondly, I stopped getting email notices of your responses a while back so:

It appears that this bike is being sold by a widow (unsure how the owner died). The dealer said 2 of the 3 numbers he called were not in service. A little trouble getting a hold of the wife. He dropped the price $400 but would not go further. There was about $2500 in service done on the bike in the last two years: 12k service, tires, and rear rotor.

Overall - I probably should have waited, but my time right now is more important to me and it is in very good condition. Thanks again for all the help!


DanMartin - the bike is at GulfCoast.
Andres - See above for service. Not sure about keys or manuals though.
BeemeRick - I think that's a possibility too.
MikeBeem - I know I'm assuming some risk in re-sale, but I *really* like the bike.
GBob - I agree with your assessment.
Munmi - See above. I did give a lowball offer, but dealer would not move on his margin and couldn't get a hold of the owner. I got a little antsy and bought it anyway based on the service that had been done. I KNOW - bad negotiating!
Casualemt - The dealer who told me all the horror stories was a BMW dealer but not the dealer who had the bike (who is also a BMW dealer).
Beatnickfly - Maybe that means I'll have to keep it. : )

 

[deputy5211]

Re: Pre-buy advice 2008 K1200LT - UPDATE

I got a little antsy and bought it anyway

So you bought it, and everything else is moot, for now).

Congrats on your new ride. Enjoy it, and ride it like you stole it. Just remember that the red and blue lights behind you might be one of my troops! LoL

And try to always keep the front wheel pointed forward when braking, especially on uneven pavement let you want to join Droppers Anonymous!

 

[DanMartin]

Welcome to the group Chris. You're gonna love the LT.
Keep an eye on the South Central forum on this site. There are RTE's
and Tech sessions posted occasionaly. RTE on Apr 28th in the Hill Country

http://www.bmwlt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67123

There will be a tech session in late May or early June in west Houston.

Dan