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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I am selling my wife's 2001 BMW 330CI and received this message after several previous email questions. It seems like a scam, but once I have the money in my Paypal account and cash it out, how can I loose? I don't understand enough about Paypal to make a (POSITIVE) decision. Can Paypal charge me back? Seems too good to be true. Car has been for sale for 12 hours!

Actually had someone come by an hour ago to see and test drive the car. He wants to check the vin number for accidents and seems like he wants to buy it tomorrow... The car only has 65K miles...and is in great condition. New Audi in garage..

"Thanks for answering the questions. I am satisfied but can you assure me that i will not be disappointed if i buy this Vehicle. I'm ready to pay your asking price but not cash in person because I'm currently in a conference and calls are restricted at the moment and my only quickest payment option is PayPal, its safe fast and secure and i will be responsible for the PayPal transaction charges so you can get your expected amount. If you don't have an account with PayPal, its pretty easy to open one,Just log onto www.paypal.com and sign up. I hope we can make the purchase as fast as possible? As I am buying the vehicle for someone and I'm very sure he will love this vehicle, his a mechanic and a handy man, so if there is anything that need to be fixed in it just let me know he will handle it. I have a mover that will come for the pick up once payment clears in your account and he will handle the title for me.I look forward to hear from you with the information below."

"Your PayPal e-Mail Address :
Full name:
Firm Price:
Zip code for pickup:"
 

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I am pretty sure this is a scam, and I would not accept the money not give them my pay pal information. I think the way it works is after you give your pay pal account address, you will get an email saying there is money in your account, with a pay pal link. Unthinkingly you click on the link, sign in, and now they have your pay pal log in and account information. Only a few days later do you find out its all a scam. If you decided to do this, make sure you only log in to your account buy going to the pay pal log in site. DO not log in through any unsolicited link. It is a counterfeit web site.
 

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Dan, sounds like a probable scam...buying for someone else, no mention of title transfer or other paperwork, seller pays PayPal fee (not buyer). When was the last time you bought a vehicle sight unseen? You aren't opening yourself directly by providing your PayPal email and your name, but there could be an identity theft angle here. If you proceed, be careful of any follow on questions regarding account numbers or other personal info that might be exploited. And most certainly - wait until the money is firmly in your PayPal account before parting with the vehicle. In this case "caveat venditor" - let the seller beware!
 
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When someone says this "I am satisfied but can you assure me that i will not be disappointed if i buy this Vehicle."

RUN!!! Unless you plan on setting the buyer up with a warranty...
 

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Ubetcha....SCAM. My company advertises and sells used marine engines and drive components extensively on several web based sites set dedicated to both commercial and yacht customers. We get these types of PayPal scams on almost every sale....the buyer is always disposed somewhere and won't contact you directly but can have a truck or associate ready for pick up immediately. For us, it's either cash face to face or bank to bank wire x-fer. A friend/competitor of mine ran one of these scams to it's conclusion, allowing a immediate pick up an expensive marine gear (actually scrap iron in a crate) by a trucking company. The money did, in fact, show as "paid" on the PayPal account but was not released by PayPal and was almost immediately made "not available" by when foul play and stolen credit cards turned up on the buyer's side. The trucking company later told us the credit card they accepted turned out to be stolen. We've discovered scammers mine the internet for all sorts of marine goods and parts; much of which can be either quickly chopped or shipped out of the country. In the marine business, there's a huge market for the items in Eastern Europe and Baltic. Some years ago we were victim of a clever scam that cost us about 4K. I ended up in the local FBI office asking why they couldn't just go the ship-to address in Canada and trace down the bast....ds. They told me my loss was below their threshold for international crime. Then I said I bet if I put a bomb in the box that would blow off the head of the receiving SOB's then would that meet their threshold? I nearly go arrested on the spot and was told, "Sir, I'd suggest you not do that and if you mention it again you will be arrested and charged with conveying a threat (or something to that effect)." So much for justice for us working folk. Beware!
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Thanks for the follow up. Since I haven't used paypal on the receiving end, it was hard to figure out how "once I had the money" I could get scammed, but as I see it, I never would have really received funds.
 

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Definite scam. You do not need to have a PayPal account to receive a payment. The purchaser can send from his PayPal account directly to you via email. The URL mentioned in his email to you is fraudulent. Never open a link from someone you don't know.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Definite scam. You do not need to have a PayPal account to receive a payment. The purchaser can send from his PayPal account directly to you via email. The URL mentioned in his email to you is fraudulent. Never open a link from someone you don't know.
I'm not questioning you, in order for me to learn, how can I tell that the link is not legitimate? It seems ok, but I haven't tried to open it.
 

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If you're using Firefox as a browser, you might go back to your original email and right click on the paypal link. At the bottom of options, click "Inspect element" and a window will open at the bottom of the screen. This should show you if the link redirects you to another site, possibly a fake paypal site. As Bumboo pointed out, this scam is about the funds not clearing because the credit cards are stolen or fake. Even if the paypal link is okay, the rest of the scam would still work. Good advice from an old friend - "If the grass looks greener on the other side of the fence, be careful ~ it may be astroturf."
 
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Dan, if you scroll through the link Michael passed from the Paypal forum, you'll be surprised (maybe not) to find the exact wording of your prospective buyer in another scam.
 

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Trust your instincts brother. If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck more than likely its a duck.
 

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A neighbour just down the road was selling a travel trailer and he got an offer sight unseen from someone in France that wanted to vacation in Canada. He needed to have the trailer picked up and shipped to Calgary, about 3,000 km away, and everything was in a rush since he was coming to Canada in a week or two. He talked to another neighbour about it and they came to the conclusion that there must be trailers closer to Calgary so they just ignored all subsequent emails. He had advertised the trailer on Kijiji and apparently there are all kind of scams going for buying vehicles, electronics and other high value items. At the time they all seemed to involve Western Union payment or escrow services that nobody had heard of.

Gerhard
 

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Dan,

Been buying and selling on eBay and Craigslist for over 10 years bought and sold
3 cars and 3 motorcycles - took me about 2 seconds to recognize the dialog.
This individual will drag you into a place you will not want to go. Here are the
triggers that it is a scam - red text!!

"Thanks for answering the questions. I am satisfied but can you assure me that i will not be disappointed if i buy this Vehicle. I'm ready to pay your asking price but not cash in person because I'm currently in a conference and calls are restricted at the moment and my only quickest payment option is PayPal, its safe fast and secure and i will be responsible for the PayPal transaction charges so you can get your expected amount. If you don't have an account with PayPal, its pretty easy to open one,Just log onto www.paypal.com and sign up. I hope we can make the purchase as fast as possible? As I am buying the vehicle for someone and I'm very sure he will love this vehicle, his a mechanic and a handy man, so if there is anything that need to be fixed in it just let me know he will handle it. I have a mover that will come for the pick up once payment clears in your account and he will handle the title for me.I look forward to hear from you with the information below."

The red outlined text is standard language for scammers. And this email is just
the first of many in a very long chain that will at cause you at worse to loose
not only your money but the vehicle as well . . . RUN!! Or is you want report him
to eBay as a scammer - the official site to read up on eBay scams / warnings is:
eBay Security Center

One last recommendation - never accept funds from PayPal for very large
automotive transactions - it gives the buyer some very large advantages. eBay
and Craigslist are great places for hooking you up to sell autos and motorcycles
but as for financial transactions I would stick with CASH or Deposited / Approved
by your Bank Certified Checks.

My 2 cents . . .
 
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I'm not questioning you, in order for me to learn, how can I tell that the link is not legitimate? It seems ok, but I haven't tried to open it.
The URL for the link to paypal in your original post appears legit, but often a scammer will send a phishing email which will ask you to click the link, go to the bogus website, and enter personal info, including logons and passwords. Within seconds they are on the way to stealing your identity.
The following is from the Microsoft Security Center:

"Beware of links in email. If you see a link in a suspicious email message, don't click on it. Rest your mouse (but don't click) on the link to see if the address matches the link that was typed in the message. In the example below the link reveals the real web address, as shown in the box with the yellow background. The string of cryptic numbers looks nothing like the company's web address.

"http://www.microsoft.com/global/security/PublishingImages/online-privacy/ZA001141187.gif" If you click on the above URL, you get sent to the following URL.

https://192.168.xxx.xxx/wood/index.htm.


Links embedded in an email might also lead you to .exe files, which can go on to install malicious software on your computer."

Sounds like you dodged a bullet on this one, and everyone else's advice is right on.
 

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I agree with Dan, all deals are cash or Certified check. The last bike I sold the buyer made me wary for some reason. I only accepted his certified check after meeting him at his bank and watching him draw it.

Trust your instincts, if it feels funny don't do it.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
All good advise - THANKS...

Speaking of scams, watch out for "certified bank checks." I have a beautiful one, in color, embossed that looks perfect! I received it several years ago via Fed Ex for a motorcycle. It was approximately $400 more than my asking price with a request to refund the difference before completing the sale!

I knew the check wasn't legit because of the circumstances, but for fun, contacted the bank on the check and they told me it was counterfeit.

It's been a while since I've sold anything and this, new to me, Paypal scam almost had me. Just this morning I received 2 more simular email messages. One from Orlando and the other from Lost Vegas. I guess some must fall for it.

As always, this forum is frequented by the best knowledge base around....including a few bike riders...
 

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Good luck witht the sale Dan. It's sad that the world has become so "scammy" but it is what it is. Don't be afraid to tell a buyer that you want to see him draw the check at the bank.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
I received a $500.00 deposit in cash this morning from a legitimate buyer. I let him take the car and title because he said he would pay the balance on Tuesday.

Just kidding. I still have the car and title and he gets both on Tuesday when be brings the cash balance.

Next for sale ad will say to not bother me with Paypal....
 

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Good luck witht the sale Dan. It's sad that the world has become so "scammy" but it is what it is. Don't be afraid to tell a buyer that you want to see him draw the check at the bank.
There where folks selling bridges to innocent immigrants a 100 years ago. Today we have the internet that has just improved communications between the victim and scammer but they have always been with us.

Gerhard
 
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