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Nailed it my friend! We hear about improper shimming ad nauseum. Where was the production supervisor? How long does it take to put a sensitive torckwrench on the assembled drive & check. Improper shimming would show up instantly. My heritage is half German half Swiss...the other half I'm not sure...& I don't have a lot of tolerance for sloppiness. The workers that have been let into Germany need to be supervised or Honda etc will beat BMW to death. I feel a Chris Harris type rant coming on so thats my 2 cents.
That in my mind is why Honda quit making bikes in the US. Poor quality control. The infamous Goldwing frame failures come to mind along with many more issues created in Ohio. Not Japan.
 

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That in my mind is why Honda quit making bikes in the US. Poor quality control. The infamous Goldwing frame failures come to mind along with many more issues created in Ohio. Not Japan.
I wasn't aware of that. Thought they were still made here. I wish BMW well but they need to make some good engineering decisions.
 

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I wasn't aware of that. Thought they were still made here. I wish BMW well but they need to make some good engineering decisions.
Such as?
 

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Last I heard you had given up trying to educate me. Now your baaack. There is no sense to this banter that I can see?
Everyone deserves a second chance. :smile:
 
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What I have found by reading the 1600 forums is this. I have no intention of selling my LT.....bad FD or not.

I simply wish Honda could build the 1600 for BMW...:)
 

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What I have found by reading the 1600 forums is this. I have no intention of selling my LT.....bad FD or not.

I simply wish Honda could build the 1600 for BMW...:)
Some of the parts should have been farmed out to Japan. It is expensive to build in Germany & costs are being cut. So much is right with the 1600, shame they were not able to give it 100 percent.
 

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What I have found by reading the 1600 forums is this. I have no intention of selling my LT.....bad FD or not.

I simply wish Honda could build the 1600 for BMW...:)
Or BMW could design the Wing for Honda. :smile:
 

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Or BMW could design the Wing for Honda. :smile:
Looks like they did for the 2018 model. It has an LT windshield and a Transverse K bike front end.
 
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Looks like they did for the 2018 model. It has an LT windshield and a Transverse K bike front end.
True, but it still has 90s level specific HP, the fuel tank capacity of a sport bike and luggage capacity of a sport tourer. >:)
 

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I have not seen the new wing. Just reading what some of you guys are saying that have. Its somewhat disappointing. I want a true 2 up bike. Comfortable front and rear. Decent HP(to me in the 150 range is fine). LOW seat height, decent slow speed handling. I do NOT care about all the latest tricks and gadgets. Basically a updated yamaha venture royale would be GREAT. With the dependability that Jap bikes are known for.

I think Yamaha had the closest chance at succeeding until some MORON put that Harley want to be engine in it. Maybe they should notice harley can't sell the image and 1940's engine design any more.......

Wonder what the chance would be of Yamaha ever reversing course and putting a V Max engine in it?
 

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I have not seen the new wing. Just reading what some of you guys are saying that have. Its somewhat disappointing. I want a true 2 up bike. Comfortable front and rear. Decent HP(to me in the 150 range is fine). LOW seat height, decent slow speed handling. I do NOT care about all the latest tricks and gadgets. Basically a updated yamaha venture royale would be GREAT. With the dependability that Jap bikes are known for.

I think Yamaha had the closest chance at succeeding until some MORON put that Harley want to be engine in it. Maybe they should notice harley can't sell the image and 1940's engine design any more.......

Wonder what the chance would be of Yamaha ever reversing course and putting a V Max engine in it?
Yeah, that V-twin was a mistake alright. Kawasaki pulled a boneheaded move by not having cruise in the Concours 14. The new Wing should be a true 2 up bike Chris. It has 125 HP but a boatload of torque. The rest isn't to your specs though. I personally would like to see "luxury touring" come back. Beemer & the Wing have strayed trying to get the younger crowd involved in cycling.
 

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I have not seen the new wing. Just reading what some of you guys are saying that have. Its somewhat disappointing. I want a true 2 up bike. Comfortable front and rear. Decent HP(to me in the 150 range is fine). LOW seat height, decent slow speed handling. I do NOT care about all the latest tricks and gadgets. Basically a updated yamaha venture royale would be GREAT. With the dependability that Jap bikes are known for.

I think Yamaha had the closest chance at succeeding until some MORON put that Harley want to be engine in it. Maybe they should notice harley can't sell the image and 1940's engine design any more.......

Wonder what the chance would be of Yamaha ever reversing course and putting a V Max engine in it?
One can hope. Of all the bikes we sat on in Cleveland, the Venture was the nicest by far, but awful low for me and the archaic engine is a deal breaker for sure. Add a modern engine and this would be a sweet ride.
 

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Yes, its just hard to follow that marketing decision to stay with a twin....

If Harley can't sell the twin with its "lifestyle" image to boot I have a horrible time thinking anyone at Yamaha thinks they can long term. Put that V4 in it, just yearly upgrades and they had a bike that could have been sold for 10 years without major revision.

Even with all its faults including the FD issue and its obvious lack of maintenance ease I am finding myself not at all interested in getting rid of the LT. I am not buying a new bike that I don't feel is a upgrade across the board.

Voyager, I hope you had the chance to tell someone involved with Yamaha what monumental screw up that twin was. My dealer claims to have already sent it along with the cancellation of his order for two of the ventures. He told me may be forced to take them though as he is other bikes every year. its the price of keeping the dealership. His thinking was discount the $*%* out of them and get them off his floor if that's the case. His personal opinion was after this summer when the new wears off they will sit on the floor.
 

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Yes, its just hard to follow that marketing decision to stay with a twin....

If Harley can't sell the twin with its "lifestyle" image to boot I have a horrible time thinking anyone at Yamaha thinks they can long term. Put that V4 in it, just yearly upgrades and they had a bike that could have been sold for 10 years without major revision.

Even with all its faults including the FD issue and its obvious lack of maintenance ease I am finding myself not at all interested in getting rid of the LT. I am not buying a new bike that I don't feel is a upgrade across the board.

Voyager, I hope you had the chance to tell someone involved with Yamaha what monumental screw up that twin was. My dealer claims to have already sent it along with the cancellation of his order for two of the ventures. He told me may be forced to take them though as he is other bikes every year. its the price of keeping the dealership. His thinking was discount the $*%* out of them and get them off his floor if that's the case. His personal opinion was after this summer when the new wears off they will sit on the floor.
Well, as some of you know, I am the shy sort who tends to keep my opinions to myself, but I did share my thoughts with both Yamaha and Honda. :grin:

Personally, I got the impression that they really didn't care to hear anyone's thoughts at this time. And I can't blame them. The die has been cast for at least a couple years so unless the sales really suck, nothing is going to change right away.

I think Honda will sell lots of Wings for the first couple of years. Like the K1600, you will have current Wing owners who ride mostly solo who will like the smaller and lighter bike and won't be affected by the 28% loss in luggage capacity. And they will "suck it up" on the loss in fuel capacity just to stick with Honda. However, I think by year three they will be deeply discounting them to get sales. Much like BMW has been doing now for some time, or even skipping a year on the top-of-the-line Tour model as BMW has done with the Exclusive. I could have bought an Exclusive two years ago for $4,000 below MSRP. That has to be at or below dealer cost and the dealer said he is forced to take 1600s in order to get the other models that people want to buy. He hates them.

With the Venture, I will be surprised if it ever sells well. You will get the normal first year sales and maybe some cross over Harley riders, but I will be shocked if Yamaha sells enough to cover their development costs. I still think the side scoops look tailor made for radiators. Maybe Yamaha has some sweet new liquid-cooled engine in the pipeline that just wasn't ready in time to launch against the Wing, but that is wishful thinking at its best.

Like you, I can't see paying big $ to trade for a bike that in aggregate is less capable than my LT for my mission which is two-up, long distance, luxury touring. If I were a solo rider, I would consider a K1600 or the new Wing, but more likely would save some money and buy an RT or more likely an FJR. I test rode an FJR a few years ago when they finally added cruise control and it was a sweet ride ... for one person.
 

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Good morning...

I've been off this forum for a while. I have a 2000 K1200LT with 65K miles. The bike is currently at the dealer for a routine service. I have been informed I need a final drive rebuild. They did the "wheel shake" test.

I'd rather speak to "Saddleman" for an opinion and have him rebuild the drive if needed.

Can anyone send me his contact information?

Thanks in advance...

Kimble Neel
Phoenix, AZ

[email protected]
 

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Good morning...

I've been off this forum for a while. I have a 2000 K1200LT with 65K miles. The bike is currently at the dealer for a routine service. I have been informed I need a final drive rebuild. They did the "wheel shake" test.

I'd rather speak to "Saddleman" for an opinion and have him rebuild the drive if needed.

Can anyone send me his contact information?

Thanks in advance...

Kimble Neel
Phoenix, AZ

[email protected]
Kimble, you can find him on post #55 on this thread ( page 2 by my browser) and send him a PM. You have enough posts so sending a PM should not be an issue.

I would want to be sure that the wheel shake was not play in the pivot bearings and actually play in the crown bearing. If it is the crown bearing with wheel shake, your FD drain plug should have a bunch of flakes and possibly larger particles on it depending on how far it has progressed into failure.

I hope you don't live far from the dealer as if that bad, they go pretty quickly from there.

Good luck
 
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