BMW Luxury Touring Community banner

1 - 20 of 27 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
17 Posts
Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Hi I recently put a new battery on the bike and started right away. the bike has been sitting for about a month before I put the new battery. I took it for a ride and just around the corner from the house stalled, I try to start it back and it cranked a couple times and after the second try it stopped cranking. I jumped power from the battery to the starter junction under the seat and it cranks strong but it won`t run. I can hear the fuel pump running if I trigger the run switch on and off but I don`t know if there is any other thing I'm missing I can do before I take it to the dealer. Also checked both fuse boxes under seat, I don't see a starter relay and looks like the starter wire goes to a big aluminum box labeled BMW and DENSO, that I don`t want to mess with because it looks expensive, I did make sure that it is getting power from the battery. but I`m wondering if some of the criteria from some sensor needs to be met. Your ideas are very appreciated. By the way its a 07 with only 12k miles. Ricky.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,253 Posts
Hi I recently put a new battery on the bike and started right away. the bike has been sitting for about a month before I put the new battery. I took it for a ride and just around the corner from the house stalled, I try to start it back and it cranked a couple times and after the second try it stopped cranking. I jumped power from the battery to the starter junction under the seat and it cranks strong but it won`t run. I can hear the fuel pump running if I trigger the run switch on and off but I don`t know if there is any other thing I'm missing I can do before I take it to the dealer. Your ideas are very appreciated. By the way its a 07 with only 12k miles. Ricky.
Welcome Ricky, I am wondering about the state or your new battery seeing it cranked a couple times, then stopped cranking.

That being said, take a look inside your fuel tank and when you cycle the kill switch and hear the pump run, see if you see fuel swirling. If so, it is possible that you split the rubber lines inside the tank and even though the pump runs, you have no fuel pressure at the injectors.

Anything beyond that will take some deeper diagnostics but it is a start.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
17 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
You are right about that I opened the fuel cap and after switching the kill switch the fuel shot inside like crazy I will take it apart and fix that meanwhile lets do some thinking about the no crank deal. Remember that if I jump the starter it will crank very strong. Thanks a lot for your input there is a lot of experience and wisdom in this site. Thank you very much
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,253 Posts
You are right about that I opened the fuel cap and after switching the kill switch the fuel shot inside like crazy I will take it apart and fix that meanwhile lets do some thinking about the no crank deal. Remember that if I jump the starter it will crank very strong. Thanks a lot for your input there is a lot of experience and wisdom in this site. Thank you very much
If you don't use BMW parts, make sure that you get submersible fuel line and the clamps must be good and tight or they can pop off. I believe Lowes sells those crimp type single use clamps and the plyers. They are in plumbing for PEX type water lines, or you can put some good screw type inside.

Good luck.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,253 Posts
About the battery, check the voltage with a volt meter for a start and see if it is low. It could have gone bad or at the very least, be in a low state of charge. Take it with you to the auto parts store and get it load tested if the voltage is good. I suspect it is bad or very low if you can jump it and get it to crank.

Asking the group now. Does the 07 have a low voltage cut out to keep from fusing the starter relay?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
17 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
Fuel line repaired, (I own a auto repair facility) I jumped the starter and Bike runs perfect. I will check the starter switch to begin with. I don`t think is the battery because otherwise it would not crank if I jump it. Thanks a lot for your help if any ideas about the no crank issue I would appreciate it very much. I will keep posting as I get some progress with the no crank diagnosis. Once again thank you very much..
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,220 Posts
About the battery, check the voltage with a volt meter for a start and see if it is low. It could have gone bad or at the very least, be in a low state of charge. Take it with you to the auto parts store and get it load tested if the voltage is good. I suspect it is bad or very low if you can jump it and get it to crank.

Asking the group now. Does the 07 have a low voltage cut out to keep from fusing the starter relay?
To answer your Question:
According to a Service-Bulletin published in August-2001, ALL K1200LT starting with VIN ZD77402 or later, have the new so-called "voltage sensing" stater relay. This VIN would correspond roughly into JULY-2001 and later production for USA market.

Although not specified in same Service-Bulletin, my best guess is that it would correspond with intro of other changes in 2001 (for Europe) and 2002 models in USA when the IABS servos was introduced. it is common for BMW to do many of these changes / improvements together when a re-design or re-tooling of the assembly line is required.

Other earlier K1200LT (1998 to early 2001) may also have this blue colored starter relay if the retrofit kit was installed later (by them or the dealer).

Behavior for newer Relay is to just do nothing (not even a faint "click") when the voltage is below a certain threshold - hence you may think you have left the Kill switch in wrong position. Exact "low threshold" was never published by BMW, but some tests done by many owners seems to indicate a value between 11.2 and 11.8 volts. I have tried at 11.9 volts (static value after ignition ON) and the relay would trigger normally.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,253 Posts
Fuel line repaired, (I own a auto repair facility) I jumped the starter and Bike runs perfect. I will check the starter switch to begin with. I don`t think is the battery because otherwise it would not crank if I jump it. Thanks a lot for your help if any ideas about the no crank issue I would appreciate it very much. I will keep posting as I get some progress with the no crank diagnosis. Once again thank you very much..
You are welcome. Glad that part was an easy diagnosis/fix. I would still check and test the battery before anything else and then when it is running, make sure that the alternator is charging. Owning an auto repair facility, this should be easy stuff for you. :wink:

Good luck and keep us posted.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,253 Posts
To answer your Question:
According to a Service-Bulletin published in August-2001, ALL K1200LT starting with VIN ZD77402 or later, have the new so-called "voltage sensing" stater relay. This VIN would correspond roughly into JULY-2001 and later production for USA market.

Although not specified in same Service-Bulletin, my best guess is that it would correspond with intro of other changes in 2001 (for Europe) and 2002 models in USA when the IABS servos was introduced. it is common for BMW to do many of these changes / improvements together when a re-design or re-tooling of the assembly line is required.

Other earlier K1200LT (1998 to early 2001) may also have this blue colored starter relay if the retrofit kit was installed later (by them or the dealer).

Behavior for newer Relay is to just do nothing (not even a faint "click") when the voltage is below a certain threshold - hence you may think you have left the Kill switch in wrong position. Exact "low threshold" was never published by BMW, but some tests done by many owners seems to indicate a value between 11.2 and 11.8 volts. I have tried at 11.9 volts (static value after ignition ON) and the relay would trigger normally.
Thanks Sailor, I suspected that would be the case. I think Rick has a battery issue, either low state of charge or has gone bad.

I think he just set the world record for fixing the rubber lines inside a LT tank though :grin:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
17 Posts
Discussion Starter #10 (Edited)
I know. I did it right thru the fuel level sending unit port, the elbow hose was right there towards the top of the fuel tank on the right side. With the battery, I still think we have another issue because if I jump from the battery positive terminal to the starter it starts right away and it cranks very fast and strong. I'm wondering if the reverse control unit is bad since the starter wire comes from there and there is power to that unit from the start switch.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
17 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
DOES ANYONE KNOWS WHERE THE STARTER RELAY IS ON A 07 YEAR MODEL? IF IT HAS ONE THAT HAS TO BE THE PROBLEM I THINK
 

·
Wrencher Extraordinaire
2005 K1200LT
Joined
·
13,899 Posts
Not necessarily. Ooops I just re read your post. If you are making a connection on the bike from the + terminal and the starter tie point then there is something amiss with your relay. You may have missed the red wire that feeds the relay on the + terminal when you hooked the battery back up (easy to do). I thought you were using a jumper battery. So disregard from here to the end of this paragraph. If you are jumping it and it starts then the starter relay is fine. The reverser feeds the starter motor for reverse operation that is why you see a line from it to the starter tie point. There are two tie points behind the battery one is a ground tie point and the other is the starter tie point.

There are three big (10mm) black with yellow stripe wires from the reverser. One has a brown sleeve (ground tie point) Black sleeve (starter tie point) and one with a red sleeve (battery +). The out put of the starter relay also goes to the starter tie point, and of course, the wire to the starter.

The starter relay is inside the big electrical box under the fuel tank and it has a voltage sensor that will not engage the starter if the battery voltage is below about 11.3 volts. Usually these do not fail at least I have not seen one in the last 12 years here.

The pic is where the updated relay (blue) is on the older models.
 

Attachments

  • Like
Reactions: bmwcoolk1200

·
Registered
Joined
·
17 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
Thanks for the info. I guess I have to pull the gas tank out? I hear a click under the gas tank area every time I push the start button but no power at the starter tie point behind the battery. I'm almost certain that starter relay is bad. Thanks again for the info. I will post after I find out.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,253 Posts
Thanks for the info. I guess I have to pull the gas tank out? I hear a click under the gas tank area every time I push the start button but no power at the starter tie point behind the battery. I'm almost certain that starter relay is bad. Thanks again for the info. I will post after I find out.
Yep, I am with John. I thought you were jumping from another battery and not across battery to starter. Surprised you were able to replace the hoses inside the tank through the sensor tube opening but i have never tried it.

You will get this sorted out pretty quickly.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
17 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
Thanks a lot for all the help guys. I will try to find that starter relay tomorrow (if I have time). I spent a lot of time on the bike today and neglected the shop for most of the day trying to figure out this whole thing.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
17 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
Got it! After removing about 25,000 screws and zip ties (at least it feels like) found the relay in the box under the gas tank. Taped on it with the screwdriver handle and started cranking right away. Of course my local dealership here in tampa don't stock it so I ordered. $110.00 plus (ouch!!! ) but at least the headache is gone. Thank you all for the help.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,253 Posts
What a mess!!! All for a relay!!!
Well, it wasn't just a relay. You had 2 issues crop up at almost the exact same time. The fuel line split and your stater relay went bad.

While you have the tank off, I would give the air filter a check seeing you have to remove it and those 25000 screws to get at it.

If you don't know where that is yet, it is inside the air box. Remove the screws on the square cover on top of the air box and pull out the filter and check it. Mine is a re-usable K&N but yours will probably be paper. Only pic I have of the air filter but it is sitting on top of the cover for it beneath that blue rag.
 

Attachments

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,392 Posts
I started out with a K&N but ended up tossing it out last summer - still use them in my cars though... >:)
 
1 - 20 of 27 Posts
Top