[Gino]

Just finished up a clutch rebuild and am having a problem - hope someone here can help out.

Got it all buttoned up and off the lift, drained the clutch master (installed new slave) using still installed grub screw and pressing in that small decent to let it gravity drain. (Ran about three full master cylinders worth of fluid through it.)

Went until it drained clear HOWEVER now the clutch lever pulls in to about 1/2" from bar and clutch does not engage. That is, I can hard shift into 1st but when I try and pull clutch lever it's "hard" and does not disengage.

Any ideas?

 

[Voyager]

Just finished up a clutch rebuild and am having a problem - hope someone here can help out.

Got it all buttoned up and off the lift, drained the clutch master (installed new slave) using still installed grub screw and pressing in that small decent to let it gravity drain. (Ran about three full master cylinders worth of fluid through it.)

Went until it drained clear HOWEVER now the clutch lever pulls in to about 1/2" from bar and clutch does not engage. That is, I can hard shift into 1st but when I try and pull clutch lever it's "hard" and does not disengage.

Any ideas?

Since you installed a new slave, you need to get the air out. Gravity draining is great for a flush, but not so good for bleeding. Faster fluid flow helps move the bubbles. I replaced my grub screw with a normal bleed screw. I then bled normally by having my wife squeeze the clutch to the grip and then opening the bleeder quickly to let the fluid move briskly out. Close the valve, release the lever and repeat as normal. I repeated this several times.

Even then, the clutch barely disengaged. However, it was enough to ride the bike and after a few rides the clutch disengagement returned to normal. I think the vibration from the engine and road helped dislodge the smaller bubbles.

 

[bmwcoolk1200]

First thing we need to know is what year is your LT and what clutch parts did you replace and where did you get them. Some people manage to get the diaphragm spring in backwards but I think in that case, the clutch doesn't engage.

Matt, it sounds like the clutch handle does not compress all the way to the bar as it normally would even with air in the lines.

 

[Gino]

First thing we need to know is what year is your LT and what clutch parts did you replace and where did you get them. Some people manage to get the diaphragm spring in backwards but I think in that case, the clutch doesn't engage.

Matt, it sounds like the clutch handle does not compress all the way to the bar as it normally would even with air in the lines.

Thanks all...

Here's the details - 2002 LTC, 127k, I replaced clutch plate, spring, pressure plate, slave cylinder, slave pushrod, plus whatever else was required (rear main, bolts, trans seals, etc.). All parts are BMW originals.

And yes exactly - the clutch handle does not compress all the way to the bar.

I HOPE the spring is installed correctly - otherwise I'll be having a fire sale on this LT. Spring was installed such that it "domes" away from the front of the bike. (Crosses fingers). I REALLY don't want to tear this thing down agin....

I'll try bleeding again in the morning with fresh eyes....

 

[bmwcoolk1200]

Thanks all...

Here's the details - 2002 LTC, 127k, I replaced clutch plate, spring, pressure plate, slave cylinder, slave pushrod, plus whatever else was required (rear main, bolts, trans seals, etc.). All parts are BMW originals.

And yes exactly - the clutch handle does not compress all the way to the bar.

I HOPE the spring is installed correctly - otherwise I'll be having a fire sale on this LT. Spring was installed such that it "domes" away from the front of the bike. (Crosses fingers). I REALLY don't want to tear this thing down agin....

I'll try bleeding again in the morning with fresh eyes....

Do you happen to still have the part numbers you installed from the bags they were in? One other possibility is you have the wrong clutch plate ( thicker than original ) If the clutch plate is too thick, it draws the spring down too far and the slave push rod does not protrude far enough and you get the symptoms you describe because the slave cylinder tops out and can't push any farther to disengage the clutch. Do you remember how far you had to compress the slave to get the bolts tight? It should have been away from the case a little more than 1/4 of an inch and the screws draw it tight, compressing the slave cylinder as it goes.

 

[Voyager]

First thing we need to know is what year is your LT and what clutch parts did you replace and where did you get them. Some people manage to get the diaphragm spring in backwards but I think in that case, the clutch doesn't engage.

Matt, it sounds like the clutch handle does not compress all the way to the bar as it normally would even with air in the lines.

Yes, I misread his first post. Sounds more serious than air in the system.

 

[Gino]

Clutch plate was purchased from a board member more than a year ago so I can't verify part number (unfortunately packaging didn't make it through moving twice within that time).

I don't recall exactly how much the slave needed compression before getting tight, but 1/4" sounds about right.

Does it matter, on the slave, where the master cylinder connects versus the bleed hose? IIRC master is on "left" and bleed is on "right."

Looks like I'm going back in..... Thanks for all the suggestions.

 

[Voyager]

Clutch plate was purchased from a board member more than a year ago so I can't verify part number (unfortunately packaging didn't make it through moving twice within that time).

I don't recall exactly how much the slave needed compression before getting tight, but 1/4" sounds about right.

Does it matter, on the slave, where the master cylinder connects versus the bleed hose? IIRC master is on "left" and bleed is on "right."

Looks like I'm going back in..... Thanks for all the suggestions.

I don't think the hose attachment matters.

Did you take pictures during your assembly? That would help ensure that clutch spring is oriented correctly, etc. I am not sure about whether the pushrod can be put in backwards or anything like that. Sounds like it might be a disk thickness issue as was mentioned earlier.

 

[bmwcoolk1200]

I don't think the hose attachment matters.

Did you take pictures during your assembly? That would help ensure that clutch spring is oriented correctly, etc. I am not sure about whether the pushrod can be put in backwards or anything like that. Sounds like it might be a disk thickness issue as was mentioned earlier.

One other possibility is that the clutch disk is in backwards and the spring is impacting the longer side of the clutch spline center.

 

[jzeiler]

I would at least go in as far as removing the slave cylinder and make sure you have the rod in the correct way (see photo for reference). Also if it is all installed correctly the slave should be almost full seated with the bolts out, maybe less than 1/4 inch from the transmission boss. Air in the lines will not prevent the lever from going to the handle nor will a backwards clutch disk so my money is on the rod.

 

[shoswell]

My $0.02....

You have the clutch spring plate in backwards. Happens... (don't ask me how I know, but it wasn't my bike that it happened too)

 

[Gino]

My $0.02....

You have the clutch spring plate in backwards. Happens... (don't ask me how I know, but it wasn't my bike that it happened too)

Will be getting back into it this weekend to check... I could have SWORN I put in in correctly, based on the spacer ring, wear patterns, pictures I seen on the 'net, and the three beers consumed while contemplating it... :grin:

To clarify - the spring goes in with the domed face AWAY from the engine (like below)?

I'll post once I have the issue resolved - to be served as a warning to other as to what no to do!

 

[bmwcoolk1200]

Will be getting back into it this weekend to check... I could have SWORN I put in in correctly, based on the spacer ring, wear patterns, pictures I seen on the 'net, and the three beers consumed while contemplating it... :grin:

To clarify - the spring goes in with the domed face AWAY from the engine (like below)?

I'll post once I have the issue resolved - to be served as a warning to other as to what no to do!

Keep it to 2 beers until you get it back together. Unfortunately, this is more common than you would expect. Should be a piece of cake the second time around.

 

[Voyager]

Will be getting back into it this weekend to check... I could have SWORN I put in in correctly, based on the spacer ring, wear patterns, pictures I seen on the 'net, and the three beers consumed while contemplating it... :grin:

To clarify - the spring goes in with the domed face AWAY from the engine (like below)?

I'll post once I have the issue resolved - to be served as a warning to other as to what no to do!

Yes. Here is my assembly as I did the final check before installation. The engine side is the left side of this picture.

Don't forget to check the pushrod orientation also, although I can't imagine you could even install the slave if it was in the wrong way. Unless maybe if the spring was also backwards.

Take lots of pictures as you disassemble and then assemble again. I took hundreds during my clutch work and they proved very helpful. And measure your disk thickness in at least three equally spaced locations once you have it out again.

 

[shoswell]

To clarify - the spring goes in with the domed face AWAY from the engine (like below)?

Voyager has hooked you up with pictures. No crayons needed...0

 

[Gino]

Ok..... Got it down to pulling the slave..... Pushrod is in correctly.

With slave cylinder out, pulling in the clutch handle, I can see the slave strain against the c-clip and I get no movement from slave (I would assume I would be able to see a the slave move...) and handle is stiff.

Brand new slave.... Any ideas?

 

[Axle]

I think you would not get any movement in the slave when removed as the piston is fully out,, for it to work the piston would need to be in the cylinder maybe halfway to test.
that is why when you install the slave it doesnt but up against the gear box, you have to screw it back on in steps which forces the piston back into the slave

 

[Voyager]

Ok..... Got it down to pulling the slave..... Pushrod is in correctly.

With slave cylinder out, pulling in the clutch handle, I can see the slave strain against the c-clip and I get no movement from slave (I would assume I would be able to see a the slave move...) and handle is stiff.

Brand new slave.... Any ideas?

Do not squeeze th clutch lever with the slave out! You can easily blow the o-ring out and send brake fluid and parts everywhere. Trust me.

The pushrod pushes the slave piston into the cylinder. With the slave removed, an internal spring will extend the piston. Remove your pushrod and use it to depress the piston. I believe you can depress it readily by hand. That will tell you if the slave cylinder is froze.

Another thing you can do is measure how far past the slave mount flange the pushrod is protruding. I made such measurements on mine and can probably find that in my massive thread from last April/May for comparison. That will give you an idea if the clutch spring was inserted backwards.

 

[Gino]

I think you would not get any movement in the slave when removed as the piston is fully out,, for it to work the piston would need to be in the cylinder maybe halfway to test.
that is why when you install the slave it doesnt but up against the gear box, you have to screw it back on in steps which forces the piston back into the slave

I see...... my misunderstanding of how the slave works.

I can use the push rod to depress the slave manually and clutch handle to make it come back out. When reinstalling clutch slave to transmission there is no resistance to getting it in, so no spring pressure.

Looking like a spring in backwards, will be dropping the trans tomorrow and making it right.

I'm beginning to think the old girl has it out for me....the gear position switch actually disintegrated when I removed it this time..... to the web for a replacement!

 

[Voyager]

I see...... my misunderstanding of how the slave works.

I can use the push rod to depress the slave manually and clutch handle to make it come back out. When reinstalling clutch slave to transmission there is no resistance to getting it in, so no spring pressure.

Looking like a spring in backwards, will be dropping the trans tomorrow and making it right.

I'm beginning to think the old girl has it out for me....the gear position switch actually disintegrated when I removed it this time..... to the web for a replacement!

It is sounding like that is the problem. I will try to find a couple pictures to show another check you can make. My pushrod was about 9/16" inside the mounting plane of the slave. And the slave hit resistance from the pushrod when a little more than 0.2" from the mounting plane. Let me see if I can find those pictures on my iPad. If not, I will have to post them later when I get to my iMac.

I found the pictures, but the site refuses to let my iPad upload both together. It will take only one. This one is probably most useful to you.