Michelin Road 5 on the way. - BMW Luxury Touring Community
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post #1 of 77 Old Jan 2nd, 2018, 9:34 pm Thread Starter
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Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Well I just bought a set of the new Michelin Road 5 tires.

Not cheap at this point 405.00 for the pair Of course 30 of that is PA tax but it is what it is.

With -2 temps I will not be mounting or scrubbing them anytime soon.

Curios as to what other may find them at cost wise across the Country.

Pretty excited to try them out. Never road on Pilot Road 4's, I am currently running out Pilot Road 3's and love them.

I had been holding off on buying tires until I could find these.

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to me.

Happy New year to all you guys, though I am not buying you a set of Road 5's
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post #2 of 77 Old Jan 2nd, 2018, 9:55 pm
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

I found this for $395.00 at MotoSport
https://www.motosport.com/product?ad...=badger-street

or at Revzilla for $375.00
https://www.revzilla.com/motorcycle/...t-road-5-tires

These are not installed price, but I found a place that will mount tire to rim and balance for $25.00 each if you bring in just the rims.
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post #3 of 77 Old Jan 3rd, 2018, 5:51 am Thread Starter
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by prz42 View Post
I found this for $395.00 at MotoSport
https://www.motosport.com/product?ad...=badger-street

or at Revzilla for $375.00
https://www.revzilla.com/motorcycle/...t-road-5-tires

These are not installed price, but I found a place that will mount tire to rim and balance for $25.00 each if you bring in just the rims.
Motosport is a good price and includes tax. Not sure on Revzilla if that is tax included.

My Yamaha dealer mounts for 25 bucks also.

Thank you for looking. This may help others who wish to try these find good deals.

I would guess the next thing to look for is discounts on PR3 and PR4 if these Road 5 turn into the hot lick and everyone wants them. I will keep an eye out for that as closeout prices on tires is a good thing.

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post #4 of 77 Old Jan 3rd, 2018, 6:56 am
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Michelin never misses a chance to raise prices! I did NOT care for the PR4 series, but liked the PR3's a lot.

I have been running Bridgestone T-30's on the RT, with the exception of the Dunlop Roadsmart III's on it now. There is a new Bridgestone T-31 that I really like the looks of. Probably not any better than the old ones, but at over $100 per set less than the Road 5's I am going to have to see how the mileage does on the new Michelins. I could justify $350 if these would give me 9 or 10K miles on the rear tire........


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post #5 of 77 Old Jan 3rd, 2018, 7:36 am
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Have not checked prices on the PR5's yet but my local dealer usually gives me a brake off list and what I consider a fair price. Also, if you buy the tire from them they will mount them for $30 each. Items like tires I always buy from my local dealer since they treat me great and I want them there when I need them. He will always try to point me to any tire deals he has where I can save a few $$. I did jump on the deal that Dunlop had last year with the rebate on a pair of Road Smarts. I think with the rebate I got out the door for about $300 for the pair on my RTW.

Regarding the PR3's I tried to buy them a year ago for my '06 RT since I liked them so much but the Parts Manager said there was one he could no longer obtain. Not sure if it was the front or rear. So I just installed PR4's before selling it.

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post #6 of 77 Old Jan 3rd, 2018, 9:09 am
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

I don't skimp on tires but $205 for the rear for a PR5 is kind of pricey. The front size is not available yet for my 2012. At least on Riders Domain website.
I purchased a set of T30's evo gt's with free shipping for $234.
T30's are very good tires. I do plenty of riding (approximately 12,000/yr.) and I go through tires quickly. Just can't see spending that kind of money on a rear tire.
I always average out about 10,000 miles on a rear tire. Front tire usually doubles that. Not here to argue if one tire is better than the other it's just the price difference I can't justify.
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post #7 of 77 Old Jan 3rd, 2018, 11:31 am
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Not to rain on anyone's high expectation of these new tires. Please read the following from the Michelin website:

"MICHELIN Road 5 Standard versus the GT version

The above sizes of MICHELIN Road 5 tires are designed for naked bikes and roadsters such as the Triumph Street Triple and the Suzuki SV650.
Heavier grand touring bikes such as the BMW R 1200 RT or the Kawasaki 1400 GTR require the GT version of MICHELIN Road 5, which will become available in 2019. Until then please choose MICHELIN Pilot Road 4 GT tires."

Just saying. Use tires at your discretion.
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post #8 of 77 Old Jan 3rd, 2018, 12:24 pm
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by roadriderg View Post
Not to rain on anyone's high expectation of these new tires. Please read the following from the Michelin website:

"MICHELIN Road 5 Standard versus the GT version

The above sizes of MICHELIN Road 5 tires are designed for naked bikes and roadsters such as the Triumph Street Triple and the Suzuki SV650.
Heavier grand touring bikes such as the BMW R 1200 RT or the Kawasaki 1400 GTR require the GT version of MICHELIN Road 5, which will become available in 2019. Until then please choose MICHELIN Pilot Road 4 GT tires."

Just saying. Use tires at your discretion.
Good find!

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post #9 of 77 Old Jan 3rd, 2018, 1:22 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Yes I saw that.

If you look at weight ratings, 58 front, 73 rear, they are what every other tire fitment is for our bike.

The PR3 that I am currently running have no such distinction so no worries on this from me.

I often wonder if it is some kind of selling or cover your butt type of thing. Until the PR4 Michelin made no distinction.

I never ran a GT rated tire on the RT and probably never would. The factory Z8 makes no difference in load ratings along with many others.

I will say I never ride 2 up and if I did I think I would be sure to have a GT or a B or whatever heavy spec tire there is.

Since you have brought it up I think I will e-mail Michelin and see what they have to say.

I am not saying it is not important just that it is something I have never worried about because I never ride two up, or loaded up with gear very often anymore.

Thank you for bring it up as it is an important consideration to some.

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post #10 of 77 Old Jan 3rd, 2018, 2:45 pm
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

It may not have anything to do with load or speed ratings - it may simply be that they are a softer compound and will not provide the mileage expected of a tour bike that spends a lot of time on the interstates and highways.
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post #11 of 77 Old Jan 3rd, 2018, 3:15 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

So a call to Michelin says they will not fit a RT, but they will fit a GT.

I can not get a Tech to tell me why? Just a canned answer of it is not a recommended fitment for a RT.

I guess I will return them and buy another set of PR3's. I truly do love the PR3.

I am confused as to why I can run a PR3 with no issue, but I can not run a Road 5.

I am sorry for the confusion I have caused and unless you are like me and may be willing to run a Road 5 non GT you are gonna have to wait until 2019.

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post #12 of 77 Old Jan 3rd, 2018, 3:23 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WillH View Post
It may not have anything to do with load or speed ratings - it may simply be that they are a softer compound and will not provide the mileage expected of a tour bike that spends a lot of time on the interstates and highways.
Thank you and that is the only thing that makes sense to me.

I do not spend much time on highways here in PA as my riding is mostly 2 lane country roads.

However I am going to the National this year and that is 1K each way on slab. It was really why I was buying new tires to have new shoes for the trip.

I now think I will run Dark Side anyway since it is 2K of slab with no appreciable riding in that area.

I will just get a set of PR3 for the rest of my riding and call it a day.

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post #13 of 77 Old Jan 3rd, 2018, 5:35 pm
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

So a GT version will be out next year. A GT version costs more as a rule of thumb. In the meantime Bridgestone already has their new T31's GT out on the market. I wonder how that's going to pan out.
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post #14 of 77 Old Jan 3rd, 2018, 5:47 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

I remember something like this with the LT.

We used Metzler 880's forever and then all the sudden you needed another type that was for a heavier bike with a designation. We never had any blow outs or tires fall apart on us.

We did face the same front scallop except with the Avon Azzero but they went away after awhile.

It all smacks of manufacturers gouging us.

For realshelby I just priced a pair of Road 3's on Amazon and they are 325.04 in my cart.
Dennis Kirk is 316.00.

I will buy those and call it a day although I would love to run the Road 5 the cost is too much to experiment with.
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post #15 of 77 Old Jan 4th, 2018, 6:58 am
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

I have brought up the "GT" vs non GT and "A Spec" vs non A Spec on a couple threads. The manufacturers write that these have a heavier sidewall to handle the heavier loads of bigger Sport Touring bikes. IN EVERY CASE BOTH TYPES OF THE SAME SIZE/BRAND HAVE THE EXACT SAME WEIGHT RATING! 58 front, 73 rear. This is the tires rated weight capacity at the given maximum pressure listed on the sidewall of the tire.

I think the GT and A Spec are an answer to a question that was never asked.

I would not think twice about whether it is safe to run the proper size Road 5 on my RT. GT or regular. I don't know what is up with all the Propaganda about new tires. 20% better in the rain and last 10% longer every time a new model comes out. BS! I have had no issues in the rain with any tire in the last 10 years. None seem to give much of a difference in mileage. I don't see much difference in mileage between the most expensive tires and the mid priced tires.


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post #16 of 77 Old Jan 4th, 2018, 7:55 am
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LAF View Post
So a call to Michelin says they will not fit a RT, but they will fit a GT.

I can not get a Tech to tell me why? Just a canned answer of it is not a recommended fitment for a RT.

I am confused as to why I can run a PR3 with no issue, but I can not run a Road 5.
I know what you are saying. Things that just make you walk away shaking your head.

Can I run this tire? No.
Why? Because the GT is better.
But why is it better? Because it is a GT.

All I can envision is the conversation between the reporter and the guitarist in Spinaltap.

Thank you for sharing your information.
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post #17 of 77 Old Jan 4th, 2018, 8:14 am
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by realshelby View Post
I think the GT and A Spec are an answer to a question that was never asked.
.. I don't know what is up with all the Propaganda about new tires. 20% better in the rain and last 10% longer every time a new model comes out. BS!... None seem to give much of a difference in mileage. I don't see much difference in mileage between the most expensive tires and the mid priced tires.
+1

If what the manufacturers said true, we should be up to about 20,000 miles per rear tyre by now!

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post #18 of 77 Old Jan 4th, 2018, 10:29 am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bandytales View Post
+1

If what the manufacturers said true, we should be up to about 20,000 miles per rear tyre by now!
Maybe on a front tire. Your right. If I purchased a new tire model that says improved mileage I should have a liftime tire by now.
I've been running bridgestones from day one. O21 oem was horrible. That did not last. Then the 023. Much improved mileage. Then the T30. No improvement on mileage although they claim it is.
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post #19 of 77 Old Jan 4th, 2018, 11:45 am Thread Starter
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Well I got them returned and money back in the bank.

I just thought it was worth showing some pics of this tire.

Truth be told I REALLY wanted to run them GT or not just on tread pattern alone.

I will save 80 bucks and buy another set of PR 3's.





EDIT:
After looking at them I keep thinking wow is there a lot of rubber missing or what? I mean it seems to me that there is a lot of area for a puncture to happen in what used to be tread.

I guess we cant have it both ways, tread causes rolling resistance so to increase mileage the resistance has to be reduced. Dam near a slick on the side, that is not chicken strip that is all usable tire that has no sipe. And the size of the sipe on the top is wide enough that with my last name a nail or screw would hit that no issue.

Still disappointed but hey the PR 3 is a wonderful tire and holds up well for me so I am ok with all this. If they were the same price I may see it differently but at 80 something more a set I guess I have passed.

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post #20 of 77 Old Jan 7th, 2018, 8:01 am
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

So why not the PR4s. My '17 RT has the 4s.

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post #21 of 77 Old Jan 7th, 2018, 8:54 am Thread Starter
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rapz View Post
So why not the PR4s. My '17 RT has the 4s.
Well I run the 3's and love them. I have heard others say they are not thrilled with the 4's so I have stayed away from them. No other reason then hearsay and first hand experience with the PR3.

Again I am questioning my thought process on not keeping the Road 5 and may reorder them. I am comfortable running the PR 3 that is not a heavy load rated tire so I see no difference in them and the Road 5.

I mean a 53 and 78 load rating is just that. It will handle the weight. If they wear out in 2 weeks then I will have learned a expensive lesson.

As I say I really like my PR3 and have no interest in a GT spec PR4
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post #22 of 77 Old Jan 7th, 2018, 12:30 pm
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

My feeling is that the relatively light weight of the RT puts it on the border line of needing the extra sidewall stiffness of the GT versions. Riding mostly two up or solo with lots of gear, I'd go for the GT. The base model is fine for solo use. I think the extra stiffness is just there to reduce tire deflection and heat buildup, it doesn't do necessarily anything for tread mileage.

Michelin offered the equivalent of the GT in the PR 3 line, but it was designated as a "B" model. When I ordered a rear PR 3 from Revzilla, I received the B version without specifically requesting it. I probably would have been unaware of the difference if I had not read the markings carefully. When I replaced it with a PR 4, I went with the GT version, as that was the version that BMW installs on the Wethead RT.

At the MOA rally last summer, I asked the Michelin rep about the PR 3 line and was told it is now discontinued. If you really want a PR 3, get it now because the supply will be disappearing.

Michelin says the PR 5 GT will not be available until 2019, so for now, the PR 4 GT is their only recommendation for the RT.

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post #23 of 77 Old Jan 7th, 2018, 4:49 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lkraus View Post
My feeling is that the relatively light weight of the RT puts it on the border line of needing the extra sidewall stiffness of the GT versions. Riding mostly two up or solo with lots of gear, I'd go for the GT. The base model is fine for solo use. I think the extra stiffness is just there to reduce tire deflection and heat buildup, it doesn't do necessarily anything for tread mileage.
I agree with this 100%.

I do in fact watch for tire PSI rise as an indication of too low of pressure or carrying a lot of gear.

If it goes up more than 3 PSI then I start thinking through what may cause that.

I will look for close outs or sales of PR3. Sorry to hear they have discontinued it but I guess too many Pilot Road Pick A Number running out there.

My issue is if you rate a tire for speed and weight, you should not have to pay more to get the one that "really" is weight and speed rated for those designations.

Not rated for a bike even though is the correct size, and weight/speed rating smacks of "forcing" one to move up to a more expensive product, and to me is price gouging at the worst, and unethical business practice at least. And all the motorcycle tire manufacturers are now doing this.

Smacks of a class action consumer suite. Almost like making you use a brand of oil for warranty.

How can manufactures get away with on their own, changing the definition of a rating that was determined by some independent safety committee that defines such standards for tires?

You know if something goes South I do not believe a corporation even as big a Michelin would beat a good lawyer and a jury by just saying "he was running a tire that was not an application for his motorcycle". That puts us back to, why not, it was the correct size, weight, and speed rated tire for his motorcycle correct?

And I am highly pissed off that we have to be conscious of a tire wearing out in 8-10K at best, 6-8 normally and paying 350-400 bucks plus mounting to do it again. I mean in this day and age? You cant make us a 20K tire?

Oh no it is a motorcycle it only has two wheels, it leans, blah blah blah.

So just as I choose to switch back and forth Dark Side, I will choose a correct size/weight/speed rated tire and take my chances.

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post #24 of 77 Old Jan 8th, 2018, 10:43 am
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

I'm approaching 10K miles on the PR4s and they still look great, but that's just me and my riding style. I'm an old man and usually just do 3mph over the speed limits... that's over 80 in many parts of West Texas. Maybe I'm not remembering correctly, but I remember getting only about 3,500 miles off my tires about 20+ years ago, so 10K+- is okay with me. I like lots of rubber.

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post #25 of 77 Old Jan 8th, 2018, 11:56 am
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rapz View Post
I'm approaching 10K miles on the PR4s and they still look great, but that's just me and my riding style. I'm an old man and usually just do 3mph over the speed limits... that's over 80 in many parts of West Texas. Maybe I'm not remembering correctly, but I remember getting only about 3,500 miles off my tires about 20+ years ago, so 10K+- is okay with me. I like lots of rubber.
I am also running the pr4 gt's on my bike. I got around 6000.00 miles and they are just barely starting to flatten in the center. (mostly freeway miles) . On previous bikes i have run the pr2's and pr'3s
All have been great tires. If I get 10k i will be fine with the pr4's gt.
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post #26 of 77 Old Jan 8th, 2018, 1:43 pm
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

As I am not one to lean the bike over to the point 'chicken strips' are less than about 3/4"-7/8" on the rear tire what matters most to me is...

1. Resistance to squaring. There is only so much cornering possible in my day-to-day rides so a lot is done upright; moreover, whenever I take trips there are always highway miles involved.

2. Resistance to cupping/scalloping. PR4GT was ultra sensitive to this such that at recommended front tire pressure of 36.3 psi or so the thing really cupped badly and in not that many miles. It's mitigated by running higher pressures, but still, why does this tire cup more than some others I wonder? This alone makes me shy away from PR4GT, especially at the cost of these tires.

3. Minimal noise! I don't like the howling that can happen w/ some brands as the tire ages w/ mileage. The PR4GT was decent in this regard until miles got upwards of 8500m on the rear so that's pretty good. The Angle GT A spec tire I have on now is better than PR4GT in terms of squaring and is just starting to make very modest noise at 7800m so my guess it will be slightly worse than michelins as far as noise goes.

I'm thinking because of my riding practices having a tire touted for aggressive riding (like the Angel GT was) is truly lost on me and my wallet. So what would be my best bet for a tire w/ best mileage w/ the least noise and most resistance to squaring at the lowest cost?

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post #27 of 77 Old May 9th, 2018, 11:08 am
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

I just purchased a set or Road 5 yesterday for $328, tax included, at a Yamaha/Polaris dealership near me.
This was quite a bit cheaper than a set of PR4GT.
I will be charged $30 per wheel for mounting and balancing when I go back to the store with my rims sometime next week (I still have a few hundreds miles left of rubber )
We'll see how they fare and I'll report back!
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post #28 of 77 Old May 9th, 2018, 11:14 am
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zippy_gg View Post
I just purchased a set or Road 5 yesterday for $328, tax included, at a Yamaha/Polaris dealership near me.
This was quite a bit cheaper than a set of PR4GT.
I will be charged $30 per wheel for mounting and balancing when I go back to the store with my rims sometime next week (I still have a few hundreds miles left of rubber )
We'll see how they fare and I'll report back!
I am able to do your tires if you want to save that $60
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post #29 of 77 Old May 9th, 2018, 8:27 pm
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

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As I am not one to lean the bike over to the point 'chicken strips' are less than about 3/4"-7/8" on the rear tire what matters most to me is...

...2. Resistance to cupping/scalloping. PR4GT was ultra sensitive to this such that at recommended front tire pressure of 36.3 psi or so the thing really cupped badly and in not that many miles. It's mitigated by running higher pressures, but still, why does this tire cup more than some others I wonder? This alone makes me shy away from PR4GT, especially at the cost of these tires. ...
Fwiw, I think 36psi is way too soft. I've kept my PR4GTs at 40F/42R since new and at 7700 mi there's zero cupping and a lot of tread left.
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post #30 of 77 Old May 10th, 2018, 10:59 am
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

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Fwiw, I think 36psi is way too soft. I've kept my PR4GTs at 40F/42R since new and at 7700 mi there's zero cupping and a lot of tread left.
I had the same experience w/ the 2nd set having learned on the first set. I just don't think they're particularly exceptional, but I don't ride in the rain much, and even if I did, I don't ride hard in the rain anyway.

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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

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Originally Posted by NoelCP View Post
I had the same experience w/ the 2nd set having learned on the first set. I just don't think they're particularly exceptional, but I don't ride in the rain much, and even if I did, I don't ride hard in the rain anyway.
Me three. I used to run 36/38 but for the past couple of years have been running more like 39/42. I have 16K on this set of PR4GT and they're close but not yet to the wear bars. They are singing in the corners, though. Previous PR4GT I got 14K. Higher pressure handles better and yields better wear, although the ride is a bit less smooth.

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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

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Originally Posted by bmwcoolk1200 View Post
I am able to do your tires if you want to save that $60
Cool beans!
Can we meet next week? I'll bring the rims and your favorite beverage!

Gilles & Kathy
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post #33 of 77 Old May 12th, 2018, 5:00 pm
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

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Cool beans!
Can we meet next week? I'll bring the rims and your favorite beverage!
Sure, no beverage necessary. I think I am going to swap out the rear wheel on my LT before CCR-R just to be safe. You pick the day and I will have the tire machine set up.

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post #34 of 77 Old May 20th, 2018, 5:49 pm
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

New Road 5 mounted and balanced on the RT.
I took a quick test ride to make sure I reassembled the bike properly, and I only experienced the usual change in the geometry of the new "rounded" versus the old "flatter" profile.
The real test is coming up this week, 2 up, with approximately 1.5K to-1.6K miles.
I'll report back upon my return.
Thanks again to bmwcoolk1200 for all the labor involved in replacing 2 tires.
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post #35 of 77 Old May 20th, 2018, 9:29 pm
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

I have the Road 5s on my 12 RT and am very happy with them so far with about 1500 miles. They replaced my PR4GTs after 12k miles. I had the option of the new Metzelers or the new Road 5s and since I liked the PR4s so much, I stuck with Michelin.

Hard to explain the difference, but I think the best description is where with the PR4s you could feel the center of gravity shift when leaning hard around corners but the tires offered the confidence to keep twisting and leaning. The Road 5s seem to just grip all day without that falling into the corners feeling.

My tire guy, who also rides an RT, recommended these tires and hes never steered me wrong. Longevity is the only question and time will tell on that... Run 36F/41R.

Rami


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post #36 of 77 Old May 21st, 2018, 7:10 am
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FYI, Michelin recommends the Road 5 for lighter weight bikes. Suggests owners continue to use the PR4GT for touring bikes until the Road 5 GT is available. I saw this in the small print on one of their advertisements.

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post #37 of 77 Old May 21st, 2018, 8:15 am
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by darammer View Post
Hard to explain the difference, but I think the best description is where with the PR4s you could feel the center of gravity shift when leaning hard around corners but the tires offered the confidence to keep twisting and leaning. The Road 5s seem to just grip all day without that falling into the corners feeling..
When/if the front tire cups or wears on the sides, that feeling of falling into the corner may return.


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Just saw that Roadriderg already commented on Michelin’s claim about Road5 not being for heavier touring bikes.

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post #39 of 77 Old May 21st, 2018, 9:01 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Even though I said it in the front of this thread, I am pissed they can make a tire speed rated, weight rated, and tell you, you cant run it on your bike.

It is pure and simple a forced sale of a product.

It seems to me it should be against the law to manufacture something to a accepted standard set by the Tire Industry and then say "ohh you need this GT version" and it cost more. If they sold them for the same price it would be no issue with me, they are not, it is.

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post #40 of 77 Old May 27th, 2018, 6:18 pm
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zippy_gg View Post
New Road 5 mounted and balanced on the RT.
I took a quick test ride to make sure I reassembled the bike properly, and I only experienced the usual change in the geometry of the new "rounded" versus the old "flatter" profile.
The real test is coming up this week, 2 up, with approximately 1.5K to-1.6K miles.
I'll report back upon my return.
Thanks again to bmwcoolk1200 for all the labor involved in replacing 2 tires.
Well, returning from a 1755 mile trip with the new Road 5, fully loaded and 2-up, I can comment that I did not experience any issues with the non-GT tires.
We rode fast and slow, long sweepers and hairpins, 80-85 cruising speed on the slab, with tons of water from thunderstorms.
The tires performed beautifully.
The only difference I experienced from the PR4-GT, and this is just a butt feeling with no empirical data to back that up, is that I could feel the road imperfections more.
That's my story, and I stick to it!

Gilles & Kathy
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post #41 of 77 Old Jul 4th, 2019, 1:25 pm
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Being my first post on this forum... Hello to all!

I just purchased a used BMW R1150RT and having lot's of fun. But needed new tires.
After extensive search, I am sold on the Michelin Road 5's!

I brought in the bike for tranny and final drive oil change, with intent to change the tires at the same time.
BMW dealer told me the Road 5's are great if not the best tires money can buy; when I gave the okay to buy... then the yellow flag came up.
Stating the RT needed the GT rating. Looking at the Trail with exact same specs they said yep should be no problem if I do not ride 2 up and fully loaded.

So I pulled the trigger and ordered the Road 5's. (Rear tire was not in stock). BMW will be installing them mid July. (next week)

I was worried by reading this thread and other threads about the lack of GT rating even if the specs are identical to the PR4-GT's.
Zippy_gg thanks for sharing.. will help me sleep better tonight.

Cheers!
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post #42 of 77 Old Jul 4th, 2019, 3:05 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OldRT View Post
Being my first post on this forum... Hello to all!

I just purchased a used BMW R1150RT and having lot's of fun. But needed new tires.
After extensive search, I am sold on the Michelin Road 5's!

I brought in the bike for tranny and final drive oil change, with intent to change the tires at the same time.
BMW dealer told me the Road 5's are great if not the best tires money can buy; when I gave the okay to buy... then the yellow flag came up.
Stating the RT needed the GT rating. Looking at the Trail with exact same specs they said yep should be no problem if I do not ride 2 up and fully loaded.

So I pulled the trigger and ordered the Road 5's. (Rear tire was not in stock). BMW will be installing them mid July. (next week)

I was worried by reading this thread and other threads about the lack of GT rating even if the specs are identical to the PR4-GT's.
Zippy_gg thanks for sharing.. will help me sleep better tonight.

Cheers!
I talked to the Rep at this years National in TN.

He said there is NO difference in the sidewall construction of a Road 5 or a Road 5 GT.

Lets put that Internet myth to bed!

The difference is in the tread compound so they can achieve longevity. One thing I have seen mentioned on some guys running the Road 5 is they have said mileage is down a little. The rep said this is what the GT specifically addresses. And maybe December he said. Something about a mold broke and evidentially that is a critical issue.

Lee
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post #43 of 77 Old Jul 4th, 2019, 3:53 pm
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Lee, thanks for starting this thread. My apologies if I missed the part about them being identical with trade off for longevity.
My main interest is flexible use.. but I've never been very confident in wet driving conditions. which these Road 5's seem to excel very well.

Did you end up buying the Road 5's after all said in done? I remember reading you had decided to continue with the PR3

Note: Cost for the pair Road 5's: $383.87 tax in. USD
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Last edited by OldRT; Jul 4th, 2019 at 5:17 pm.
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post #44 of 77 Old Jul 4th, 2019, 8:03 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by OldRT View Post
Lee, thanks for starting this thread. My apologies if I missed the part about them being identical with trade off for longevity.
My main interest is flexible use.. but I've never been very confident in wet driving conditions. which these Road 5's seem to excel very well.

Did you end up buying the Road 5's after all said in done? I remember reading you had decided to continue with the PR3

Note: Cost for the pair Road 5's: $383.87 tax in. USD
I am on a GS now. I am running 90-10 tires. The Road 5 are next on the list to try. I do have a spare rear wheel with a Road 5 on that I switch over to wear the fronts all the way out so I cant comment on the tire as a set. As a rear tire it is fine but as I say not a good review until I get a set on to run out together.

I am loving my Scorpion II from Pirelli though. Quiet and grip very well. I look forward to trying the Road 5.

Lee
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post #45 of 77 Old Jul 5th, 2019, 3:12 am
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Well here is the content of an email sent to me from Michelin Europe when I asked about using Road 5 on my RT. Doesn't look like bull to me, but you guys make your own decision. I know in the UK if you had a crash and there was an investigation, they could very well check to see if the bike has approved tyres on.

Hello,

Thanks for the interest in Michelin tyres for your bike.

The Pilot Road 4 GT was developed while working closely with BMW to adapt the standard Pilot Road 4 to better suit the particular demands of the R 1200 RT and a short list of other bikes. Michelin were not entirely happy with the handling of the bike when using the standard tyres, in particular when/if the bike was pushed quite hard, and we engineered a solution to ensure rider satisfaction.

The solution was to create a new casing construction with optimised ply angles, made possible by a new assembly process to increase cornering stiffness. Cornering stifness has increased by 15% without resorting to increasing the number of casing plies which otherwise would have added approx 700g to the weight of the tyre. This construction guarantees the stability of the bike at speed without sacrificing comfort.

The Pilot Road 4 GT remains our recommended fitment for your bike, and the standard Road 5 tyres are not recommended. We are developing a Road 5 GT tyre, but it will not be available in 2018.

I hope that this helps,

Best regards,


2w Customer Engineering Support – Operational Marketing

Europe North and Russia
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post #46 of 77 Old Jul 5th, 2019, 4:58 am Thread Starter
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by casbar View Post
Well here is the content of an email sent to me from Michelin Europe when I asked about using Road 5 on my RT. Doesn't look like bull to me, but you guys make your own decision. I know in the UK if you had a crash and there was an investigation, they could very well check to see if the bike has approved tyres on.

Hello,

Thanks for the interest in Michelin tyres for your bike.

The Pilot Road 4 GT was developed while working closely with BMW to adapt the standard Pilot Road 4 to better suit the particular demands of the R 1200 RT and a short list of other bikes. Michelin were not entirely happy with the handling of the bike when using the standard tyres, in particular when/if the bike was pushed quite hard, and we engineered a solution to ensure rider satisfaction.

The solution was to create a new casing construction with optimised ply angles, made possible by a new assembly process to increase cornering stiffness. Cornering stifness has increased by 15% without resorting to increasing the number of casing plies which otherwise would have added approx 700g to the weight of the tyre. This construction guarantees the stability of the bike at speed without sacrificing comfort.

The Pilot Road 4 GT remains our recommended fitment for your bike, and the standard Road 5 tyres are not recommended. We are developing a Road 5 GT tyre, but it will not be available in 2018.

I hope that this helps,

Best regards,


2w Customer Engineering Support – Operational Marketing

Europe North and Russia
The ply angels he talks about are on the running section of the tire not the side walls. That is how they adjust compound wear.

Now this was from a rep who gave me his card to use his name in the post so if there were any questions he could field them. I need to look for his card. I did tell him I was going to post up as I was sick of this side wall flex, stiffer sidewall crap, and wanted to know what the real truth about this was. He said increasing wear characteristics for the weight. Other then that just less mileage he said the tire will be identical except for compound and how that compound was applied to the tire. I then asked again nothing to affect sidewall stiffness and he said no this is all compound wear issues from weight.

Now this was three weeks or so ago so I consider it recent information. And again dont look for them in production until sometime in 2020.

Again at the risk of being a broken record.

It is the correct size, speed rating, and weight rating. In a accident there would be no way you could be at fault for using a tire that fits your bike.

Wear characteristics do not enter into the ability of a tire to handle weight or speed. We see that from the tire life thread where one guy is like 3000 miles I need a set of tires to the 14,000 mile guys who says he is getting close to needing a set

Lee
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post #47 of 77 Old Jul 5th, 2019, 9:53 am
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LAF View Post
The ply angels he talks about are on the running section of the tire not the side walls. That is how they adjust compound wear.

Now this was from a rep who gave me his card to use his name in the post so if there were any questions he could field them. I need to look for his card. I did tell him I was going to post up as I was sick of this side wall flex, stiffer sidewall crap, and wanted to know what the real truth about this was. He said increasing wear characteristics for the weight. Other then that just less mileage he said the tire will be identical except for compound and how that compound was applied to the tire. I then asked again nothing to affect sidewall stiffness and he said no this is all compound wear issues from weight.

Now this was three weeks or so ago so I consider it recent information. And again dont look for them in production until sometime in 2020.

Again at the risk of being a broken record.

It is the correct size, speed rating, and weight rating. In a accident there would be no way you could be at fault for using a tire that fits your bike.

Wear characteristics do not enter into the ability of a tire to handle weight or speed. We see that from the tire life thread where one guy is like 3000 miles I need a set of tires to the 14,000 mile guys who says he is getting close to needing a set
Europe is a different place to the US, we have different rules, the PR5 is not a recommended tyre by BMW for the RT, end of. . Also the PR5GT is available from Sept in Europe (that was posted yesterday), so 2020 must be US. I can only go on the information above, I also have this chap email address and he is from the engineering support team. So my expert is better than yours lol Like all this stuff, everyone can make their own minds up.
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post #48 of 77 Old Jul 5th, 2019, 1:28 pm
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by casbar View Post
Well here is the content of an email sent to me from Michelin Europe when I asked about using Road 5 on my RT. ...
Here's what I got from Michelin USA back in February 2018 when I asked about GT vs non GT tires on the wethead RT. I kept it to the PR4 so as not to get into an "apples vs oranges" conversation with them. I got back an awful lot of words to say essentially nothing.


Hello Alan,

Thanks for contacting the Michelin Consumer Care Team. My name is Nicholas and I look forward to helping you out. You’ve been assigned case number 13499708. This will allow my team to quickly pull your claim details if any further questions arise.

Let’s see how we can help.

Regarding your email stating:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Why is a Pilot Road 4 Standard Tire not recommended for my motorcycle, even though the Pilot Road 4 GT version has the same size, load, and speed rating? What benefits do I get from the GT?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------


We understand your concern for this issue, Alan. The GT has been optimized to provide the best possible performance on GT motorcycles. Generally with GT motorcycles, they require GT branded tires in order to perform to their best, which may be one reason why the standard Road 4 is not recommended.

If we can assist you further, please respond to this email or call us at 1-800-346-4098 (toll-free) between 8:00 a.m. and 8:00 p.m. EST Monday through Saturday.

We appreciate your business and thank you for choosing Michelin.

Sincerely,
Nicholas
Consumer Care Department
Certified Michelin Product Expert


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post #49 of 77 Old Jul 5th, 2019, 2:32 pm
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by casbar View Post
Europe is a different place to the US, we have different rules, the PR5 is not a recommended tyre by BMW for the RT, end of. . Also the PR5GT is available from Sept in Europe (that was posted yesterday), so 2020 must be US. I can only go on the information above, I also have this chap email address and he is from the engineering support team. So my expert is better than yours lol Like all this stuff, everyone can make their own minds up.
For what it is worth - I just called a Sales person; I was told the Road 5 GT is not available before March 2020.
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post #50 of 77 Old Jul 5th, 2019, 4:07 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Michelin Road 5 on the way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by casbar View Post
Europe is a different place to the US, we have different rules, the PR5 is not a recommended tyre by BMW for the RT, end of. . Also the PR5GT is available from Sept in Europe (that was posted yesterday), so 2020 must be US. I can only go on the information above, I also have this chap email address and he is from the engineering support team. So my expert is better than yours lol Like all this stuff, everyone can make their own minds up.
Recommended is not the same as legal. Don't know how that changes in Europe or USA?

Seems there would have to be a law suite for me.

You can recommend something all day long that means nothing to me.

How could you defend yourself when you make something that is in fact RATED for the machine it is being put on? Would your lawyer say we did not recommend those tires for the motorcycle? My lawyer would say tough titty, you made them in the size, you made them in the weight limit, and you made them in the speed rating for the machine they are on. Again recommendation is not the same as illegal or dangerous.

My lawyer, So why are they not recommended? Well they wear out faster. So no structural difference no difference at all except compound? Nope not a thing. So what is the European verdict?

Not seeing the legal thing at all, or the Europe or USA thing but you are correct, we all can make our own minds up

Lee
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