Another Brake Line Story........ - BMW Luxury Touring Community
 
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post #1 of 19 Old Jul 8th, 2013, 11:19 pm Thread Starter
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Another Brake Line Story........

So the old LT gave up another brake line this week. This time it was the left front caliper line. Same old sh**. Pin leak developed which allows the line to bleed down slowly under pressure. Some of you may recall that line number one was the front master cylinder line which got Spiegled. Problem solved. Number two was the rear master cylinder which got O.E. replacement (why, I don't know in retrospect). Number three was the rear caliper line which actually "popped" when I installed the master line and was testing it. It got a custom built line from a local shop at less than half of O.E. price. Problem solved. So........ the same shop built me a new line for the left front caliper. "What's my point?", you may ask. Well, if you have a brake line failure, just bite the bullet and order the Spieglers. You'll likely save yourself some headaches in the long run.
As for me...... I only have one O.E. line left, so I figure one more failure and I'm done. Sure makes bleeding the brakes easy.


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post #2 of 19 Old Jul 8th, 2013, 11:31 pm
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Re: Another Brake Line Story........

yep. after losing one line and replacing it, i lost another (this is an 02) so i just----just(?) had them replace all and now that can't go bad/won't go bad/shouldn't go bad.

Preventative Maintenance. it only makes sense.

Mike Hammel (My Camel) [WB9GMO/4]
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post #3 of 19 Old Jul 8th, 2013, 11:50 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Another Brake Line Story........

The sad thing is I have a 1983 Honda V65 which sat outdoors for at least five to ten years. The original owner was going to throw it in a dumpster so I rescued it. The thirty year old original brake lines on it are just fine. However the Brembo lines on my LT which has been inside a garage its whole life are leaky failing pieces of junk. Brembo makes great brakes, but their brake lines are crap, it seems. Just my personal experience.


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post #4 of 19 Old Jul 9th, 2013, 10:56 am
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Re: Another Brake Line Story........

Can someone give me a link to the Spiegle (I am assuming this is a Brand?) brake lines?
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post #5 of 19 Old Jul 9th, 2013, 11:46 am
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Re: Another Brake Line Story........

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaFish
Can someone give me a link to the Spiegle (I am assuming this is a Brand?) brake lines?
http://www.spieglerusa.com/

-Steve

2000 BMW K1200LT
2000 BMW R1200C
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post #6 of 19 Old Jul 9th, 2013, 12:04 pm
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Question Re: Another Brake Line Story........

02 LT
Front master brake line failed in 2010 on way home from Killington, VT.
Replaced with OEM line.
Just recently had 96K service and had all lines replaced with OEM and complete system flush.

Back when I replaced the front master line I considered aftermarket but was advised the stainless steel lines do not "give" (expand/stretch) like the rubber OEM and this may put strain on the ABS Control Unit.

Has there been any such indication of harm to ABS Control Units by using SS lines ?

Doug Holck
Lodi, Ca

I don't always ride motorcycles,
but when I do I prefer BMW's.
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post #7 of 19 Old Jul 9th, 2013, 12:09 pm
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Re: Another Brake Line Story........

Quote:
Originally Posted by copperstatetour
Thanks for the link Copper!
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post #8 of 19 Old Jul 9th, 2013, 12:10 pm
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Re: Another Brake Line Story........

Quote:
Originally Posted by dougholck
02 LT
Front master brake line failed in 2010 on way home from Killington, VT.
Replaced with OEM line.
Just recently had 96K service and had all lines replaced with OEM and complete system flush.

Back when I replaced the front master line I considered aftermarket but was advised the stainless steel lines do not "give" (expand/stretch) like the rubber OEM and this may put strain on the ABS Control Unit.

Has there been any such indication of harm to ABS Control Units by using SS lines ?
Good question and I will stand on the sidelines for the answer. I plan on replacing the lines on my 2000 LT soon.
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post #9 of 19 Old Jul 9th, 2013, 12:43 pm
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Re: Another Brake Line Story........

stainless brake lines are rubber hoses with stainless braid on the outside, you can get the same type flexible products lower pressure of course for washing machine, tap and toilet supply

the rubber is still going to degrade over time depending on quality

Gary
2018 R1200RT
Past rides
2012 K1600GTL
2000 K1200LT
1992 K1100LT
2000 V Star 650/Velorex sidecar
1985 K100RT
1965 R60/2
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post #10 of 19 Old Jul 9th, 2013, 1:30 pm
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Re: Another Brake Line Story........

Quote:
Originally Posted by dougholck
02 LT
Front master brake line failed in 2010 on way home from Killington, VT.
Replaced with OEM line.
Just recently had 96K service and had all lines replaced with OEM and complete system flush.

Back when I replaced the front master line I considered aftermarket but was advised the stainless steel lines do not "give" (expand/stretch) like the rubber OEM and this may put strain on the ABS Control Unit.

Has there been any such indication of harm to ABS Control Units by using SS lines ?
I believe that BMW says SS lines will damage the ABS control unit. I think using the brakes damages BMW ABS modules. Perhaps the reason BMW says that the Spieglers will damage the ABS modules is because the stock lines are designed to fail and thereby provide a pressure relief for the unit

Sorry if I sound a little jaded, I just have zero confidence in BMW ABS systems. I wonder how many 2000 BMW cars are running around with ABS failures on them, just a guess but I bet it is really close to zero.

-Steve

2000 BMW K1200LT
2000 BMW R1200C

Last edited by copperstatetour; Jul 9th, 2013 at 1:30 pm. Reason: sp correction
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post #11 of 19 Old Jul 9th, 2013, 3:59 pm
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Re: Another Brake Line Story........

Quote:
Originally Posted by copperstatetour
I believe that BMW says SS lines will damage the ABS control unit. I think using the brakes damages BMW ABS modules. Perhaps the reason BMW says that the Spieglers will damage the ABS modules is because the stock lines are designed to fail and thereby provide a pressure relief for the unit

Sorry if I sound a little jaded, I just have zero confidence in BMW ABS systems. I wonder how many 2000 BMW cars are running around with ABS failures on them, just a guess but I bet it is really close to zero.
It could be worse;

It could be an HD unit where YOU are the test lab. Jus sayin!

[B]It STILL don't make me no nevermind![/B]
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post #12 of 19 Old Jul 9th, 2013, 4:21 pm
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Re: Another Brake Line Story........

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaFish
It could be worse;

It could be an HD unit where YOU are the test lab. Jus sayin!
I had no idea they were still working on testing, I thought that HD had all their R & D completed back in the 20's.

-Steve

2000 BMW K1200LT
2000 BMW R1200C
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post #13 of 19 Old Jul 9th, 2013, 4:58 pm
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Re: Another Brake Line Story........

Quote:
Originally Posted by copperstatetour
I had no idea they were still working on testing, I thought that HD had all their R & D completed back in the 20's.
They're trying to come into the 20th century. Let's not be too hard on em huh?

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post #14 of 19 Old Jul 9th, 2013, 5:48 pm
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Re: Another Brake Line Story........

Quote:
Originally Posted by gary45
stainless brake lines are rubber hoses with stainless braid on the outside, you can get the same type flexible products lower pressure of course for washing machine, tap and toilet supply

the rubber is still going to degrade over time depending on quality
I have seen stainless oil lines with rubber but I have never seen a stainless brake line with anything other than teflon inner reinforced with the woven stainless steel outer. Spiegler uses Dupont PTFE-Teflon inner.

Dave Selvig
2004 Black LT
2000 Canon Red LT



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post #15 of 19 Old Jul 9th, 2013, 6:36 pm
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Re: Another Brake Line Story........

Honestly if BMW brake lines fail so much it is because they are poorly designed. If they can not last 10 years without any failures then they are defective. The dealer should happily replace them without cost and give you an apology.

I know, that last part probably made most of you laugh...

Currently riding a 2003 K1200LTC
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post #16 of 19 Old Jul 9th, 2013, 7:09 pm
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Re: Another Brake Line Story........

Just sayn' I am replacing all the lines on my 05 next year. Why you say? Because it was built in April of 04 and will be 10 years old.

My 1976 Suzuki had OEM hoses on it and in 2002 I finally replaced them but they were not leaking but did a great balloon imitation every time I grabbed the brakes. Seriously almost every manufacturer recommends replacing any rubber based hoses at the 10 year mark. Naval aviation replaced all hydraulic hoses every 5 years.

Any one that has gone past 10 years on brake hoses (Teflon excepted) is living on borrowed time. Just because you survived does not mean you always will.

John
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post #17 of 19 Old Jul 9th, 2013, 7:25 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Another Brake Line Story........

I should point out too that the lines are clearly stamped "Brembo", so my take on it is that Brembo makes poor quality brake lines, or at least used to. On the bright side Humpty Dumpty is all back together and functioning normally, at least for now. This particular line ruptured as I was approaching an intersection on a steep downhill incline and the traffic light short-cycled for some reason. All I got was about a two second amber and then red, so the ABS was tested that day. It did the job, so that part made me happy.


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post #18 of 19 Old Jul 9th, 2013, 11:27 pm
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Re: Another Brake Line Story........

mine lasted 11 years with no failures that i know of.

listen people--the things said on this site are a collection of a few. the majority probably don't know we're here. those with issues pipe up-appropriately so!! most are the silent majority of the minority.

the is-without a doubt-the most knowledgeable and kindest bunch of fellows and fellaws i have ever seen on a forum. and that's the truuuutttthhhs!

Mike Hammel (My Camel) [WB9GMO/4]
2002 K1200LT-E
1998 ACE Burgundy (now 'retired')
1998 ACE Yellow/Black Tourer (now 'retired')
19?? Suzuki 500 (now 'retired')
1962 modifed 49cc>~55cc Sears MoPed (LONG 'retired')

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post #19 of 19 Old Jul 14th, 2013, 2:25 am
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Re: Another Brake Line Story........

I just recently had ALL of my front brake flexible lines fail. One failed shortly after starting a trip. I returned home. The second failed immediately after I replaced the first and the third a few days later. The 2001 LT has 38k miles on it and has been kept in a garage. My 2000 honda nighthawk is fine.

I have kept a log of all maintenance and part failures on my 2000 NightHawk and the 2001 LT. Both have nearly identical mileage, but the LT has had significantly more parts failures and tires.

My next ride will NOT be a BMW.

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