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post #1 of 33 Old Mar 14th, 2012, 9:29 pm Thread Starter
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Center stand check fluid?

Is there a way to check the fluid level in the power centerstand unit? Preferably with it still on the bike. If not what is the easyest way to check it.

Lately with me and my wife both on the bike it wont lift it up all the way. But if im alone or if I stand up when were both on it. It will go up fine. So I figured I should check the fluid first. The motor sounds fine it dont bog or anything. It just gets to where it really starts to lift the bike and wont. It just keeps runing the sound of the motor never changes. It acts like one of my hydrolic floor jack if it gets low on fluid.
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post #2 of 33 Old Mar 15th, 2012, 5:16 am
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

I am not too sure about the fluid level but if your center stand is not lifting you and your wife, you may want to consider checking your battery. What I have found is that if the battery is weak, the center stand will not work -- I am guessing that it draws a lot of amps and if the battery is marginal, the center stand won't work.

My suggestion is to check the battery -- I bought my mnew battery last fall from batteryshark.com -- for $50 or less, you can have a nice battery for your LT (you need to drill the terminal holes a little bigger to get your screws through them). See the link below for the battery that works for the LT.

http://www.batterysharks.com/Univers...180_b12-18.htm

Glenn
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post #3 of 33 Old Mar 15th, 2012, 5:58 am
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

It's an amount rather then a level and it is listed on this site as well as the procedure.

You might consider deploying the stand with just you on the bike and standing, I'm pretty sure it's noted in the manual. you might be asking a lot of the stand when also lifting you and a passenger no matter the size. Lighten the load, extend the longevity.
Just a thought.
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post #4 of 33 Old Mar 15th, 2012, 9:24 am
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

Quote:
Originally Posted by oosel
Is there a way to check the fluid level in the power centerstand unit? Preferably with it still on the bike. If not what is the easyest way to check it.
The only way to check fluid is to take the centerstand off the bike, drain the fluid from the stand, measure the amount you get out and then refill with proper amount. All that information is detailed in a rebuild post, don't have the link at my finger tips but a search will find it.

Found it, look here; http://www.bmwlt.com/forums/showthre...ic+centerstand

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post #5 of 33 Old Mar 15th, 2012, 10:20 am Thread Starter
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnbaker15
The only way to check fluid is to take the centerstand off the bike, drain the fluid from the stand, measure the amount you get out and then refill with proper amount. All that information is detailed in a rebuild post, don't have the link at my finger tips but a search will find it.

Found it, look here; http://www.bmwlt.com/forums/showthre...ic+centerstand

Thank you thats what I was wondering.
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post #6 of 33 Old Mar 15th, 2012, 12:07 pm
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

johnbaker15 beat me to it. No option other than to pull it off. And, even though it's got the grunt power to lift you, your passenger and a full load off the ground, it's still better to take off as much weight as possible, as it will help to prevent fluid loss from weapage around the seal.
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post #7 of 33 Old Mar 15th, 2012, 2:48 pm
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

125 to 150 ml ONLY. If it does not raise the bike two up you are low on fluid OR have a very weak motor. Either one will cause it. I popped a new motor in and it really didn't make that much of a difference just quiter. Found I only had 100 ml in it. Finally got 130 in the old girl and she purred like a kitten on steroids.

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post #8 of 33 Old Mar 16th, 2012, 6:32 am
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jzeiler
125 to 150 ml ONLY. If it does not raise the bike two up you are low on fluid OR have a very weak motor. Either one will cause it. I popped a new motor in and it really didn't make that much of a difference just quiter. Found I only had 100 ml in it. Finally got 130 in the old girl and she purred like a kitten on steroids.
Due to the nature of "checking the fluid level/amt.", I'd say this is one of those fluids not intended to be checked regularly like the engine oil, brake fluid, coolant, etc. This is pretty much a sealed unit, for the sake of explanation. Like freon in HVAC systems or even the jack oil in a hydraulic jack- if it's low, then you have a leak, and the assembly needs repaired. As someone else mentioned, start troubleshooting the condition of your battery and motor first, unless you see obvious signs of leakage.

Jeff
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post #9 of 33 Old Mar 16th, 2012, 6:13 pm
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

The usual failure mode is the shaft wiper seal deteriorates and that causes dirt to get to the shaft pressure seal which begins leaking (a tiny amount). You only need to loose about 10-30 ml over time to make it stop working.

John
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post #10 of 33 Old Mar 21st, 2012, 11:19 am
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

I called my local BMW dealership and was told the center stand actuator is replaced not rebuilt. New unit price was $1109.00. This is BMWs decision not to rebuild actuators but it has been done. I just replaced seals in my leaking unit. Joe Gottberg wrote an excellent article about his rebuild, I followed it and so far so good. My LT is an 05, what done the wiper seal in was a freshly 'tar and chip' asphalt black top. Tar had built up on the exposed portion of the piston rod, hardened and eventually caused a leak. You will notice a small puddle of hydraulic fluid underneath the actuator and can spot the leak on unit visually without removing any parts.
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post #11 of 33 Old Mar 21st, 2012, 4:44 pm
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

Quote:
Originally Posted by chestere
I called my local BMW dealership and was told the center stand actuator is replaced not rebuilt. New unit price was $1109.00. This is BMWs decision not to rebuild actuators but it has been done. I just replaced seals in my leaking unit. Joe Gottberg wrote an excellent article about his rebuild, I followed it and so far so good. My LT is an 05, what done the wiper seal in was a freshly 'tar and chip' asphalt black top. Tar had built up on the exposed portion of the piston rod, hardened and eventually caused a leak. You will notice a small puddle of hydraulic fluid underneath the actuator and can spot the leak on unit visually without removing any parts.
Good lord, replace only?
I work in an oilfield shop. Unless the shaft is heavily scored or bent, it's really nothing to repack one of these things. Slight scarring or crap on the arm is not terribly difficult to deal with. And BMW wonders why they sometimes have a bad rep when it comes to service and maintenance . . .
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post #12 of 33 Old Mar 21st, 2012, 8:11 pm
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

I think it is just a matter of economics. It costs money to spare out parts and stock them and then there is the time spent. Much easier and profitable to replace the whole unit vs. repair. Strange since every thing is readily available including the motor (but not the pump, BMW limited the Italian mfg from selling except thier actuator manufacturer).

John
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post #13 of 33 Old Mar 21st, 2012, 9:49 pm
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jzeiler
I think it is just a matter of economics. It costs money to spare out parts and stock them and then there is the time spent. Much easier and profitable to replace the whole unit vs. repair. Strange since every thing is readily available including the motor (but not the pump, BMW limited the Italian mfg from selling except thier actuator manufacturer).

John, do you have specs and/or alternate vendor part numbers for the motor and piston?

Antony (Tripod)
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post #14 of 33 Old Mar 22nd, 2012, 5:57 am
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

Quote:
Originally Posted by deputy5211
John, do you have specs and/or alternate vendor part numbers for the motor and piston?
jumping in... starter motor from EMS Global - HS-50N $38 in the US.
cheers mate

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post #15 of 33 Old Mar 22nd, 2012, 8:20 am
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

Cheers Chris!

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post #16 of 33 Old Mar 22nd, 2012, 7:17 pm
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

The piston itself and it's teflon seals are pretty robust and should not need replacing. Just the wiper and pressure seals on the shaft and the o-rings on the body. I guess it would be good to get some shafts made some time as they do corrode and wear if the wipre fails. I was supposed to get one from a guy that bent his (bad CS pivot bolts caused the newly re-build actuator to bend the shaft) but he never came though on the deal.

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post #17 of 33 Old Apr 1st, 2012, 9:18 pm
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

I just bought a used assembly off Ebay, an it works fine,, so I decided to take mine apart ( i should have checked out some of the posts here first ) and it's a fairly straight forward operation.. NO help from the local BMW shop,,,no spec's or info on type and amount of fluid to replace.. I completely disassembled the unit,, cleaned it added some ATF and just unplugged the one on my bike and plugged the other one in and it now works... I will probably take the used one i bought back off and change the fluid out and pack the drive gear ( black plastic the size of a silver dollar ) with some moly grease ( as other's on this site have recommended ) and keep one as a spare..
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post #18 of 33 Old Apr 1st, 2012, 9:23 pm
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

Most of us have used hydrualic jack oil as it more closely resembles what was in there. BMW decided along time ago they would make it a throw away item so no dealers are equiped to help. Just make absolutley sure you don't put more than 150 ml of oil in there or you will crack the case or at least blow out he 0.030 case o-ring seal. Total capacity is 175ml but she will function best on 130 - 150 ml.

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post #19 of 33 Old Apr 2nd, 2012, 1:45 am
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

Quote:
Originally Posted by shelbymustang1965
I just bought a used assembly off Ebay, an it works fine,, so I decided to take mine apart ( i should have checked out some of the posts here first ) and it's a fairly straight forward operation.. NO help from the local BMW shop,,,no spec's or info on type and amount of fluid to replace.. I completely disassembled the unit,, cleaned it added some ATF and just unplugged the one on my bike and plugged the other one in and it now works... I will probably take the used one i bought back off and change the fluid out and pack the drive gear ( black plastic the size of a silver dollar ) with some moly grease ( as other's on this site have recommended ) and keep one as a spare..
How'd you manage that? Did you buy the whole thing or just the actuator? I've been regularly searching for a hydraulic center stand, but the ebay searches come up 0.

Jeff
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post #20 of 33 Old Apr 2nd, 2012, 7:37 am
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bikerj
How'd you manage that? Did you buy the whole thing or just the actuator? I've been regularly searching for a hydraulic center stand, but the ebay searches come up 0.
I see them all the time, well not all the time but often. Search BMW K1200Lt, select either highest price or newly listed, then you don't have to go through 1200 parts.

John Baker

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post #21 of 33 Old Apr 2nd, 2012, 11:27 am
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

I believe it says in the manual not to allow your weight to remain on the bike when using the centerstand especially trying to lft two people and the beast.
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post #22 of 33 Old Jul 20th, 2014, 10:13 am
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

Hey guys, I'm new to the Forum and have read this thread as I to have a problem with my actuator on my 2005 LT. The bikes done 22,000 miles and I have just done an oil change which required removal of the engine guard/activator assembly. On refitting the actuator does work! The light flashes on the dash but no buzzing motor sound. I checked it on the bench and put 12v across the two connector wires (I realise this is not how the unit correctly works) and all operated ok, motor buzzed and piston moved. I noticed the actuator motor is earthed to the body of the actuator and so back through the frame so I'm guessing the 2 wire connector is a live and switched live but I don't get a voltage reading from either when I test with a voltmeter. I'm now getting really confused so if anyone has had this problem and solved it I would really appreciate some feedback. Cheers.
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post #23 of 33 Old Jul 20th, 2014, 2:11 pm
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

Answered in a PM but here is the text for others.

The unit motor is earthed but it does get its earth return via the connector. BMW usually does not rely on a frame connection for earthing. So you have an earth (black on the actuator side and Brown on the bike side) and a switched live (red) going to that connector. Behind the battery is the relay that switches that power to the unit. That relay and circuit is not fused. The relay is controlled by the EHCS controller located under the pillion set and mounted to the fender. The connector is some what hard to secure so make sure that is done. If it does not work then I would look at the relay next for voltage. One side goes to 12 v+ and the other to that connector. The black or brown wire from the connector goes to the earth tie point behind the battery.

John
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post #24 of 33 Old Feb 20th, 2015, 7:15 pm
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

I'm surprised (unless I missed it) that nobody mentioned having the engine running when deploying the center stand. I was doing that instinctively and my guru tells me it is required/advised because the pump motor draws so much current.

Try your center stand with the engine on at high idle.
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post #25 of 33 Old Feb 20th, 2015, 7:22 pm
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Urbanhermit View Post
I'm surprised (unless I missed it) that nobody mentioned having the engine running when deploying the center stand. I was doing that instinctively and my guru tells me it is required/advised because the pump motor draws so much current.

Try your center stand with the engine on at high idle.
It is recommended but not necessary. I have done it several times over the last 10 years. If the unit is not lifting all the way (bucking) it is because it has leaked fluid out. Even with a very weak battery the unit will lift.

John
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post #26 of 33 Old Feb 20th, 2015, 7:37 pm
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

Okay -- not required.

I'm in the form because my center stand quit working. Tests have proven the motor works (jacked power to the red and brown from a battery charger, motor just hummed sweetly away). The signal I'm getting is that of side stand down but it's not. The failure was 100% between normal deployment and nothing at all but flashing lights on the dashboard.

Hints/suggestions, anyone, other than take-it-off-and-rebuild-it?
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post #27 of 33 Old Feb 20th, 2015, 8:09 pm
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

Can't remember the specific signal on dash, but... Check your rear brake light is working correctly.
A blown or faulty bulb will also disrupt the EHCS from deploying.

Chris
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post #28 of 33 Old Feb 20th, 2015, 10:27 pm
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

Sounds like you have one of the interlocks still set if you get a flashing light and no motor sound. They are brakes off (check for stuck switch and brake light on), in neutral, side stand up and bike level. A rebuild will not do anything for this issue.

If you are hearing the electric motor run but see no movement on the piston shaft. You are likely low on oil. These hold about 140 ml and a loss of 10-15 ml is enough to stop lifting. The only reason these get low on oil is a seal leak on the shaft. If you had the unit off when you did the test it must be oriented just as it is on the bike or it will not move.

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2005 K1200LT Ocean Blue Blue Wizard 110 K and counting...
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post #29 of 33 Old Aug 9th, 2015, 11:46 pm
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

Hi Guys,
Here's a slightly different EHCS issue:
After having the entire CS assembly off the bike, and having cleaned it thoroughly, now it doesn't "snap back" up when I roll it off the stand. If I put the bike on the side stand I can reach under an push the CS up. It has a lot of resistance for the first inch or so of travel of the piston coming out of the cylinder, then it pops up.

Is it possible that it is low on fluid, (there is some seeping from somewhere) and that the unit relies on some internal pressure to force the piston back out that initial amount?

And yes, I have lubed all of the pivots and re-adjusted all of the mounting bolts to be sure it is in the correct alignment.

Thanks,



GB

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post #30 of 33 Old Aug 10th, 2015, 7:46 pm
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

The piston should operate smoothly for the length of travel (about 4 inches). The pivots are sealed with o-rings so unless you removed the pucks (no. 7) on each side you did not lube the stand. The stand should move freely while on the side stand and pop back up to the bumper when you push it down to the ground and release it. If not it needs lube. The normal position for the actuator shaft is fully extended and (if you jacked the bike up in the air) the shaft should not prevent the stand from fully deploying and going back up. The actuator piston should fully extend as soon as the stand is deployed and the motor has stopped running and not interfere with the stand retracting. If it is then something has gone wrong internally but that is strange if it will actually deploy the stand OK. I only found one actuator that refused to operate and the owner had re-installed the internal spring on the wrong side of the piston.
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post #31 of 33 Old Aug 22nd, 2015, 7:07 pm
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

Cannot recommend J. Zeiler's rebuilds highly enough. (Mine did an 100% fail between uses -- fluid leaked out. There's only a few ccs of it and I suppose when the seal goes one run of the pump can blow it all out.
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post #32 of 33 Old May 27th, 2016, 10:47 pm
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

I'm Attempting a rebuild of mine. It seems the springs on the motor commutators have broken and was causing the pump motor to not function. I have disassembled the entire pump. Cleaned and replaced the seven year old fluid.

The motor is working but struggles to get up to speed. This is with the lift unit off the bike. I'm going to see if I can get a new motor shipped down here to Australia.
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post #33 of 33 Old May 28th, 2016, 6:31 am
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Re: Center stand check fluid?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adelie View Post
I'm Attempting a rebuild of mine. It seems the springs on the motor commutators have broken and was causing the pump motor to not function. I have disassembled the entire pump. Cleaned and replaced the seven year old fluid.

The motor is working but struggles to get up to speed. This is with the lift unit off the bike. I'm going to see if I can get a new motor shipped down here to Australia.
I've had several shipped to Sydney from the US.
Have a good hunt for best price/shipping rates
Eg https://www.ombwarehouse.com/Starter...10-Spline.html
Lots of varying prices for same thing.... Search HS-50N starter

Chris
Sydney, NSW
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