Scoot's starter to slave... - BMW Luxury Touring Community
 
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post #1 of 12 Old Apr 30th, 2010, 12:33 am Thread Starter
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Thumbs down Scoot's starter to slave...

Well, about a week and half ago I began to tear my bike down. I had a starter issue--the bolt on the starter was loose and I tightened it up. However, a week later I noticed that sometimes the only way to start the bike was to bump start it. She would run like a champ and typically would start once or twice after that but then the same thing--no start. No headlight--nothing. (I put a new battery in, alternator is charging great, all the ground connections seem to be good, etc.) Well, since I could not guarantee that I would always have a hill or steep incline around--I decided to fix it real good! I read a thread were another rider was having the same trouble...turned out that oil had seeped into the starter and kept the brushes from making good contact. Well, my starter is 3/4 covered!

So, I began what I can only describe as the adventure of a lifetime I stripped her down and am ready to pull the tranny bolt and raise the bike frame to expose my quest my oily starter. However, when I disconnected my slave I found she was a bit wet. I apologize for the quality of the pics--all I had on me was my Blackberry. I have quit for the night...hit it again tomorrow after work.
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Wade
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99 K-1200LT
82 Yamaha Virago (Girl of my youth)

"No one knows as much as all of us do." --General George Patton



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post #2 of 12 Old Apr 30th, 2010, 9:43 am
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Re: Scoot's starter to slave...

The wetness can be either transmission oil from a leaking seal, or brake fluid from the failed slave cylinder. No matter which one it is, replace both the transmission seals (all of them) AND the slave cylinder. Brake fluid damages the seal, oil damages the slave cylinder, so no matter which one fails both have to be replaced.

Pretty easy to replace all the transmission seals when it is out, and good to do anyway. The front seal failing will wipe out the clutch as easily as a failed slave cylinder will.

When the clutch is out, replace the engine output seal and O-ring. I think someone purchased Viton O-rings and has several on hand, but I do not remember who it was now.

If not already done, be sure you drill the drain hole in the transmission boss right under the slave mount to prevent future slave failure from taking out the clutch.

I don't want to achieve immortality through my work...I want to achieve it through not dying.

David Shealey
Dandridge, TN
EX: '01 Black LT, BAT BYKE (Totaled at 110,000 miles)
IBA SS, BB, BBG, 10/10ths.
No bike now, but maybe in the future.
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post #3 of 12 Old Apr 30th, 2010, 11:42 am Thread Starter
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Re: Scoot's starter to slave...

I'm planning on drilling the slave anyway...how many seals am I talking? Since, I'm going to have the tranny off anyway due to the starter.

Wade
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"No one knows as much as all of us do." --General George Patton



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post #4 of 12 Old Apr 30th, 2010, 11:57 am
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Re: Scoot's starter to slave...

Quote:
Originally Posted by wrmoss
I'm planning on drilling the slave anyway...how many seals am I talking? Since, I'm going to have the tranny off anyway due to the starter.
Three seals on the transmission (front and rear input shaft seals, and output shaft seal). You do have to be sure and seat the new seals to the same depth as the ones removed. Measure before removal.

One engine output shaft seal and it's O-ring. The O-ring is the more normal failure culprit for engine rear seal oil leak.

There are a couple smaller seals on the transmission, shift input shaft etc., but these rarely are a problem.

I don't want to achieve immortality through my work...I want to achieve it through not dying.

David Shealey
Dandridge, TN
EX: '01 Black LT, BAT BYKE (Totaled at 110,000 miles)
IBA SS, BB, BBG, 10/10ths.
No bike now, but maybe in the future.
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post #5 of 12 Old Apr 30th, 2010, 12:07 pm
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Re: Scoot's starter to slave...

Wade,

Think about replacing the transmission input bearing at the same time. The bearing cage on these disintegrates and makes a mess out of the tranny. This happened on my 2000 and I ended up costing me $500 for a good used transmission.

Phil Konzak

1972 Honda SL 125 (1 st bike)(rest in peace)
1974 Honda CB350 F1 (smoothness personified)
1973 Honda CB350 twin (unsafe at any speed)
1971 Kawasaki H-1A 500 (wheelie King)
1975 Honda GL1000 (4 into 1 header, Vetter fairing)
1981 KTM 420 Enduro (fast and smooth)
1979 Yamaha 750 Special (suprisingly fast)
1981 Honda GL1100 Interstate (rough rider)
2000 K1200LT ICon (gone but not forgotten)

2003 K1200LTE Silver Lightning 131,637 miles 07/01/13

Gear Up Every Time You Ride !
The Skin You Save Will Be Your Own !

I'm sorry but the laws of physics prevent me from going any faster than the vehicle directly in front of me !
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post #6 of 12 Old Apr 30th, 2010, 2:38 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Scoot's starter to slave...

I found the part numbers for most of the seals with the exception of the engine output shaft seal. Does anybody know what the part number for it? I found the forum member that had the extra Viton O-rings and have a message to him.

Also, I could not discern what the Transmission output bearing is...anybody have the part number on it?

Thanks in advance...

Wade
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"No one knows as much as all of us do." --General George Patton



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post #7 of 12 Old Apr 30th, 2010, 2:39 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Scoot's starter to slave...

Check that earlier thread...it should read Transmission Input bearing

Wade
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99 K-1200LT
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"No one knows as much as all of us do." --General George Patton



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post #8 of 12 Old Apr 30th, 2010, 5:07 pm
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Re: Scoot's starter to slave...

The engine output seal is # 11 11 7 666 186

The transmission input (drive) shaft bearings are
front- 23 12 2 230 176 ( this one is the one right behind the clutch that has occasionally failed on LT's)

rear- 23 12 2 230 175

Transmission output shaft bearing is 23 11 7 687 089 (both front and rear)

I don't want to achieve immortality through my work...I want to achieve it through not dying.

David Shealey
Dandridge, TN
EX: '01 Black LT, BAT BYKE (Totaled at 110,000 miles)
IBA SS, BB, BBG, 10/10ths.
No bike now, but maybe in the future.
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post #9 of 12 Old Apr 30th, 2010, 6:05 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Scoot's starter to slave...

Thanks David and all the rest for your help. I'll give you updates on my progress.

Wade
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"No one knows as much as all of us do." --General George Patton



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post #10 of 12 Old Apr 30th, 2010, 11:02 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Scoot's starter to slave...

Just an update...tranny is removed! The starter upon initial inspection was not as oil covered as I first thought. However, upon removal and examination oil was everywhere inside the casing. I wonder if at some point the bike had not been overfilled with oil--just a thought.

Also, the clutch looked great--since I had never experienced any slippage or problems with the clutch I am not to concerned. I think I have read that someone cleaned the clutch housing with brake cleaner? I cannot remember exactly--how do you know if you have excessive wear and tear on the clutch? I have about 53,000 on the clock.

Also, I am rather reluctant to mention that I bent my pushrod because I forgot to pull it out before removing the tranny... I have looked at ebay--but I didn't find one. They are about $58.00 brand new. Hate it when I do dumb stuff like that.
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Wade
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"No one knows as much as all of us do." --General George Patton



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post #11 of 12 Old May 15th, 2010, 11:32 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Scoot's starter to slave...

Well, I got all the necessary parts in this week to start putting my scoot back together...after working all day I placed the battery in it's box and held my breath (this is after all, the very reason I started this little adventure almost three weeks ago--the starter was unreliable.)

Reset the TPS and then turned the key back on and she fired right up! Tomorrow, I hope to put on the swingarm, final drive, new brake pads on the rear and button her up in time for the monday morning commute...I can hardly wait to ride again.

I had to place a new slave cylinder on her--is it hard to bleed the clutch...I do not have speed bleeder or vacuum pump...which is best or can I get by without them?

Wade
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"No one knows as much as all of us do." --General George Patton



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post #12 of 12 Old May 16th, 2010, 12:27 pm
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Re: Scoot's starter to slave...

You can use a speed bleeder on the clutch, at least I have successfully.

Did you replace the rear main seal and the o-ring behind the clutch ? Did you change the bearings yourself ? How difficult was it if you did ?

I've done one trans swap and now that I've done it and have all the things I need it's relatively easy. I also will take the advice of the dealers mechanics and not take so much stuff loose (intake) next time to save time and agravation.

Glad to hear it's going well. Maybe it will stop raining soon so we can have some good riding.

Phil Konzak

1972 Honda SL 125 (1 st bike)(rest in peace)
1974 Honda CB350 F1 (smoothness personified)
1973 Honda CB350 twin (unsafe at any speed)
1971 Kawasaki H-1A 500 (wheelie King)
1975 Honda GL1000 (4 into 1 header, Vetter fairing)
1981 KTM 420 Enduro (fast and smooth)
1979 Yamaha 750 Special (suprisingly fast)
1981 Honda GL1100 Interstate (rough rider)
2000 K1200LT ICon (gone but not forgotten)

2003 K1200LTE Silver Lightning 131,637 miles 07/01/13

Gear Up Every Time You Ride !
The Skin You Save Will Be Your Own !

I'm sorry but the laws of physics prevent me from going any faster than the vehicle directly in front of me !
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