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post #1 of 27 Old Jan 3rd, 2010, 3:39 pm Thread Starter
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Question Major winter overhaul related questions...

Howdy all,

as I have run out of farkle ideas and the winter has hit us pretty hard this year I thought that let's do some maintenance projects for change.And 100.000 km and six riding seasons is also a good milestone. Plus during my last rides before the snow I though I felt my clutch slipping (which I'm not 100% sure but it left me a bit uncomfortable).

So my job list for this winter is:
- open the clutch and change the friction plates
- change the slave cylinder
- change my FD to the spare one I purchased last year from Tony (LTParts.com). This one has a whole 6 miles on it...The present FD will later be opened and checked per instructions by Charle VT.
- change the throttle cables

Now the bike is pretty much spread all over my garage but I have encounterd some issues that I would need some assistance:

1) Throttle cables: I purchased the cables already last summer from the dealer and now when I started installing them I realized that the ones I got are different than my present ones. The part number 32737694490 at http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts...68&hg=32&fg=20 seems to be the same through all the model years although I know that there have been at least two or threee different throttle cable evolutions.I attach picture of my existing throttle cable (handlebar) end and a pic of the new cable. Is it possible that I have received earlier model cables? And is the above mentioned part number valid for the new facelift throttle cables.

2) Clutch push rod:
I have taken out the slave cylinder (looks OK, but I will change it anyhow) but the question is how are you supposed to pull out the clutch push rod? It will not come out with fingers, I have also tried with pliers but no luck.The gearbox is still in place.

Thanks in advance and all the best for the New Year!
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Ari "the Farkle-Freak-Finn" Ignatius

Hyvinkää, Finland
2004 ('05) LT, Dark Graphite, "Sunset Cruiser II"

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post #2 of 27 Old Jan 3rd, 2010, 4:22 pm
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Smile Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

On the slave, make sure you use new washers (4) to attach the clutch lines.
Check your seals for leaking, replacing them is a good idea while there.
Check your race bearings when you change your final drive out.
Pull hard and your clutch rod will come out. Check that it has not broken off at the one end.
as far as your cables, someone will have to lead you in the right direction. Sorry.
good luck

Courage doesn't always roar. Sometimes it is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying " I'll try again tomorrow".


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post #3 of 27 Old Jan 3rd, 2010, 5:19 pm
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

Ari,

You have the right new cables. What you need is the "repair kit" that replaces the mounting point at the grips.

327 276 919 90 - Repair Kit

You remove the existing part and snip it off and install the kit in it's place.

Here is a good link to some photos: http://picasaweb.google.com/dtnicks/...bleReplacement
Attached Files
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John
2009 K1300GT Red Rocket
2009 R1200GS (Gone)
2005 K1200LT Ocean Blue Blue Wizard 110 K and counting...
2006 Bushtec Turbo+2 Spell
2004 330 Ci Convertable
K4AN

Have ridden a Motorcycle in all 48
But lack DE, MA, RI and CT with the 2005 LT

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post #4 of 27 Old Jan 3rd, 2010, 5:28 pm
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

Ari - this will probably confuse more than help, but the part numbers below were listed in the Throttle cable service bulletin of Feb, 2003, as replacement for the OEM cables that were installed on bikes prior to VIN # ZD79401. It does look like the part number you listed is a newer #, based on the last 5 digits.

Cable for throttle opening: 32 73 7 676 454
Cable for throttle closing: 32 73 7 675 482

There is a GOOD chance that these part numbers have since been replaced by more recent changes, but I don't find any recent TSB that indicates that. Hopefully, if so, someone is keeping better records than me, and will chime in. Good luck on your wrenching project, Ari. Lotsa folks stand ready to help if you need it.
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post #5 of 27 Old Jan 3rd, 2010, 10:34 pm
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

I think if the rod is not spinning in the slave it could damage the slave....
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post #6 of 27 Old Jan 4th, 2010, 11:12 am
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

Ari,


You should be able to pull the rod out with a pair of pliers. Give it a good tug. If not can you determine if it will rotate? If it does not rotate easily it maybe friction welded to the release plate.

John
2009 K1300GT Red Rocket
2009 R1200GS (Gone)
2005 K1200LT Ocean Blue Blue Wizard 110 K and counting...
2006 Bushtec Turbo+2 Spell
2004 330 Ci Convertable
K4AN

Have ridden a Motorcycle in all 48
But lack DE, MA, RI and CT with the 2005 LT

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post #7 of 27 Old Jan 4th, 2010, 12:16 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

Thank you all for the advise!

First of all I learned that although my bike is the "05" model (actually produced in Nov 2003) it still is "old skuul" as far as the throttle cables is concerned. I have heard about (and actually ridden too) an older model K 12 LT with a very stiff throttle but mine has always worked like a charm so I have thought my bike already has the latest model cables...
The original reason for changing the cables is just preventive maintenance as one of my buddies broke his 06 throttle cable at 125.000 km. It broke from the motor end.
So... in order to be able to use these new cables I need to purcase the upgrade kit.

About the push rod...it seems to be wiggling a bit but I have not checked whether it rotates freely. I just tried to pull it at first with my fingers and then with a set of pliers but then I was afraid to scratch or otherwise damage the end of the rod. But now that I know there is nothing holding it, I will just add force and let's see what happens...

Thanks again and I will be back with more questions as soon as my project proceeds.It will be another few weeks before I actually attack the gearbox and clutch since it means that my car will be thrown out from the garage and I don't want to do that at the curremt winter temperatures...

Regards

Ari "the Farkle-Freak-Finn" Ignatius

Hyvinkää, Finland
2004 ('05) LT, Dark Graphite, "Sunset Cruiser II"

Bike trip from Finland to USA:

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post #8 of 27 Old Jan 4th, 2010, 7:45 pm
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

Quote:
Originally Posted by pozo_izquierdo
Howdy all,
as I have run out of farkle ideas ...
Huh? WTF?
Ari is out of FARKLING IDEAS? What has this world come to?

By the way, I'll add to the chorus: I was able to pull out the clutch rod on my GS just with my fingers.

Robert in Northern NJ

'09 R12GS, '08 R12RT, '03 R1150RT, '01 F650GS - time to thin the herd?


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post #9 of 27 Old Jan 4th, 2010, 7:46 pm
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

Yeah my 05 (April 2004 build date) did not have the "05 cables". I installed them when I found a frayed cable during my clutch job. They are a little better than the old stock ones and that is why I had not done the mod earlier. But they do look like they will last longer.

John
2009 K1300GT Red Rocket
2009 R1200GS (Gone)
2005 K1200LT Ocean Blue Blue Wizard 110 K and counting...
2006 Bushtec Turbo+2 Spell
2004 330 Ci Convertable
K4AN

Have ridden a Motorcycle in all 48
But lack DE, MA, RI and CT with the 2005 LT

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post #10 of 27 Old Jan 5th, 2010, 4:31 am Thread Starter
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

Quote:
Originally Posted by rdwalker
Huh? WTF?
Ari is out of FARKLING IDEAS? What has this world come to?

.
I know Bob, this is pretty embarassing to admit.. but this is the case really

The only gadget I was going to do this winter is to make a kind of a flasher system that wig-wags my extra fog and driving lights in the rare occasions that i'm lane splitting and the cage driver in the front seems not to notice me.
And the other one is to have two pockets made in the back of my Bak-Up backrest for the SO to keep her cell & iPod etc.

And that's pretty much it...I'm open to farkle ideas...

And to save the trouble of proposing something that I already have I enclose my current list :

Standard 2005 LT factory options (alarm, remote locks, ground lights, adjustable passenger floorboards, luggage rack, CD-changer, BMW bag liners etc.)
CeeBailey #2 -3 EuroCut w/ wings
BakUp backrest (motor adjustable)
J-Peg XL highway pegs
Suburban Machinery foot peg relocators
Thomas permant mounted air compressor with two outlets and pressure gauge
BMW Navigator III
Warning light for trunk lid not closed
SmarTire pressure monitoring system
Dauntless Hitch with a luggage rack
Luggage rack mounted 12 V refrigerator
Hella Micro FF halogen fog lights
Hella Micro FF halogen aux. driving lights
Hella Micro DE Xenon driving lights
HID bulb replacement in both OEM high and low beam
Rear fog light
Strobo effect brake light (from Raffy)
K 1200 RS mirrors
Muth Signal mirrors
Phoenix-switch (with Ari’s special “sixpack” mod)
Side marker lights (saddlebag + front fender LEDs
Saddlebag interior leds
Baehr Ultima XL for LT intercom with bluetooth module for cell phone
Baehr Basic intercom with bluetooth (for mommy’s own phone calls)
Baehr Capo II bike-to-bike radio
Lighted BMW-roundel á la BMW Z4
Modified dash with ammeter, voltmeter, engine oil temp, final drive oil temp and manifold vacuum gauges.
Russell Day-Long all leather seats, (driver’s seat with motor adjustable height)
Mercedes” style LED mirror turn signals
Double exhaust pipes (the second for tools)
CD-changer replaced with 40 GB Ipod
Wings of Gold
Gerbings heated pants, jacket, socks & gloves (his & her)
Permanent mounted Dual Heat-Trollers for rider and pillion
Chicane tank bag with integrated cell phone charger
RKA luggage rack bag
Chicane duffel bag
Remus exhaust system with Street & Race cans (for sale)
OEM BMW full cover
Fake CD-antenna (on the right side)
Three video cameras with recorder in Chicane tank bag and remote control on the left handlebar
12 V to 220 V inverter
12 V power socket in the trunk
Permanent jump starter cables
LED lights for the dash, handlebars and oddments box
LED ground lighting
LED lights under the saddle
Ari’s special cup holders
Ari’s special “Highway Handle”
2 flag poles
Ram mounts on the brake and clutch fluid reservoirs
Reversing detectors
Reversing alarm buzzer
Cell phone based alarm system with traps for tank bag and GPS
Camera battery charger
Radar detector (not for domestic use)
Relocated rear spring preload adjuster
Ari’s special rear seat luggage tie down system
Relocated trunk with extra storage for rain gear
Ari’s special saddlebag lid storage for tools and small parts
WUDO special LT tie down system
BMR side case trim protectors
Fiamm auxiliary horns
First Aid kit
Öhlins shocks
All new aux electricals with 24 micro relays and three separate fuse blocks
And of course the famous Gremlin Bell

No armrests for Mommy (she does not want them)
No SAT radio (we don't have them over here)


Regards

Ari "the Farkle-Freak-Finn" Ignatius

Hyvinkää, Finland
2004 ('05) LT, Dark Graphite, "Sunset Cruiser II"

Bike trip from Finland to USA:

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post #11 of 27 Old Jan 5th, 2010, 5:09 am
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

Ejector seat?

"Whenever you find you are on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect" Mark Twain


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post #12 of 27 Old Jan 5th, 2010, 5:52 am
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

Is that all ?
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post #13 of 27 Old Jan 5th, 2010, 12:40 pm
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

Wow , really Luxury Touring Bike.
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post #14 of 27 Old Jan 6th, 2010, 4:05 am
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

Yep. Ari's "Dragon slayer" is quite unique. You must pass three weeks simulator training to be able to run that beast

Born to be wild so why not

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post #15 of 27 Old Jan 6th, 2010, 9:06 am
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

Ari,
Have you weighed that beast since adding those features?
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post #16 of 27 Old Jan 6th, 2010, 9:27 am
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

Ari....I am afraid it is time for a "farkle intervention"....either that or a new bike and start all over again.

Bob Thede
'02 K1200 LT-Blackie II
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post #17 of 27 Old Jan 6th, 2010, 3:32 pm
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

Oh, well. Thot I was done with mine. Now that I have THE LIST, all I have to do is set the priorities. Lessee - trunk lid warning . . . . . . . :-)

Jim Taylor
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post #18 of 27 Old Jan 6th, 2010, 3:49 pm Thread Starter
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Re: MORE Major winter overhaul related questions...

OK, back to business and let's leave the farkles for a while, thanks to all for the good suggestions and comments. (Answer for Channing about the weight..The only time the bike has been on scale was at Toronto airport cargo terminal and the scale showed 442 kilos. But then I had all my riding gear etc packed in the cases, but gas tank had only one gallon of gas...)

1) The clutch push rod: The darn thing was pretty tight to pull out. I really had to squeeze hard with pliers and of course I left marks at the end of the rod ( I guess that part can be smoothened with a file...) . The clutch end of the rod looked as if it has been warm at some stage. See the pics.

2) Throttle cables. The hint that John gave about Dave's pics was really valuable! Even though I still don't have the upgrade part to the handlebar I already installed the new cables by following the excellent documentation by Dave.

3) Throttle bodies. While looking at Dave's Picasa albums I found there another interesting topic: LT Clutch Repair http://picasaweb.google.com/dtnicks/LTClutchRepair#
I'm not yet at the stage of pulling my gearbox out as I told before but instead I'm fiddling around the throttle bodies and I have the same symptoms as Dave had with oily dirt around # 3 cylinder intake area ( with #3 I'm referring to the second cylinder from the rear of the bike, I don't know if it is correct nr...)
If you look at the pics you can see a lot of oily junk particularly around that #3 throttle body and also the intake box is particularly oily at the same spot.

Now I wonder...As you can see in the last pic there is a small crack in the Y-joint of the crankcase ventilating tube - pretty much in the same area as Dave had. However, I'm not 100% sure this crack is really through the tube. But if there is some pressure in the ventilating tube, perhaps the oil can seep through it...

Anyway, I will replace the tube or perhaps I will upgrade it with copper or stainless steel parts or whaddya guys think..?

One more question to the "been there done that" pros: The crankacase ventilation tube was quite easy to peel off from the engine block with a help of a flat screwdriver but how have you put it back???

Regards
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Ari "the Farkle-Freak-Finn" Ignatius

Hyvinkää, Finland
2004 ('05) LT, Dark Graphite, "Sunset Cruiser II"

Bike trip from Finland to USA:

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post #19 of 27 Old Jan 6th, 2010, 10:29 pm
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

Quote:
Originally Posted by rdwalker
Huh? WTF?
Ari is out of FARKLING IDEAS? What has this world come to?

By the way, I'll add to the chorus: I was able to pull out the clutch rod on my GS just with my fingers.
Exactly what I was thinking. This is not possible. It's like reaching the end of the Internet. It's a moving target.

But seriously, Ari:
1. I have no help for you on your repair, but
2. A dream farkle I would like to have is remotely-adjustable driving lights. Sometimes I want my Hella FF200s to point way down the road. Sometimes I want them to point off to the sides of the road. It would be nice to have a setup like electric remotely-operated mirrors. Something like this:

Howard Schisler
2015 BMW K1600GTL
2009 BMW K1200LT - 60k miles
2012 BMW F650GS (sold)
2005 BMW K1200LT - "Gray Ghost", traded at 120k miles
2005 Honda Shadow 650 (sold)
AMA, IBA, BMW MOA. CCRs: Braselton 2006, Osage Beach 2007, Duluth 2012


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post #20 of 27 Old Jan 6th, 2010, 11:50 pm
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

Ari... she's gonna sing some sweet tunes for you when she's back together.. been hurting a while it looks like...

I wonder if this was due to the replacement of the tranny a while back.. pulled and cracked stuff?

as for the clutch pushrod.. I'd say it looks cooked..
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post #21 of 27 Old Feb 11th, 2010, 4:33 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

So, I finally decided to throw my car out of the garage despite that it still is rather cold outside and today I took a day off in order to pull the clutch out.

When looking at the old clutch that had a little over 100.000 km on it I have to say that my feelings of clutch slipping during the last rides before the winter were totally paranoid.

The clutch was totally dry, and the cluch plate was worn from 6,06 mm thickness down to 5,29 mm. So it had worn less than one milllimeter during 100.000 km...The counterparts of the clutch plate had smoothened themselves of course and there was some slight color change noticeable.
But all in all, this clutch job turned out to be more therapy for me than of real need.
I was even somewhat tempted to just change the clutch plat only and leave the other two counterparts for the next job but after calling a professional service technician he got me to second thoughts. He recommended to change the whole set because he has had some cases where a new clutch plate with old counterparts has caused clutch shaking etc. So I changed everything, even the clutch spring...

But, while I was at it, I changed the main seal from engine side and tomorrow I plan to change the gearbox side seals.

Then some questions:

Clymer manual and also BMW manual ask to use a clutch centering tool when installing the clutch assembly back in place. What tool have you guys used or have you made it yourself or have you just centered the clutch assembly with the help of a flashlight and proper phillips screwdriver to the center of the crankshaft hole?
I mean, before tightening the 6 allen screws of the clutch housing cover it would sure be nice to have everything properly centered...

And how did you tighten the 30 mm center nut? Did you use the angle meter to measure the 60 deg turn after the 50 Nm tightening torque? Or did you just leave it at 140 Nm?

Regards
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Ari "the Farkle-Freak-Finn" Ignatius

Hyvinkää, Finland
2004 ('05) LT, Dark Graphite, "Sunset Cruiser II"

Bike trip from Finland to USA:

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post #22 of 27 Old Feb 11th, 2010, 5:30 pm
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

Ari

for centering the clutch plate I used a small hex key (cannot remember the exact size) and ran it round the clutch plate central bezel and the hole in the metal cover - you may get a better idea by looking at your first photo. For the 60 deg tightening one flat of the hex nut is 60 deg so mark where it is on one side and where you want it on the other.

I am glad you are enjoying the work - your garage must be heated - it is still to cold in mine :-/

Regards

Graham Wintersgill
On the bonnnie bonnie banks of Loch Lomond

2001 K1200LT

1995 K75RT now deceased
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post #23 of 27 Old Feb 11th, 2010, 7:20 pm
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

You can "eye ball" it pretty well. Or use the release rod wrapped in tape to fit centered in the clutch disk. The end of the rod goes into the hole in the center of the output shaft.

Mine was definitely oily. Not sopping wet but far more sticky powder than you have and very worn out. (50Kmiles and 4.8mm) Nice job removing the rear seal. Mine (first one) came out OK but I tilted the installation of the new one and it was a bear to remove. At least you will have peace of mind with all the new stuff.

John
2009 K1300GT Red Rocket
2009 R1200GS (Gone)
2005 K1200LT Ocean Blue Blue Wizard 110 K and counting...
2006 Bushtec Turbo+2 Spell
2004 330 Ci Convertable
K4AN

Have ridden a Motorcycle in all 48
But lack DE, MA, RI and CT with the 2005 LT

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Last edited by jzeiler; Feb 11th, 2010 at 7:26 pm.
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post #24 of 27 Old Feb 11th, 2010, 8:37 pm
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

What????John did not answer Ari's questions? I am at an utter loss for words...
Quote:
Clymer manual and also BMW manual ask to use a clutch centering tool when installing the clutch assembly back in place. What tool have you guys used or have you made it yourself or have you just centered the clutch assembly with the help of a flashlight and proper phillips screwdriver to the center of the crankshaft hole?
I mean, before tightening the 6 allen screws of the clutch housing cover it would sure be nice to have everything properly centered...

And how did you tighten the 30 mm center nut? Did you use the angle meter to measure the 60 deg turn after the 50 Nm tightening torque? Or did you just leave it at 140 Nm?
The alignment tool, is not needed I did it both ways, eyeball and with a centering tool. Eyeball was good enough the second go around. As for the tightening, it has been suggested to tighten the nut to 140, then mark a flat, and simply turn to the next flat spot. that will be 60...

Just my opinion......

Hoss
'Stupidity has a knack of getting its way.' --Albert Camus
'05- K1200LT - Gretchen
R.I.P. - '00- K1200LTE- "Barbara" - Retired at 168K 9/2011
MOA, IBA, EXR & RCB and TMI
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post #25 of 27 Old Feb 12th, 2010, 12:10 pm
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

Good catch Hoss, guess I was asleep at the handle bars. 60 degrees is pretty easy on a six point nut! (and it felt like 140Nm +)

John
2009 K1300GT Red Rocket
2009 R1200GS (Gone)
2005 K1200LT Ocean Blue Blue Wizard 110 K and counting...
2006 Bushtec Turbo+2 Spell
2004 330 Ci Convertable
K4AN

Have ridden a Motorcycle in all 48
But lack DE, MA, RI and CT with the 2005 LT

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post #26 of 27 Old Feb 12th, 2010, 2:57 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

Thanks John for the push rod hint!

I used the old push rod and placed some old plastic cap that I found on it.

I got all the gearbox seals changed and got the gearbox back in place plus the centerstand installed.

But...of course I got some damage done as well Damage # 1: When removing the seal from the slave cylinder cavity my drill bit slipped (twice!) between the seal and the cavity wall and made two nice scratches. S**T! This did not do good for tight seal... Well, I applied some silicone sealant in the scrathes and installed the new seal in place and I trust that it will hold...

Damage #2: I had a halogen work light. (the one that runs veeeery hot). Of course one of the loose hanging radio connectors (one of the three on the left side under the radio stingray) touched the hot glass of the halogen light when I was lowering the bike from my cable hoist. And the connector melted so it is dead. Well, this means some extra soldering job but luckily I have some six pin connectors that I can replace this with..

Anyhow, the bike sits again on the dolly and I was able to push it in the garage corner and I got the car back in from the cold...

Now let's see if I can get the bike back together since it has been in pieces for more than a month now. And with no more damages, hopefully...

Regards
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Ari "the Farkle-Freak-Finn" Ignatius

Hyvinkää, Finland
2004 ('05) LT, Dark Graphite, "Sunset Cruiser II"

Bike trip from Finland to USA:

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post #27 of 27 Old Feb 12th, 2010, 7:07 pm
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Re: Major winter overhaul related questions...

Dang Ari,

You need a helper to look out for you. The silicone seal in the scratches should do the job OK.

That light was really hot!! Good luck getting it all back together again, then go have a good ride to feel better.

John
2009 K1300GT Red Rocket
2009 R1200GS (Gone)
2005 K1200LT Ocean Blue Blue Wizard 110 K and counting...
2006 Bushtec Turbo+2 Spell
2004 330 Ci Convertable
K4AN

Have ridden a Motorcycle in all 48
But lack DE, MA, RI and CT with the 2005 LT

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