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post #1 of 19 Old May 11th, 2009, 6:24 am Thread Starter
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Brake Fluid Over Center Stand?

Had to change a rear tire out on Saturday.

Every time I have a wheel of I clean the calibers and pucks to make sure all is well. Well when I dropped the Pads they were shot. I mean in 13,000 miles they were all but to the backing plate. Theses were EBC pads.

Anyway when I installed the new pads and compressed the pucks I had brake fluid running out from somewhere above my center stand. I am pretty freaked about it.

Rear brake reservoir is full, and no idiot lights. Brakes work but pedal does not feel as firm.

What have I done, and can anyone think of where the brake fluid came from?

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post #2 of 19 Old May 11th, 2009, 6:29 am
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Re: Brake Fluid Over Center Stand?

I assume that you didn't remove some of the brake fluid from the rear before you pushed back the pucks. What you are seeing is probably the displaced fluid when you pushed in the pistons which came out the vent. Check the . It is probably over full. Clean it off with soap and water and make sure you don't get any on the bright finished area.
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post #3 of 19 Old May 11th, 2009, 6:31 am
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Re: Brake Fluid Over Center Stand?

Quote:
Originally Posted by LAF
Had to change a rear tire out on Saturday.

Every time I have a wheel of I clean the calibers and pucks to make sure all is well. Well when I dropped the Pads they were shot. I mean in 13,000 miles they were all but to the backing plate. Theses were EBC pads.

Anyway when I installed the new pads and compressed the pucks I had brake fluid running out from somewhere above my center stand. I am pretty freaked about it.

Rear brake reservoir is full, and no idiot lights. Brakes work but pedal does not feel as firm.

What have I done, and can anyone think of where the brake fluid came from?
When you pushed the pistons into the caliper the fluid is also pushed back into the system. If the reservoir was full before you did this the fluid HAS to go some where so it goes out the overflow to the ground. Next time before you install new pads use a syringe to remove some fluid from the reservoir then put the pads in. If you have removed too mush fluid just replace with the syringe.

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post #4 of 19 Old May 11th, 2009, 6:48 am Thread Starter
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Re: Brake Fluid Over Center Stand?

Thanks for the quick responses, and I did assume it came from a vent, just wanted to know where that vent is located? From the rear reservoir there is a line running off it too......?

I assume to the rear brake pedal behind the foot peg plate? Then onto? I am just really trying to find the path to the vent and where it is located? Like I said it rolled down the right side of the center stand.

Thank again for the quick replies.

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post #5 of 19 Old May 11th, 2009, 8:02 am
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Re: Brake Fluid Over Center Stand?

There is not vent above the right center stand. If the brakes feel week after replacing the pads, I think you have a either leak in the hose from the rear master brake cylinder to the rear caliper or a bad rear master brake cylinder. Pull the rider's right side peg plate and take a look.

If you have to replace the master cylinder, change the rear brake line at the same time. I had a rear brake master cylinder failure in July of '07 and had it replaced. I had the brake line fail at CCR '07. I really believe that the new brake master cylinder had so much pressure it caused the rear brake line rupture. Trust me, you don't want to end up like I did on the way home from CCR that year.

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post #6 of 19 Old May 11th, 2009, 8:30 am
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Re: Brake Fluid Over Center Stand?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve_R
There is not vent above the right center stand. If the brakes feel week after replacing the pads, I think you have a either leak in the hose from the rear master brake cylinder to the rear caliper or a bad rear master brake cylinder. Pull the rider's right side peg plate and take a look.

If you have to replace the master cylinder, change the rear brake line at the same time. I had a rear brake master cylinder failure in July of '07 and had it replaced. I had the brake line fail at CCR '07. I really believe that the new brake master cylinder had so much pressure it caused the rear brake line rupture. Trust me, you don't want to end up like I did on the way home from CCR that year.
Steve You'll be glad to know that the Master cylinder "IS" stlll working fine on Lola

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post #7 of 19 Old May 11th, 2009, 9:22 am Thread Starter
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Re: Brake Fluid Over Center Stand?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve_R
There is not vent above the right center stand. If the brakes feel week after replacing the pads, I think you have a either leak in the hose from the rear master brake cylinder to the rear caliper or a bad rear master brake cylinder. Pull the rider's right side peg plate and take a look.

If you have to replace the master cylinder, change the rear brake line at the same time. I had a rear brake master cylinder failure in July of '07 and had it replaced. I had the brake line fail at CCR '07. I really believe that the new brake master cylinder had so much pressure it caused the rear brake line rupture. Trust me, you don't want to end up like I did on the way home from CCR that year.
Thank you and is as I suspected. I will pull the plate and look.

I figured there was a vent somewhere but not sure where. And it made no sense where it was coming from. I am betting I blew a line or master cylinder and it was just shooting to someplace and hitting the center stand or something around it.

Need to look and I wonder if it is warranty? And if not how much is it. Oh well we will see.

Thank you again for advice and helping me move forward on the problem in a logical way.

Lee
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post #8 of 19 Old May 11th, 2009, 10:15 am
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Re: Brake Fluid Over Center Stand?

Quote:
Originally Posted by katnapinn
Steve You'll be glad to know that the Master cylinder "IS" stlll working fine on Lola
What, the new one? I would expect for it to be. It was replaced before they found the broken hose and left it on for free since they missed the hose the first time.

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post #9 of 19 Old May 11th, 2009, 12:00 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Brake Fluid Over Center Stand?

OK came home and pulled the side plate. The master cylinder is dry even after pumping a bunch of times before removal. Hose fittings are dry and the hose as far as I can reach is dry. No fluid exiting anywhere I can see.

Now looking at the ABS unit from what I see there is in fact a hose returning off the ABS pot which I believe to be the rear pot and looks to run back to the right side and can be pulled up and is connected to nothing. Vent? .

If I had a broken hose would not my level drop in the rear reservoir when applying the brake and show fluid as it did yesterday? Or in the ABS pot and trigger a idiot light?

What would a bad master cylinder indications be? Would it be wet?

I appreciate the feedback as brakes are nothing to mess with.

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post #10 of 19 Old May 11th, 2009, 12:29 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Brake Fluid Over Center Stand?

I think #2 is what I am seeing on my 07's ABS.
Attached Images
File Type: bmp k1200lt-m92.bmp (947.9 KB, 76 views)

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post #11 of 19 Old May 11th, 2009, 12:30 pm
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Re: Brake Fluid Over Center Stand?

Lee

Sounds to me like you just pushed fluid out the vent when you pushed the pucks back into the caliper. I'd reset the level in the ABS reservoir (wheel circuit) and consider it good to go. I am assuming you are getting no flashing ABS warnings, correct?

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post #12 of 19 Old May 11th, 2009, 12:38 pm
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Re: Brake Fluid Over Center Stand?

Then it might just be venting backwards and your okay. I'm not sure where that unit sits in the bike. If it is over the right side of the centerstand, then that might explain it being wet with fluid.

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post #13 of 19 Old May 11th, 2009, 12:39 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Brake Fluid Over Center Stand?

Quote:
Originally Posted by VRodPete
Lee

Sounds to me like you just pushed fluid out the vent when you pushed the pucks back into the caliper. I'd reset the level in the ABS reservoir (wheel circuit) and consider it good to go. I am assuming you are getting no flashing ABS warnings, correct?

Pete
No red lights flashing. I think I agree with you at this point. If I pushed that much fluid into the ABS pot (s) I will check them for level and call it a day.

Thanks for the advice.

We all need to get together for a ride instead of work sometime soon.

Lee
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post #14 of 19 Old May 11th, 2009, 12:52 pm
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Re: Brake Fluid Over Center Stand?

Lee,

The 05 and newer wheel circuit reservoirs are located in the ABS unit. The front reservoir is inboard on the ABS unit and is taller than the rear outboard reservoir. The handle brake reservoir is for the front control circuit. The rear reservoir is for the rear control circuit. Mark Nebett wrote a detailed brake flushing on the '02 and later K1200LT Integral Brakes with a later addenda for 05 and newer. I'll look for the link for this and post it. I would flush the rear wheel circuit it no leaks were found.

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Last edited by Daveh; May 11th, 2009 at 1:31 pm.
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post #15 of 19 Old May 11th, 2009, 1:46 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Brake Fluid Over Center Stand?

Quote:
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Then it might just be venting backwards and your okay. I'm not sure where that unit sits in the bike. If it is over the right side of the centerstand, then that might explain it being wet with fluid.
The ABS unit proper sits left hand side, but the #2 part number I posted in the .bmp file routes the vent house over to the right side of the bike.

Lesson learned about taking some fluid out, but that is what is perplexing is my rear reservoir never changed level. So I am not sure how taking fluid from there would have stopped the venting? Would it just allow the circuit to flow and the reservoir would settle out?

And it sure looked like a lot more fluid then the thickness of new pads.

I will get more into a bit later as my 16 year old son has a dentist appointment soon.

Again I cant say enough thank yous to all for their thoughts and help on this.

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post #16 of 19 Old May 11th, 2009, 3:28 pm
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Re: Brake Fluid Over Center Stand?

If you mean the rear reservoir that you can see next to the saddle bag, then that level will not change as it has nothing to do with the fluid that goes to the rear caliper. That reservoir is the shorter one on the ABS unit. The only way to check that level is to remove those cap marked "2" in your attachment and look in through the hole. With the pucks pushed all the way in the level should be right at the top.

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post #17 of 19 Old May 11th, 2009, 3:57 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Brake Fluid Over Center Stand?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jzeiler
If you mean the rear reservoir that you can see next to the saddle bag, then that level will not change as it has nothing to do with the fluid that goes to the rear caliper. That reservoir is the shorter one on the ABS unit. The only way to check that level is to remove those cap marked "2" in your attachment and look in through the hole. With the pucks pushed all the way in the level should be right at the top.
Thanks John will do the visual tomorrow as I assumed it was the only way to know for sure.

Question I have is where did all the fluid come from?

I really don't think I grasp this brake system

Front and rear circuits, ABS and Wheels, and never the two shall meet, correct?

If so, then those pucks depend on what amount of fluid, in what circuit to operate?

I know I did get a wig wag a while back, and had to fill the rear ABS to make it go away.

As I did not measure I don't know for sure but this seemed like a lot more fluid then I recall putting in.

And since many have said to take some out before replacing the pads, where are they taking it out from? Is everyone pulling that rear left side body panel and taking it from the ABS pot?

Anyway too cloudy to have at it today but will get er done tomorrow.

I did just take it around the block and all seems well with no idiot lights.

Not sure what having those pots overfull will do, so need to look. Seems to me from the part breakaway that if one of those pots got overfull, both will be?

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post #18 of 19 Old May 11th, 2009, 5:31 pm
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Re: Brake Fluid Over Center Stand?

Lee,


The wig wag was the bikes way of saying "my pads are worn, please replace them". By adding fluid you postponed the replacement and when you did push the pucks back that fluid you added came out. The proper way is to fill the reservoir with the pucks pushed back - that way you won't overflow the next time you replace them. The wig wag warning is there for a reason - pad wear indicator.

Now the earlier bikes (2001-2004) were a little more sensitive to low fluid. But on the 05 and up it means your pads are about shot.

The fluid IN the ABS mounted reservoirs is the only fluid that goes to the calipers (pushed by the electric pumps). The two "external" reservoirs should never fall unless there is a leak as they transfer the user interface (front brake lever and foot pedal) input to the ABS unit. That fluid goes nowhere except to the ABS unit.

Hope that helped clear it up.

John
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post #19 of 19 Old May 11th, 2009, 6:09 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Brake Fluid Over Center Stand?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jzeiler
Lee,


The wig wag was the bikes way of saying "my pads are worn, please replace them". By adding fluid you postponed the replacement and when you did push the pucks back that fluid you added came out. The proper way is to fill the reservoir with the pucks pushed back - that way you won't overflow the next time you replace them. The wig wag warning is there for a reason - pad wear indicator.

Now the earlier bikes (2001-2004) were a little more sensitive to low fluid. But on the 05 and up it means your pads are about shot.

The fluid IN the ABS mounted reservoirs is the only fluid that goes to the calipers (pushed by the electric pumps). The two "external" reservoirs should never fall unless there is a leak as they transfer the user interface (front brake lever and foot pedal) input to the ABS unit. That fluid goes nowhere except to the ABS unit.

Hope that helped clear it up.
Again John, a great way of splaning to the totaly brain dead.

I understand now. And I never will ignore or fill a wig wag without looking at the pads first!

Lee
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