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post #1 of 42 Old Jan 15th, 2006, 9:52 am Thread Starter
 
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Cruise Control

I have a (new for me) 99 LT. The curise control is not working. The red light comes on on the handlebar when it is turned on, but I can't get it to activate. The instrument panel does not indicate it is on. I recently switched the headlight to HID...maybe I disconnected something inadvertantly. I do not know if the cruise worked when I purchased it; this is the first time I have tried it. Thoughts?
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post #2 of 42 Old Jan 15th, 2006, 10:03 am
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I don't know what climate your in from your profile, But some people
have had trouble with cruise when it gets cold.

It's usually a cable adjustment. Roll the throttle back and see if you can
hear a little click. That's the cruise cancel switch. Let it go and see if
you hear another click, the switch releasing.

There should be a little free play in the throttle grip.

Good Luck

Larry Rusnak
Wadsworth, Ohio
2002 K1200LTC Pacific Blue
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post #3 of 42 Old Jan 15th, 2006, 10:12 am Thread Starter
 
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cruise control

Yeah, I looked further into the archives and see that this is a common problem. Hopefully it will cure itself when the weather gets more respectable. If not, I'll have to check the cables and switches.
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post #4 of 42 Old Jan 15th, 2006, 10:17 am Thread Starter
 
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cruise control

Oh, by the way. I'm in Boston. We lost the NFL playoff game last night and we got 3 inches of snow this morning. Maybe I'll go back to bed and wait for spring.
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post #5 of 42 Old Jan 15th, 2006, 10:36 am
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It's a pretty simple thumbwheel adjustment at the grip.
Biggest problem is getting them too tight and the cables tighten up.

Good Luck

Larry Rusnak
Wadsworth, Ohio
2002 K1200LTC Pacific Blue
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post #6 of 42 Old Jan 15th, 2006, 4:01 pm
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Your problem is definitely cold weather. Mine won't function below about 70 degrees. One solution is leave the right handle bar in the sun for about 45 minutes which works for me in the Houston area during the winter. However, after riding for awhile the cold wind will sometimes cause it to stop working again. Sometimes, turning on the heated grips to maximum will work.

Of course, you can always ask your BMW dealer to adjust it.
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post #7 of 42 Old Jan 15th, 2006, 4:48 pm
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Guess I am lucky then (or the european modells are a tad different?). I am riding all year and these days we have allways between -10 and -3 degrees Celcius. The cruise control works just fine on the highway.

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post #8 of 42 Old Jan 15th, 2006, 5:57 pm
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Check the screws on the clutch cover

I've had several instances where my cruise wouldn't engage. The last time was after they replaced the clutch do to a leaking main seal. It seems if you torque the cover screws down too tight, the switch won't engage. My screws are on tight enough to keep the clutch fluid in, but not tight enough to cause the switch not to make.

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post #9 of 42 Old Jan 22nd, 2006, 1:45 am
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Cruise control

My previous LT (03) developed the same problem Started in cold weather and gradually worsend. It was a micro switch. Replace that and it ran fine. The cold weather is when if first started to show.

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post #10 of 42 Old Jan 22nd, 2006, 6:17 am
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcra
Guess I am lucky then (or the european modells are a tad different?). I am riding all year and these days we have allways between -10 and -3 degrees Celcius. The cruise control works just fine on the highway.
I don't think its related to US/Europe model differences as my cruise also works just fine at low temps. I used it when it was 38 f(3.3 C--no, i'm not smart enough to convert it on my own-i used a conversion webpage) degrees and have used it more than a few times now with temps in the 40s (7ish C)--haven't had a problem with it at all.
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post #11 of 42 Old Jan 22nd, 2006, 5:11 pm
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My cruise also works fine at all temps. But yeah, it's gotta be adjusted carefully, and the clutch micro switch is the most common issue.

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post #12 of 42 Old Jan 22nd, 2006, 10:46 pm
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I'll second the clutch micro-switch. Most of them I've seen that are non-functioning, or sporadic, is that switch.



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post #13 of 42 Old Jan 23rd, 2006, 5:16 am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goodbob
Oh, by the way. I'm in Boston. We lost the NFL playoff game last night and we got 3 inches of snow this morning. Maybe I'll go back to bed and wait for spring.

BTW, how did you find out it was not working?? With 3 inches of snow????
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post #14 of 42 Old Jan 23rd, 2006, 4:53 pm Thread Starter
 
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Ahhh. You are not familiar with Boston weather. It was 60 degrees one day and then snow the next.

I took everything apart on the clutch and throttle and couldn't seem to make it work. I will take a look at the micro switch in the spring. We had another few days of 50 degree weather this last week for good riding and then 7 inches of snow today. I think I will be developing surface cracks in my body if this freeze then thaw keeps up.
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post #15 of 42 Old Jan 23rd, 2006, 8:40 pm
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Ok, I just had the problem this morning. I came from Phoenix area last week to Atlanta, then over the weekend went to Daytona Beach. Temps on the way over down to 40 degrees. Cruise worked fine until returning back to Alanta this morning (light rain and fog with temps mid 40's). I tapped the clutch to knock off the cruise for traffic and it would not reset. Same symptoms...light is on, but will not engage.
I pulled in rain, so did not stop to look at it.
Should I try adjusting the tension thumbwheel on the clutch lever?
The 2000 mile trip home on Friday and Saturday will be hard on my right hand and shoulder with cruise control.
Lowell
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post #16 of 42 Old Jan 23rd, 2006, 9:15 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lvahl
Should I try adjusting the tension thumbwheel on the clutch lever?
Lowell
I doubt it will help, but you can try. I'd whip the cover off and adjust the microswitch.



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post #17 of 42 Old Jan 25th, 2006, 4:05 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goodbob
I have a (new for me) 99 LT. The curise control is not working. The red light comes on on the handlebar when it is turned on, but I can't get it to activate. The instrument panel does not indicate it is on. I recently switched the headlight to HID...maybe I disconnected something inadvertantly. I do not know if the cruise worked when I purchased it; this is the first time I have tried it. Thoughts?
There's also another micro-switch at the throttle rail associated with the throttle closing cable; this was the one that was giving me trouble on my '02 until I adjusted it.

Next time it's cold (like now ) and the cruise isn't working, use the 10(?)-step cruise control diagnostic procedure (copy in the HOW) to narrow the fault sources down. The procedure isn't foolproof, but it's useful 95% of the time. It at least is a disciplined approach to finding the problem, and should help you determine whether it's the microswitch at the clutch, the front brake, the rear brake, or the throttle rail (assuming it's a microswitch problem in the first place).

Mark Neblett
Fairfax, VA
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post #18 of 42 Old Jan 26th, 2006, 11:30 pm
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Just purchased a 2000 k12lt with nonop cruise control. The dealer checked the system and determined the stiff throttle cables had place a higher load on the solenoid than it and the linkage at the throttle bodies could overcome. Replaced the cables (really smooth and easy throttle operation now) and that cured the problem. Have a dealer tech diagnose the cruse for you.
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post #19 of 42 Old Jan 28th, 2006, 1:30 pm Thread Starter
 
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Thanks for the pointer to the 10 step diagnostic check.

It is the microswitch. That will save me some time fiddling with the throttle free-play although I guess I will have to anyway when I replace the switch.

Cheers
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post #20 of 42 Old Jan 28th, 2006, 2:00 pm
 
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Rear brake pedal?

I discovered that an improperly placed right foot ever so slightly on brake pedal could keep it from engaging. Also the micro switch associated with rear brake can stick when its cold. A couple of quick jabs and a check that your brake light light is off might just do the trick. I started a 1000+ mile ride and had resigned to no cruise the first 100 miles until I figured it out.

Good luck

Jeff
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post #21 of 42 Old Jan 28th, 2006, 2:03 pm
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I'd try adjusting the switch first before replacing it. Never had to replace one yet.

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post #22 of 42 Old Jan 28th, 2006, 2:07 pm
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OOPs, guess I haven't use my laptop since Floyd spent the night.

I'd try adjusting the switch first before replacing it. Never had to replace one yet.



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post #23 of 42 Old Jan 28th, 2006, 2:39 pm
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Where to from here?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mneblett
There's also another micro-switch at the throttle rail associated with the throttle closing cable; this was the one that was giving me trouble on my '02 until I adjusted it.

Next time it's cold (like now ) and the cruise isn't working, use the 10(?)-step cruise control diagnostic procedure (copy in the HOW) to narrow the fault sources down. The procedure isn't foolproof, but it's useful 95% of the time. It at least is a disciplined approach to finding the problem, and should help you determine whether it's the microswitch at the clutch, the front brake, the rear brake, or the throttle rail (assuming it's a microswitch problem in the first place).
I used the 10 step diagnostic process and I can only get as far as number 4 with success. What now? Thanks in advance for your help.

Process: http://www.bmwlt.net/ubbthreads/show...=&view=&sb=&o=

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post #24 of 42 Old Jan 28th, 2006, 7:11 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ErnieA
I used the 10 step diagnostic process and I can only get as far as number 4 with success. What now? Thanks in advance for your help.

Process: http://www.bmwlt.net/ubbthreads/show...=&view=&sb=&o=
Do you mean step 4 is successful and the procedure fails at step 5, or it fails at step 4?

If the former, that tells you that the microswitch at the throttle rail is not being triggered. This suggests either a throttle freeplay adjustment is needed (per the Repair Manual procedure), or the microswitch at the throttle rail needs to be adjusted (screws loosened, switch moved sideways, retighten screws).

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post #25 of 42 Old Jan 28th, 2006, 7:26 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mneblett
Do you mean step 4 is successful and the procedure fails at step 5, or it fails at step 4?

If the former, that tells you that the microswitch at the throttle rail is not being triggered. This suggests either a throttle freeplay adjustment is needed (per the Repair Manual procedure), or the microswitch at the throttle rail needs to be adjusted (screws loosened, switch moved sideways, retighten screws).
The former. It is what I was thinking since I just replaced the throttle cables with the new '05 kit. I also replaced the cruise control cable while I was at it. I adjusted the cables using the '02 adjustment clearances making the assumption that clearances (cable end play) should remain the same as before.

I was having problems with my CC on the way too and from CCR in August. It would get temperamental when damp and when cold, or both. Often I was able to get the CC to set when pushing the clutch lever out before pressing the set button. This might be coincidence however it was a get the CC working more often than not.

Thanks for helping. I'll get out there tonight and check the micro-switch and cable play.

Ernie

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post #26 of 42 Old Jan 28th, 2006, 11:24 pm
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Question Diagnostic Tree

I was able to adjust the throttle cable and get past #6 in the tree. Then I've run up against some resistance:

#6) Pull the clutch lever (light), release the clutch lever (Light off)
a) Works great every time.

#7) Pull the front brake lever, (light) release the brake lever (light off)
a) The first couple tests it did not come on, but now works

#8) Push the foot brake pedal (light on), hold for 5 seconds (light off), release foot pedal (light on).
a) Release the pedal and the light stays off after hearing a "click" and feeling something move in the throttle mechanism.

#9) Rotate the rear wheel (light should go off/on)
a) Can not get to this point since the light will not stay on.

#10) Switch off the ignition

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post #27 of 42 Old Jan 29th, 2006, 11:57 am Thread Starter
 
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I just checked the prices for the various micro-switches. They run $40 to $70 bucks just for the parts. It will be very nice if adjustment versus replacement will work.

Judging from other member responses to similar problems with their cruise controls, it appears as though BMW did not come up with a very robust solution for this function. Personally I'd rather go back to the very low tech solution of a simple clamp. It wasn't terribly elegant, but it sure was easy to use, fix and enjoy.....My 2 cents. On the other hand if BMW actually had one that worked reliably and could be tuned easily, that would be even better. As it is now, I am looking at forking over a big check to Hans to fix it; my knowledge and skill level doesn't appear to be up to the task.
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post #28 of 42 Old Jan 29th, 2006, 1:56 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goodbob
I just checked the prices for the various micro-switches. They run $40 to $70 bucks just for the parts. It will be very nice if adjustment versus replacement will work.

Judging from other member responses to similar problems with their cruise controls, it appears as though BMW did not come up with a very robust solution for this function. Personally I'd rather go back to the very low tech solution of a simple clamp. It wasn't terribly elegant, but it sure was easy to use, fix and enjoy.....My 2 cents. On the other hand if BMW actually had one that worked reliably and could be tuned easily, that would be even better. As it is now, I am looking at forking over a big check to Hans to fix it; my knowledge and skill level doesn't appear to be up to the task.
Did you run through the diagnostic tree (10 steps)? If so where is the fault? I found that the first fault was in the switch at the fuel rail, but it was just a cable adjustment at the throttle. Then I was able to get through to #8 at the foot brake. I'm investigating whether or not the adjustment has been changed due to our tech session having the right footpeg off two weeks ago. After I fix that the last check is spinning the rear wheel for I'm guessing is a speedo sensor check. Let's work together to see if we can save shelling out quite a few of our hard earned bucks to Hans and go have a beer with the $$ instead.

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post #29 of 42 Old Jan 29th, 2006, 8:03 pm Thread Starter
 
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It fails at step 5. 6, 7, and 8 also will not work. I fiddled with the throttle cables to get a touch more play and that didn't work. Also I fiddled with the CC cable that runs down the left side under the fairing to make sure that it wasn't pinched, etc.
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post #30 of 42 Old Jan 29th, 2006, 8:49 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goodbob
It fails at step 5. 6, 7, and 8 also will not work. I fiddled with the throttle cables to get a touch more play and that didn't work. Also I fiddled with the CC cable that runs down the left side under the fairing to make sure that it wasn't pinched, etc.
Do you have the left panel off? Can you see the switch on the fuel rail? Is there play at the switch? I've found (in the past) that the cables can be bound up in the routing and it might be tight at the bottom and still have play at the top (throttle). It is more of a "kink" down at the bottom where the cable housing comes in contact with the micro-switch. Look at the switch and have someone rotate the throttle back to see if the switch in activating properly. The switch might have to be "re-mounted" like what has been done this board before.

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post #31 of 42 Old Jan 30th, 2006, 2:51 pm Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ErnieA
Do you have the left panel off? Can you see the switch on the fuel rail? Is there play at the switch? I've found (in the past) that the cables can be bound up in the routing and it might be tight at the bottom and still have play at the top (throttle). It is more of a "kink" down at the bottom where the cable housing comes in contact with the micro-switch. Look at the switch and have someone rotate the throttle back to see if the switch in activating properly. The switch might have to be "re-mounted" like what has been done this board before.
I have the left panel off. The CC cable goes into a female receptacle (housing) and it appears to be unkinked and tight. Is that what you wanted me to check? The plastic housing for the radiator fan blocks the view, so I am not sure where the fuel rail is exactly. I can't "see" the microswitch if that is where it is supposed to be. Perhaps it might be better if we took this off-line. I don't know if anyone else is terribly interested. Also, I have the maintenance manual for the bike, but it is not terribly helpful. Lots of words, but not much in the way of illustration.
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post #32 of 42 Old Jan 30th, 2006, 3:14 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goodbob
I have the left panel off. The CC cable goes into a female receptacle (housing) and it appears to be unkinked and tight. Is that what you wanted me to check? The plastic housing for the radiator fan blocks the view, so I am not sure where the fuel rail is exactly. I can't "see" the microswitch if that is where it is supposed to be. Perhaps it might be better if we took this off-line. I don't know if anyone else is terribly interested. Also, I have the maintenance manual for the bike, but it is not terribly helpful. Lots of words, but not much in the way of illustration.
These pics should help visualize. The first is an overview of what you see when you remove the tank (actually, you'll also see the vacuum lines and canister purge solenoid; mine was removed and vacuum ports at each throttle body capped with the little rubber caps visible in the pic). The closer cable, with its vertical "tab" which actuates the throttle rail cc switch, is dead center in the pic. The cable directly under it is the opener cable.

The second pic is the switch in the actuated position (throttle rotated fully closed).

The last pic is the un-actuated position.

HTH!
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Mark Neblett
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post #33 of 42 Old Jan 30th, 2006, 4:01 pm
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Cable Pictures

I do not think your problem is with your CC cable itself. If you have to reach the "Microswitch" it will require removal of the fuel tank. See my attempt to take pictures and explain my earlier post.
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Ernie A
Milwaukie, OR
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2013 R1200GSW
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> 28k miles!
2002 K12LT Toscana Green - > 241k miles (Sold)
2006 Suzuki DL1000 V Strom Silver/Blk - >21k (Sold)
SS1K (x4),BB,BtoB(<24),BBG, SS3k


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post #34 of 42 Old Jan 30th, 2006, 4:06 pm
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Smile Thank you, Thank you

Thanks for the better pictures and explanation. I sent you a PM if you have time to respond.

ErnieA

Ernie A
Milwaukie, OR
Member: MOA, AMA, IBA, NRA, MERA
GS911 & GS911 Wifi - Diagnostics Tools Available
2012 K16GTL (3/2018 to present) 68k (Totaled! 8/11/19 Deer strike)
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2013 R1200GSW
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> 28k miles!
2002 K12LT Toscana Green - > 241k miles (Sold)
2006 Suzuki DL1000 V Strom Silver/Blk - >21k (Sold)
SS1K (x4),BB,BtoB(<24),BBG, SS3k


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post #35 of 42 Old Jan 30th, 2006, 4:24 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ErnieA
Thanks for the better pictures and explanation. I sent you a PM if you have time to respond.

ErnieA
I will definitely get to it; just a bit tied up lately. In fact, I have several PMs I need to respond to -- hope nobody takes my slow response personally -- just been *way* too busy of late to answer the mail. I hope to be able to get to them all in the next day or so.

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post #36 of 42 Old Jan 31st, 2006, 7:42 am Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mneblett
These pics should help visualize. The first is an overview of what you see when you remove the tank (actually, you'll also see the vacuum lines and canister purge solenoid; mine was removed and vacuum ports at each throttle body capped with the little rubber caps visible in the pic). The closer cable, with its vertical "tab" which actuates the throttle rail cc switch, is dead center in the pic. The cable directly under it is the opener cable.

The second pic is the switch in the actuated position (throttle rotated fully closed).

The last pic is the un-actuated position.

HTH!
Great Pix. Aren't digital cameras great?

I will have to wait til the weekend to remove the additional pieces to get to the switch. The repair manual has some very small freeplay tolerances. How do you get so precise? I have a micrometer, but am not sure where or how I would apply it. Sorry for my ignorance. If this turns out to be just an adjustment and something I can do myself, I'll be pleased despite the amount of precious time invested.
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post #37 of 42 Old Jan 31st, 2006, 1:38 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goodbob
Great Pix. Aren't digital cameras great?

I will have to wait til the weekend to remove the additional pieces to get to the switch. The repair manual has some very small freeplay tolerances. How do you get so precise? I have a micrometer, but am not sure where or how I would apply it. Sorry for my ignorance. If this turns out to be just an adjustment and something I can do myself, I'll be pleased despite the amount of precious time invested.
Micrometer?? Hey, not even *I'm* that retentive!

This may be unholy to Mother AG, but I basically ignore the freeplay specs (oh, horror! ).

My objectives:

(a) Minimize throttle cable slack to prevent a sloppy throttle grip, BUT ensure sufficient slack is present on both cables to ensure that the throttle will not be unintentionally actuated when temps go very cold or as the handlebars rotate full lock-to-full lock; and

(b) Ensure positive actuation and release of the cruise control switch at the throttle rail.

I first set the cable slack (the BMW specs are actually good guidelines to get you in the right ballpark), then verify proper cc switch actuation. If the cc switch does not provide *100%* reliable cc-on/off actuation, I loosen the switch Torx screws and slide the switch to a position where it does reliably work.

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post #38 of 42 Old Feb 1st, 2006, 3:16 am
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My cruise control has worked reliably for 70K miles in all weather conditions and temps. Once you get it adjusted well it will be fine. Just stick with it until you get it set right.

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Some people see the gas tank as half empty. Some see it as half full. All I care is that I know where the next tankful is coming from...
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post #39 of 42 Old Feb 3rd, 2006, 1:39 pm Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mneblett
These pics should help visualize. The first is an overview of what you see when you remove the tank (actually, you'll also see the vacuum lines and canister purge solenoid; mine was removed and vacuum ports at each throttle body capped with the little rubber caps visible in the pic). The closer cable, with its vertical "tab" which actuates the throttle rail cc switch, is dead center in the pic. The cable directly under it is the opener cable.

The second pic is the switch in the actuated position (throttle rotated fully closed).

The last pic is the un-actuated position.

HTH!
What a load of stuff you have to take off the bike to get to the CC actuator! I hope I can manage to put everything back.

The return cable had way too much slack. It would almost pull right right out of the housing at the end of it when I pulled on the cable. I have tightened it up so there is not much play at all.

My question is this. The CC doesn't actuate unless I shut down the throttle past stop. Is this right?
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post #40 of 42 Old Feb 3rd, 2006, 1:43 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goodbob
My question is this. The CC doesn't actuate unless I shut down the throttle past stop. Is this right?
Correct. From the normal "closed" position -- no hand on the throttle -- the cc closer switch should be actuated when the throttle is rotated beyond the closed position another ~10 degrees. Preferably, you should hear the cc switch click when the grip is in the middle of the 10 degree arc, not right at the very end of the 10 degree travel.

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post #41 of 42 Old Feb 3rd, 2006, 2:33 pm Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mneblett
Correct. From the normal "closed" position -- no hand on the throttle -- the cc closer switch should be actuated when the throttle is rotated beyond the closed position another ~10 degrees. Preferably, you should hear the cc switch click when the grip is in the middle of the 10 degree arc, not right at the very end of the 10 degree travel.
Ok, I will make sure that the click is in the middle and then slap everything back together again. It's too bad I can't run the diagnostic tests till everything except the fairing is back on it.
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post #42 of 42 Old Mar 6th, 2006, 11:37 am Thread Starter
 
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Well, I checked all of the things I was supposed to and determined that the micro switch on the fuel rail was the culprit. Since I was a little leery of trying to replace the switch and have it all working properly when I finished, I took it to the local dealer to have them do it. It cost $450 bucks...ouch. However, it does work fine. The mechanic said that there was more than just the normal gear whine at speed. He thought that it might need a new final drive soon. He said that there were a couple of other LTs that needed it around 24k miles recently. I remember seeing posts that this is a common problem. I assume that this is not an easy fix for your average do-it-yerselfer.

Jeez these things are more than a little bit expensive to maintain. Maybe my decision to save money by getting a used one isn't looking too good at the moment. Man, I just want to ride, dagnabit.
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