Cruise control and idle gremlins(long post) - BMW Luxury Touring Community
 
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post #1 of 14 Old Oct 24th, 2008, 10:15 pm Thread Starter
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Cruise control and idle gremlins(long post)

For the record, I did search for cruise control and found several pertinent posts. Now armed with just information to be hazardous to myself and anyone else within 27 feet of me, I have a curious situation developing on my 00 LT.

First of the month, the wife and I rode 3450 miles (deliberately circuitous) to Las Vegas for a business meeting I had to attend. On the way there, the cruise started acting up a little. Mostly started disconnecting on its own. I finally figured out it was doing so on long hard uphill and downhill stretches of road. When it would disconnect, I could hit the resume switch and it would work until the next steep hill.

Now, after sitting in Vegas for 10 day without being ridden, I saddled Emil up today and headed for Zion National Park, then east over to Page, AZ where I am now. Going up I-15 from Vegas the cruise started out just fine, but by the time I got to the Virgin River Gorge, it was disconnecting more than it was staying on, and now, it is hard to get it to connect back again. By the time I got through Zion, it wouldn't hardly stay on for any length of time. I trouble shot as much as I could while riding and have found that it will disconnect when I hit rough pavement. And as anyone knows that's ridden up here, from Zion to Page, there is nothing BUT rough pavement. The red light on the handlebar stays on, so I'm getting power to it. Sometimes I can turn the power switch off and back on and it will work, but most of the time it still won't re-engage. I've tried rolling the throttle off, then WOT and back, but that doesn't help either. What I did not try today was to work the clutch and brake lever/pedal.

Thanks to this forum, I found and ran the cruise diagnostic with some varied results. The first time I tried the diagnostic, all went well until time to pull the clutch lever in. It failed at that point. I worked the clutch lever a few times, and it finally worked. So, I turned the ignition off, and restarted the diagnostic. Now, and for the last four or five times I ran the test, the throttle is what fails the test. I cannot get it to pass the closed throttle test. I have not adjusted the throttle cables so I'm not sure why, unless the switch (wherever it may be) has gone Tango Uniform.

I'm still three days away from home and I'm going from Page down to Holbrook and hitting I-40 for the long haul to Knoxville. I'm really not looking forward to three long days on the slab with manual control only. Any help or advice, or even encouragement, would be appreciated.

My second gremlin is the idle speed being very erratic. I posted a few weeks ago about my fuel vent lines not being connected right. I remedied that problem while waiting for a new J&M microphone in Lubbock. I did not find any pinched fuel vent lines, but I did find that I had the lines crossed at the connectors. After reconnecting the lines properly, the bike went for a couple of days working just fine, but then the tank stopped venting again. Also, whenever I fill the tank, (I am not "packing" it) it runs like garbage for the first 40 miles or so. It does a GREAT impression of a surging oilhead!!!! I filled it up in Vegas and rode over to the BMW shop there (Superbly wonderful folks over there by the way.) and then over to Planet Hollywood where I parked it in the parking garage. I had gone only 24 miles on that tank of gas and when I parked it and got off, I noticed that Emil was pee-ing gas out of the vent line under the topcase. It was coming out in a steady stream, but not gushing by any means. It lasted for about half a minute then quit. But for the last 1,000 miles the idle speed has been very erratic ranging from not running at all without me having to hold the throttle open and keeping the revs up to around 2K, to running itself up to about 1500. Today, with the tank nearly empty (the fuel light was on) I got off the interstate and at the three or so traffic lights I stopped at it would start out at 1500 rpm idle for nearly a minute, then drop down to under 1,000, sputter like it wanted to die, then just hunt from about 700-1200 rpm.

I'm sure I have a vacuum leak from reading the posts in the archives, but with the leaky carbon cannister, I wanted to run it by some of you with more experience on these machines than me.

By the way, the particulars are: 2000 LT, 73,000 miles and been a trouble free bike up until this trip.

I'm sorry for such a long post, but I wanted to give as much information as I could.
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post #2 of 14 Old Oct 25th, 2008, 8:10 am
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Re: Cruise control and idle gremlins(long post)

Try a search for MoTronic fuse & do a reset or disconnect the battery for several hours and follow instructions for resetting.
May need resetting due to vacuum line mix up.
Fuel up with Texico or Chevron or buy some Techtron from Wal-Mart.
Try to find a bike shop that sell "Throttle Rocker" incase you can't get cruise to function, it gives leverage on the throttle to overcome the high spring rebound pressure.
Not much more I can think of from here. Good luck

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post #3 of 14 Old Oct 25th, 2008, 8:32 am
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Re: Cruise control and idle gremlins(long post)

You definitely need to readjust the micro switch at the clutch. Do that and your cruise will work just fine.

If you haven't done a canisterectomy, do it. If you have, be sure there are no lines blocked with mud, etc.

Check at the fuel rail for a hose that's slipped off. If you're doing (or have done) a canisterectomy you can do away with the four hoses at the rail, cap them and throw away the roll over valve.



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post #4 of 14 Old Oct 25th, 2008, 8:08 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Cruise control and idle gremlins(long post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by grifscoots
You definitely need to readjust the micro switch at the clutch. Do that and your cruise will work just fine.

If you haven't done a canisterectomy, do it. If you have, be sure there are no lines blocked with mud, etc.

Check at the fuel rail for a hose that's slipped off. If you're doing (or have done) a canisterectomy you can do away with the four hoses at the rail, cap them and throw away the roll over valve.

Grif,

The very first time I did the diagnostic, the clutch was the failed item. Every time after that (about 5 more tests yesterday, and three more today) it is the throttle that isn't passing muster. I tried today while riding with my foot under the rear brake pedal and putting up pressure on it, while at the same time holding the clutch and brake levers away from the bars (holding the levers to their most forward stop) and the bike will still disconnect when hitting a bump.

Two observations from today's 500 miles:
1) This morning the cruise wouldn't work at all. Nothing! After about five or six hours of riding, the cruise eventually started working but would kick off at the slightest bump. Then about two hours out of Albuquerque it started working almost normally. When I would hit a substantial bump it would kick off. Most of the time, I had to wait about three to five minutes before it would reset.

2) Filled up in Holbrook and headed down the interstate only to find it blocked off and all traffic detoured back up to Gallup via backroads. After 132 miles, I stopped in Gallup for lunch (o.k. it was 5:00, but who's counting?) When I came back out of the fast food place, the bike was venting fuel overboard from the cannister vent. Tank was down to half full and the temp was 77 degrees. It really shouldn't be venting after that long should it?

Finally, for Grif, I'll be doing a cannisterectomy on Emil when I get him back to my own garage. Still not sure what's the deal with the cruise. Can anyone tell me where the throttle switch is and how to adjust it?

Thanks for letting me take so much time, I'm mildly frustrated at the events on this trip, but overall, it's still been great and the bike is a blast to ride. I managed to just a little over 4,500 miles so far and at least 4,000 has been two lane, back-road nirvana and the LT couldn't have been any happier to be with me. They really are great bikes!
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post #5 of 14 Old Oct 25th, 2008, 8:28 pm
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Re: Cruise control and idle gremlins(long post)

I think one of the issues with the cruise (other than the clutch switch) is the throttle/cruise cables. If that is out of adjustment or if you need a new cables it would exhibit those issues you mention, disconnect by itself or not engaging when cold. There were some posts about the switch on the fuel rail if you can find those. There is a zip tie trick but I don't know how that works.

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post #6 of 14 Old Oct 25th, 2008, 9:18 pm
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Re: Cruise control and idle gremlins(long post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by grifscoots
You definitely need to readjust the micro switch at the clutch. Do that and your cruise will work just fine.

If you haven't done a canisterectomy, do it. If you have, be sure there are no lines blocked with mud, etc.

Check at the fuel rail for a hose that's slipped off. If you're doing (or have done) a canisterectomy you can do away with the four hoses at the rail, cap them and throw away the roll over valve.
Hey, Grif - any chance he has the broken/chafed speedo wire at the brake line ferrule, located on the run from the FD case fitting and heading toward the front of the bike? That's when ole Toad's cc went south. We used David Shealey's troubleshooting and repairing article to splice the wire and isolate it from rubbing against the brake line's flared fitting.
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post #7 of 14 Old Oct 25th, 2008, 9:27 pm
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Re: Cruise control and idle gremlins(long post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by grifscoots
You definitely need to readjust the micro switch at the clutch. Do that and your cruise will work just fine.

If you haven't done a canisterectomy, do it. If you have, be sure there are no lines blocked with mud, etc.

Check at the fuel rail for a hose that's slipped off. If you're doing (or have done) a canisterectomy you can do away with the four hoses at the rail, cap them and throw away the roll over valve.
Throw away the rollover valve? Grif, the rollover valve is the big white thing on top of the fuel tank.

You are probably talking about the emissions control solenoid valve that the vacuum lines from the throttle bodies attach to. Yes, that and the lines can be removed and stored or discarded when the throttle body fittings are capped.

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post #8 of 14 Old Oct 25th, 2008, 9:29 pm
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Re: Cruise control and idle gremlins(long post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick
Hey, Grif - any chance he has the broken/chafed speedo wire at the brake line ferrule, located on the run from the FD case fitting and heading toward the front of the bike? That's when ole Toad's cc went south. We used David Shealey's troubleshooting and repairing article to splice the wire and isolate it from rubbing against the brake line's flared fitting.
I was about to post that, then I saw you beat me to it Dick.

IF it is that problem, you should see evidence of it by the speedometer needle jumping on bumps. If that is happening, then yes, probably the speed sensor wire.

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post #9 of 14 Old Oct 25th, 2008, 9:33 pm
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Re: Cruise control and idle gremlins(long post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by dshealey
Throw away the rollover valve? Grif, the rollover valve is the big white thing on top of the fuel tank.

You are probably talking about the emissions control solenoid valve that the vacuum lines from the throttle bodies attach to. Yes, that and the lines can be removed and stored or discarded when the throttle body fittings are capped.
What you said. That's why I stick to technical terms like: "big, white thang on top of the tank".



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post #10 of 14 Old Oct 25th, 2008, 10:22 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Cruise control and idle gremlins(long post)

With thanks to all, I'll look up some more articles and/or threads on the throttle cable stuff. I was contemplating doing a throttle cable upgrade this winter, now I'll stop contemplating and plan on the project. I figure if I can do a clutch spline lube on the RT, I should be able to tackle the cable stuff.

Someone asked about a jumpy speedo on the bumps. I haven't noticed it yet, but I'll keep an eye out for it tomorrow.

One other thing I found today. The aft throttle cable (when looking at the two cables from the saddle) has the small knurled barrel, and two lock nuts. Both nuts are tight against each other, and the adjusting barrel on the cable cannot be turned inside the two locknuts, but both lock nuts are loose against the throttle housing on the handlebar. Is this normal? Or could this be where my problem lies. FWIW, I fiddled with the throttle cables while the cruise was engaged and it didn't have any effect on it tripping off.
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post #11 of 14 Old Oct 26th, 2008, 7:53 am
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Re: Cruise control and idle gremlins(long post)

The easiest one to adjust is the clutch microswitch. I'd start there, even though the procedure failed elsewhere, the symptoms point.



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post #12 of 14 Old Oct 26th, 2008, 8:34 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Cruise control and idle gremlins(long post)

Hey Grif,
I read the articles/threads I found in the search menu the other day, but just last night I finally found the Hall of Wisdom threads. After reading those I believe I've got it figured out. I did have some trouble getting the left side Tupperware back on and the throttle cable from the cruise module was the problem. I'm almost sure it's snagged between the plastic and the fan shroud and from what I read last night, it has all the symptoms; i.e., won't work at all when cold and after warm (today nothing for 600 miles, then intermittently for the last 50) it disconnects at the slightest bump in the road.

When I get it back home, I'll pull the Tupperware and see what I've got. While I've got Emil stripped down, I'll go ahead an do the cannisterectomy too.

One last question for any of you, my mirrors are getting loose. Not the clips and no problem with them staying on the bike, but the mirror adjustment goes nuts when I hit rough road. From OK City to Henryetta the road is very rough and I spent almost as much time adjusting the mirrors as I did using them. Any tricks for tightening them up? I'll check the archives/Hall of Wisdom, but thought I'd throw that out while I was typing.

Thanks to all for your helpful suggestions and consideration.
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post #13 of 14 Old Oct 27th, 2008, 7:28 am
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Re: Cruise control and idle gremlins(long post)

Quote:
Originally Posted by pushin9s

One last question for any of you, my mirrors are getting loose. Not the clips and no problem with them staying on the bike, but the mirror adjustment goes nuts when I hit rough road. From OK City to Henryetta the road is very rough and I spent almost as much time adjusting the mirrors as I did using them. Any tricks for tightening them up? I'll check the archives/Hall of Wisdom, but thought I'd throw that out while I was typing.
Don't ride over rough roads. J/K, there is not anyway that I know to tighten those up except to replace parts.

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post #14 of 14 Old Oct 27th, 2008, 10:44 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Cruise control and idle gremlins(long post)

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Don't ride over rough roads. J/K, there is not anyway that I know to tighten those up except to replace parts.

Actually, my spare foam earplugs worked great. And they're great conversation starters at the gas pump too.
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