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post #1 of 32 Old Aug 12th, 2007, 5:22 pm Thread Starter
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Improving Low end Power

Ok, Ive had the bike since march. Its a new to me 99 k12lt so far the honeymoon is still on going however, the bike is really lacking in low end power. A couple questions:

- Does anyone know any improvements to get more torque down low, especially from right off idle.

- What about aftermarket exhaust systems? Is this a quick fix? any thoughts?

I have no problem w/ the power once the engine is spinning above 2.5k. Im adjusting by riding the bike and reving it out more than I used to when I rode my r1100rt. It would be nice to have more low end power. Is this one of the power improvements made in 2005? I would appreciate any input


Tom
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post #2 of 32 Old Aug 12th, 2007, 5:57 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahpd1992
Ok, Ive had the bike since march. Its a new to me 99 k12lt so far the honeymoon is still on going however, the bike is really lacking in low end power. A couple questions:

- Does anyone know any improvements to get more torque down low, especially from right off idle.

- What about aftermarket exhaust systems? Is this a quick fix? any thoughts?

I have no problem w/ the power once the engine is spinning above 2.5k. Im adjusting by riding the bike and reving it out more than I used to when I rode my r1100rt. It would be nice to have more low end power. Is this one of the power improvements made in 2005? I would appreciate any input


Tom
Hi Tom,
There's a feature in the Motronic that retards the timing to prevent ping when the temp inside the airbox is high. Most everyone complains about it. Check out the FAQ, and especially this link for more info. Welcome aboard!

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post #3 of 32 Old Aug 12th, 2007, 8:00 pm Thread Starter
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I think I found it

I see a pretty thick brown wire, its right where you describe, and the problems your describing are exactly whats happening. Its almost as if the bike is starving for fuel when the revs get low, and yes its very unnerving as its always seems to happen when Im throttling down going into a corner.

So anyway is this "brown wire" the thick one Im seeing. I couldnt find a picture when I did a search

Tom
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post #4 of 32 Old Aug 12th, 2007, 8:04 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahpd1992
I see a pretty thick brown wire, its right where you describe, and the problems your describing are exactly whats happening. Its almost as if the bike is starving for fuel when the revs get low, and yes its very unnerving as its always seems to happen when Im throttling down going into a corner.

So anyway is this "brown wire" the thick one Im seeing. I couldnt find a picture when I did a search

Tom
No, it's not. The '99 won't have a brown wire. I'd try pulling the air temp sensor plug first.



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post #5 of 32 Old Aug 12th, 2007, 9:30 pm
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It really isnt a tractor, sometimes it just seems that way. Get on the throttle a bit more, the 99-2000 LT has plenty of torque, you just have to find it.
No K-bike engine is designed to lug around, not even the newer models.

Find the elements of the engine, because it really dont care about how we feel about where our own thoughts of where the engine elements should be.

BTW...I was feeling the torque of 3rd gear pulling the bike and myself past 100mph today, just for the hell of it.....this machine is incredible.




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post #6 of 32 Old Aug 12th, 2007, 9:35 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahpd1992
I see a pretty thick brown wire, its right where you describe, and the problems your describing are exactly whats happening. Its almost as if the bike is starving for fuel when the revs get low, and yes its very unnerving as its always seems to happen when Im throttling down going into a corner.

So anyway is this "brown wire" the thick one Im seeing. I couldnt find a picture when I did a search

Tom
Grif's correct, the 99 does not have the special brown wire. There is a plug in the front of the air box for the air temp sensor, just behind the radiator cap. If you disconnect it the computer will not retard the timing. If you shine your flashlight at the radiator cap, you will see it to the bike's left behind it. You have to pull the side cover to get to it. Then it will act like the ambient temp is below 85 degrees.

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post #7 of 32 Old Aug 12th, 2007, 10:26 pm
 
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ahpd1992,,,,
Try real hard to not ride your bike below 3500RPM...... You will find all your torque waiting for you there and above.......

Take your bike out tomorrow and do NOT shift up until your tach reads at least 6000RPM... If your below 5000RPM down shift to accelorate.....Then come back and tell us about how the torque is...This ain't Jap trash (no offense) this motor works high RPM not low................Pete
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post #8 of 32 Old Aug 13th, 2007, 4:55 am
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99 performance

Well as the others indicated these engines will never be known for their low end torque and revving it up a little more is certainly a help but on my 99 I removed the cat code plug to change the motronic and found a much more rideable bike, not a huge difference but certainly an improvement.
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post #9 of 32 Old Aug 13th, 2007, 6:27 am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by petepeterson
ahpd1992,,,,
Try real hard to not ride your bike below 3500RPM...... You will find all your torque waiting for you there and above.......

Take your bike out tomorrow and do NOT shift up until your tach reads at least 6000RPM... If your below 5000RPM down shift to accelorate.....Then come back and tell us about how the torque is...This ain't Jap trash (no offense) this motor works high RPM not low................Pete
It is amazing that someone can describe other bikes as "Jap trash" while describing his own bike which requires running near redline to make useable torque.

And we wonder why non-BMW riders describe us as arrogant?

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post #10 of 32 Old Aug 13th, 2007, 11:04 am Thread Starter
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Thanks

thanks for the help from those of you who answered me seriously instead of telling me I dont know how to ride.

To those who didn't...I know its high revving motor, and I usually ride it accordingly, I was just pointing out something new that never occurred before. It has been near 100 degrees in the Chicago area recently and the first few posts addressed exactly what was happening and it appears to be the motronic temp sensor. If you who made fun noticed I did not fault the machine, but rather was looking for a solution to make it run a little better. I believe I stated I have adjusted my riding style to the way the engine has been behaving. If you noticed a noticable power loss on your bike that wasnt there before I hope you would ask qusetions as well.

Im pretty sure I can ride w/ the best of them when push comes to shove, but since none of you know me go ahead and continue your assumptions

Again thanks to those of you who are trying to help, I know this is a very old question, but my bike is 8 yrs old, but brand new to me

Tom
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post #11 of 32 Old Aug 13th, 2007, 11:30 am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahpd1992
Again thanks to those of you who are trying to help, I know this is a very old question, but my bike is 8 yrs old, but brand new to me
The guys that started this group in 1999 had to learn all of this stuff the hard way. We have been building the knowledge base ever since. This is why the FAQ exists. You, my friend, are seeing the benefits.

This community has also thrived because we try to treat each other with respect. Many other online communities have imploded as the abuse from behind the keyboard got out of hand. Here we kid around, and poke fun at each other, but we moderators try to keep things as calm as possible. Don't take any of this too personally. Most of us are just lugs who like to ride.

It's not what you ride, but how you treat your fellow riders that matters.

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post #12 of 32 Old Aug 13th, 2007, 12:07 pm
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Well, my 2000 is brand new, and always will be. Never be ashamed of the year of the bike, there are suttle differences in the newer models, but they are just that.

Mine has a Remus Titanium setup with the Rhinewest chip in the brain. The bike pulls like a freight train right off idle. Expensive tweak, but it was installed by the previous owner, so the cost passed on to me was absorbed with the purchase of the bike.

From what I'm reading, your second post on this thread refers to a noticable LOSS in power, not mentioned in your fist post.

That is a whole different story, if the power was there and now it isnt, just points to a diagnosis challenge that WILL be met by our beloved guru's on this board.

How has the steed been serviced ? New fuel and air filters come to mind....plugs may even be a culprit, but you have to pull them for a reference. Plug wires that are deteriorated can also cause a huge power loss.

Keep posting and feeding us info, the answer will be routed out.


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post #13 of 32 Old Aug 13th, 2007, 12:40 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by munson
Grif's correct, the 99 does not have the special brown wire. There is a plug in the front of the air box for the air temp sensor, just behind the radiator cap. If you disconnect it the computer will not retard the timing. If you shine your flashlight at the radiator cap, you will see it to the bike's left behind it. You have to pull the side cover to get to it. Then it will act like the ambient temp is below 85 degrees.
You probably do not have to remove any fairings to get the plug off. Many of us have unplugged it without removing anything. Depends on the orientation of the plug. If the wire spring clip is on top, reach over the radiator cap and press it down, then pull the plug off. This can be done with one hand, IF the spring clip is on top, as all I have seen are.

Putting it back on is another matter, as you would maybe a couple more fingers on one hand than normal, with reverse acting knuckles.

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post #14 of 32 Old Aug 13th, 2007, 12:54 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dshealey
You probably do not have to remove any fairings to get the plug off. Many of us have unplugged it without removing anything. Depends on the orientation of the plug. If the wire spring clip is on top, reach over the radiator cap and press it down, then pull the plug off. This can be done with one hand, IF the spring clip is on top, as all I have seen are.

Putting it back on is another matter, as you would maybe a couple more fingers on one hand than normal, with reverse acting knuckles.
There's no way I can get my XXXL paws in there!

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post #15 of 32 Old Aug 13th, 2007, 2:55 pm
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Originally Posted by munson
There's no way I can get my XXXL paws in there!
Me three!! I tried and tried and couldn't do the deed. Pulled up in front of Lone Star; got off and knelt down to see what I could see. Got my hand up in there - couldn't feel a thang; couldn't see a thang! Mike G. wuz bringing a bike around from the back - asked me what the hell I wuz doin' down on my knees and cryin'?!?! Told him --- he reached up in there and 'shazammm' - done! Walked off like he does that leetle mod everyday, routinely!!! Hollered at me if I needed a hanky?!!! I answered with a one-finger salute!
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post #16 of 32 Old Aug 13th, 2007, 5:14 pm Thread Starter
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Only 83 today

Today we got a little break from the high heat and humidity and it was only about 83 degrees for a high. The bike ran better, but that nasty low end suprise was still there. I am adjusting now that I know its coming Im revving up the motor more into turns. There is what I can only describe as a "flat spot" between 1500rpm and 3000rpm as if the bike is gasping for breath/fuel...its annoying and more so because I havent had the time to try some of the fixes suggested here. Il keep on trying n let u know


BTW how much is that Remus and Rhinwest Chip setup?

Tom
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post #17 of 32 Old Aug 13th, 2007, 5:30 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by petepeterson
ahpd1992,,,,
Try real hard to not ride your bike below 3500RPM...... You will find all your torque waiting for you there and above.......

Take your bike out tomorrow and do NOT shift up until your tach reads at least 6000RPM... If your below 5000RPM down shift to accelorate.....Then come back and tell us about how the torque is...This ain't Jap trash (no offense) this motor works high RPM not low................Pete
How many Japanese bikes have you owned? I'm very impressed with my 07 LT, however, I was also impressed with my 87 Voyager. It had nearly the power of the LT with better fuel economy and with carburetors no less. And it was much easier with the throttle and didn't have the abrupt cut-off that plagues the BMWs.

Matt
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post #18 of 32 Old Aug 13th, 2007, 6:26 pm
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low end torque

I killed my bike at a red light Saturday. It was 101 here and I didn't give it enough off the start. It was 104 today. I was attending the last blast of summer on Saturday. Hundreds of hot rods and lots of bikes cruising the street in Vernon, Texas. I made one pass on my way out of town. I was the ONLY BMW there......LOL......lots of Harleys though. My bike runs better since I clipped that "brown wire". I owned a Yamaha Venture and a Suzuki LC1500 before this beemer. Both were great bikes. The LC had loads of torque and the Venture was a lot like the beemer, low torque on the bottom. Bother were great machines that provided me with many trouble free and fun miles....................

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post #19 of 32 Old Aug 13th, 2007, 8:16 pm
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Tom:
Welcome to the forum. Now you got to be a little thick skinned at times to hang with this crowd.

I have an '03 with a Remus pipe. Found it didn't do a thing for low end, matter of fact think it might have hurt it a little. Seems to have helped mid and upper range. Can't say anything about the chip. don't have one of them, yet.

I try to keep the tach standing up and find I have plenty of power to do what I want to do, usually. Took a little but can launch my LT just fine, keep right up with about anything reasonable.

Just got back a couple of weeks ago from a quick trip to Michigan, mostly ran down the roads at 80 or so packing double. The LT never complained, just wanted to do more. Wife kept a close eye on the speedo and nicely asked me to watch the speed when it got a little on the high side. 3500 miles in 6 days, 2 of them in the rain. Time for an oil change. Lets see now what am I gonna use, Amsoil, Mobile 1, Quaker State, dino, synthetic, decisions, desicions.

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post #20 of 32 Old Aug 13th, 2007, 10:03 pm
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Voyager
How many Japanese bikes have you owned? I'm very impressed with my 07 LT, however, I was also impressed with my 87 Voyager. It had nearly the power of the LT with better fuel economy and with carburetors no less. And it was much easier with the throttle and didn't have the abrupt cut-off that plagues the BMWs.

Matt
Duh?? Did ya try and read the whole post????? (No offense)
Yeah, I've owned a few Jap bikes,, How far back do you want me to go?? Mid 60's?? Late 70's????
Back in the 80's I liked the Voyager,,, like the Cavalcade allot,,, but HD's were top shelf for me from the mid 70's to the mid 90's............ Now I like the LT best of all the touring rigs.....

But really,, I type 70 some odd words and you become as petty as bibleman over just 2 of them... My response was to the man who started the thread,,,you don't like whats wrote read passed it,,, not that hard to do,,, let the thread stay on track not your letting your frail ego get in the way...........Have a great day..........Pete
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post #21 of 32 Old Aug 14th, 2007, 12:16 am
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Flat Spot

Hi Tom,

Don't worry about the flat spot it will go away when the temp. drops.
It was a cool 108 today and my bike runs the same way. (it's 100 at 10pm)

One thing I have found that really helps restore the power is Berryman's B-12 fuel line/injector cleaner. I use it every 3 to 4000 mile. Good stuff, but use with care... 6 oz. to a tank - then ride ride ride. Don't get it on the paint... it will eat it right off.

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post #22 of 32 Old Aug 14th, 2007, 2:38 am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahpd1992
Today we got a little break from the high heat and humidity and it was only about 83 degrees for a high. The bike ran better, but that nasty low end suprise was still there. I am adjusting now that I know its coming Im revving up the motor more into turns. There is what I can only describe as a "flat spot" between 1500rpm and 3000rpm as if the bike is gasping for breath/fuel...its annoying and more so because I havent had the time to try some of the fixes suggested here. Il keep on trying n let u know


BTW how much is that Remus and Rhinwest Chip setup?

Tom
Yes, that sounds like the "hot hesitation" the earlier bikes were prone too. On a '99, the only easy solution is unplugging the air box temp sensor. The Motronic was changed out by dealers on many bikes that were brought in, but many people did not take them in. You probably have one that was not. If the correct dual map Motronic was installed on the '99-early '00 bikes, then the yellow "Cat Code" plug under the top box could be removed, which was the same as cutting the brown wire on later models. Howver, do NOT unplug the cat code plug if the correct Motronic was not installed. Your dealer can hook it up and read out the Motronic part number to see if it was ever changed.

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post #23 of 32 Old Aug 14th, 2007, 5:14 am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by petepeterson
Duh?? Did ya try and read the whole post????? (No offense)
Yeah, I've owned a few Jap bikes,, How far back do you want me to go?? Mid 60's?? Late 70's????
Back in the 80's I liked the Voyager,,, like the Cavalcade allot,,, but HD's were top shelf for me from the mid 70's to the mid 90's............ Now I like the LT best of all the touring rigs.....

But really,, I type 70 some odd words and you become as petty as bibleman over just 2 of them... My response was to the man who started the thread,,,you don't like whats wrote read passed it,,, not that hard to do,,, let the thread stay on track not your letting your frail ego get in the way...........Have a great day..........Pete
Interesting that you use phrases demeaning bikes ("Jap Trash") other than what you own, yet it's OTHERS that have the frail egos? WE'RE the ones that are petty?

Stop it...you're killing me.

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post #24 of 32 Old Aug 14th, 2007, 8:12 am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahpd1992
Today we got a little break from the high heat and humidity and it was only about 83 degrees for a high. The bike ran better, but that nasty low end suprise was still there. I am adjusting now that I know its coming Im revving up the motor more into turns. There is what I can only describe as a "flat spot" between 1500rpm and 3000rpm as if the bike is gasping for breath/fuel...its annoying and more so because I havent had the time to try some of the fixes suggested here. Il keep on trying n let u know


BTW how much is that Remus and Rhinwest Chip setup?

Tom

The Remus and Rhinewest Chip will probably cost around 1K. 400 for the chip and about 600 to 800 for the exhaust. I unstalled it myself with the work done by a friend. It is well worth and have it installed on mine. I last night, after reading these post unplugged my 02 sensor. I hope, I unplugged the right thing. I will wait until the Florida sun hits high noon before seeing if the flat has gone. Good post.

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post #25 of 32 Old Aug 14th, 2007, 11:10 am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by motorman587
The Remus and Rhinewest Chip will probably cost around 1K. 400 for the chip and about 600 to 800 for the exhaust. I unstalled it myself with the work done by a friend. It is well worth and have it installed on mine. I last night, after reading these post unplugged my 02 sensor. I hope, I unplugged the right thing. I will wait until the Florida sun hits high noon before seeing if the flat has gone. Good post.
You DON'T want to unplug your O2 sensor. You want to unplug the airbox temp sensor behind the left radiator cap.



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post #26 of 32 Old Aug 14th, 2007, 11:15 am
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I unplugged the airbox temp sensor on my '99 earlier this year and it has made it a completely new bike, no more hesitation on hot days. Well worth doing.

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post #27 of 32 Old Aug 14th, 2007, 11:25 am Thread Starter
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Where is it?

It appears that I need to unplug the airbox temperature thing-a-ma-jiggy...now speak slowly because I am mechanically illiterate, how do I do locate this part, what does it look like?

Again many thanks to all who are taking time out to help

Tom
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post #28 of 32 Old Aug 14th, 2007, 12:18 pm
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oops

Quote:
Originally Posted by grifscoots
You DON'T want to unplug your O2 sensor. You want to unplug the airbox temp sensor behind the left radiator cap.
That is what I meant sorry. Unplug the airbox temp sensor.

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post #29 of 32 Old Aug 14th, 2007, 12:22 pm
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I did it last night.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ahpd1992
It appears that I need to unplug the airbox temperature thing-a-ma-jiggy...now speak slowly because I am mechanically illiterate, how do I do locate this part, what does it look like?

Again many thanks to all who are taking time out to help

Tom
I sure others will dime in, but for me I took off the left side of the fairing. Even with it off it was hard to get to. I used a screw driver to pop of the clip and pulled the plug out. If you look under the bike near the two forks you will see two radiators. On the left is the one with a radiator cap. Behind it is a plug and that is the one I pulled. Letting the Florida sun warm up and go for a test ride here shortly.

John
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post #30 of 32 Old Aug 14th, 2007, 1:32 pm
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I've been told you can do it without taking off the left side tupperware, but I couldn't do it with my fat fingers. Much easier with the side panel removed. It is right behind the radiator cap and I believe their is some sort of clip holding it in place.

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post #31 of 32 Old Aug 14th, 2007, 1:37 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahpd1992
It appears that I need to unplug the airbox temperature thing-a-ma-jiggy...now speak slowly because I am mechanically illiterate, how do I do locate this part, what does it look like?

Again many thanks to all who are taking time out to help

Tom
In this pic, it is to the right of the radiator cap. Here the plug is removed. If you shine your light up there you will see the back of the plug and the wires coming out of it. Someone with small hands can reach in and push the wire clip down and pull the plug. Or, if you are like me, you will have to pull the panel off.
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Last edited by munson; Aug 14th, 2007 at 1:52 pm.
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post #32 of 32 Old Aug 14th, 2007, 9:42 pm
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Good picture.

Unpluged it. Mine was more in upside and the clip was on the bottom. I guess it really does not matter. Took it for a ride today for about 40 miles in 98 to 100 degree heat. Speeds up to about 65 to low about 35 city. I felt a difference and glad that I did it. MPG was about 50. I reset it before my little trip. There was NO flat spots or hestitaion. Thanks for the thread.

John
Florida
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