Final Drive - BMW Luxury Touring Community
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post #1 of 11 Old Sep 18th, 2019, 4:26 pm Thread Starter
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Final Drive

Good afternoon everyone,

I have a 2008 k1200lt with 27,000 mi. I can grab the top and bottom of the tire push and pull and feel some movement that I can see between the aluminum housing and wheel. There is no leaking from the seal but the oil is silver swirled at 3000 mi.

I will be rebuilding the drive myself and was wondering if successful rebuilders use the bmw preload numbers, .002-.004 in, in their rebuilds or have experimented with lighter preloads such as .000-.002 in, in the search for better longevity.

Thanks for you time
Dave
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post #2 of 11 Old Sep 18th, 2019, 5:16 pm
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Re: Final Drive

Hey Dave, check the video here:
It helped me a lot. I had calculated my shim at 0.40mm. After this the FD did 30K+ kilometers and still going problem free. Ever since the oil looks clean like I changed it yesterday.
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post #3 of 11 Old Sep 18th, 2019, 8:30 pm
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Re: Final Drive

Hey Dave, anyone who knows what they are doing will use the MFG preload range as going outside does not increase longevity. A lighter load and the taper bearing does not have enough preload and can be damaged. Heaver which is what most of the factory over shims were by about .2mm and that leads to metal fatigue and crown bearing failure. If you are getting a lot aluminum in your oil, then something else is going on in addition to the slop in the crown bearing. Possibly a spun taper bearing or race or the pinion bearing race has crept and is impacting the housing. The hardest part is getting an accurate measurement of the clearance so you know what shim pack to put in. I have done 3 myself so I am familiar with the process and tools required for a proper rebuild but Dave Selvig ( saddleman) is the go to guy with well over 100 and the best rebuild around so if you decide not to do it, Dave is the guy. You should be able to remember his name

You said that you see movement between the housing and wheel so probably not loose swing arm pivot bearings which is also a cause of that loose feeling on the wheel.

Good luck and take pictures and post as you go. Someone here may spot something you are not aware to look for.

Gordon
Sugar Hill, GA
2001 K1200LTI Champagne (current ride) Lazy Susan
1998 R1100RT Never should have sold it
1974 Yamaha TX 750 Twin. Omni Phase Balanced


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post #4 of 11 Old Sep 18th, 2019, 9:40 pm
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Re: Final Drive

Finally a great video ...

Hard to tell if is just the "Kool Aid" effect, but we got a ton of parts "Cryo" Thanks to a doctorate in Metalurgics at the Berkeley hill labs...

He show us the changes in the molecular orientation (We did some "Shoot pin" on the cases too) and a bunch of neat features beyond my scope of understanding, in any case we start with the bearings and gears of the bmw final drives since the "later models" (2001/2002 GS's for the most part) were suffering failures at a alarming rate..

We also did Carrillo, falicon Rods, crankshafts, Ti valves, etc for the first US Dakar team KTM660 (I still have one of those engine with almost 80.000 miles of absolute trashing)..

All of this with zero failures, so is kind of hard to tell if is the result of a carefully ensamble blue printed part or the newer improved metal
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post #5 of 11 Old Sep 19th, 2019, 5:27 am Thread Starter
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Re: Final Drive

NicosK1200LT,

Thanks for recommending the great video, hopefully my rebuild will be as successful as yours.

BMWCool1200,

Thanks for the information. I do remember reading that the factory used excessive preload and I will rebuild my final drive to factory spec.

Dave
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post #6 of 11 Old Sep 19th, 2019, 9:25 am
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Re: Final Drive

This guy is way more my style, you don't need to be so seremonius and precise (with the Lash sure, the rest is very basic) is not like you are working on a helicopter (Yes I work on them for years)

we have done it on the road with the few tools we had at hand..

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post #7 of 11 Old Sep 19th, 2019, 4:38 pm
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Re: Final Drive

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricardo Kuhn View Post
This guy is way more my style, you don't need to be so seremonius and precise (with the Lash sure, the rest is very basic) is not like you are working on a helicopter (Yes I work on them for years)

we have done it on the road with the few tools we had at hand..
This is fine for a field repair to get you home with the exception that in the field, if there are two shims as in this video, the smaller one should be removed as it is probably a .1mm or .15mm shim. If at home, I would be doing measurements for the shim pack if you want it to last longer the second time around. Saddleman is still the go to guy for a proper full rebuild.

Gordon
Sugar Hill, GA
2001 K1200LTI Champagne (current ride) Lazy Susan
1998 R1100RT Never should have sold it
1974 Yamaha TX 750 Twin. Omni Phase Balanced


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post #8 of 11 Old Sep 19th, 2019, 5:35 pm
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Re: Final Drive

Quote:
Originally Posted by bmwcoolk1200 View Post
This is fine for a field repair to get you home with the exception that in the field, if there are two shims as in this video, the smaller one should be removed as it is probably a .1mm or .15mm shim. If at home, I would be doing measurements for the shim pack if you want it to last longer the second time around. Saddleman is still the go to guy for a proper full rebuild.
Oh for sure, things need to get done the best possible standard, but my point is that besides the shims and the contact point on the gears the repair is actually really simple (If you have the inner bearing extractor with you) the rest you can improvise..

I can only tell you we (I participate in two, but I know of many of the 1150 that fail) repair two of them in the field, one in the middle of "Saline valley" (next to death valley without tents to sleep the night) and the other one in Alaska but no all the way to the Yukon, on the two cases we did not have a SAT Phone but we did have the tools since most of us where on GS's..

One of them was at night, we actually took a little oil from each of the trannys and final drives to fill the damage one (silly we forgot the bottle of redline oil..)

So now a Trivia question just for fun..

What other very important fastener uses a 7mm allen head...!?!?
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post #9 of 11 Old Sep 19th, 2019, 8:20 pm
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Re: Final Drive

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricardo Kuhn View Post
Oh for sure, things need to get done the best possible standard, but my point is that besides the shims and the contact point on the gears the repair is actually really simple (If you have the inner bearing extractor with you) the rest you can improvise..

I can only tell you we (I participate in two, but I know of many of the 1150 that fail) repair two of them in the field, one in the middle of "Saline valley" (next to death valley without tents to sleep the night) and the other one in Alaska but no all the way to the Yukon, on the two cases we did not have a SAT Phone but we did have the tools since most of us where on GS's..

One of them was at night, we actually took a little oil from each of the trannys and final drives to fill the damage one (silly we forgot the bottle of redline oil..)

So now a Trivia question just for fun..

What other very important fastener uses a 7mm allen head...!?!?
Is there a 7MM on the bike? I have an LT and have not come across a 7mm as I don't think I have one. What fastener are you referring to.

Gordon
Sugar Hill, GA
2001 K1200LTI Champagne (current ride) Lazy Susan
1998 R1100RT Never should have sold it
1974 Yamaha TX 750 Twin. Omni Phase Balanced


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post #10 of 11 Old Sep 19th, 2019, 10:21 pm
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Re: Final Drive

Quote:
Originally Posted by bmwcoolk1200 View Post
Is there a 7MM on the bike? I have an LT and have not come across a 7mm as I don't think I have one. What fastener are you referring to.

Well i have never work on a LT final drive, but the boxes series use seven millimeters for the main fasteners..

the other place I know is the Lower ball joint at the telelever fork/A arm junction (The one that you need to hold so the nut can be torque to the require amount...

Let me tell you that was a big surprise when a friend up one with a lose fork and none of us had a 7mm allen, Old school latin Ricky ground a 8mm on a hard stone until it fit but it took some good half a hour..
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post #11 of 11 Old Oct 6th, 2019, 5:30 pm
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Re: Final Drive

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricardo Kuhn View Post
Well i have never work on a LT final drive, but the boxes series use seven millimeters for the main fasteners..

the other place I know is the Lower ball joint at the telelever fork/A arm junction (The one that you need to hold so the nut can be torque to the require amount...

Let me tell you that was a big surprise when a friend up one with a lose fork and none of us had a 7mm allen, Old school latin Ricky ground a 8mm on a hard stone until it fit but it took some good half a hour..
come on, half hour grinding? That's nothing. My brother makes wonders with the files and grinds for days or even months to achieve.
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