K1600B - BMW Luxury Touring Community
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post #1 of 43 Old Jun 21st, 2017, 10:00 am Thread Starter
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K1600B

Could this be the ultimate replacement for our beloved LT?https://ultimatemotorcycling.com/201...announced-usa/
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2006 K1200LT (Love it)
2002 R1150RT (Sold)
2007 Harley FLHTCU (sold at 137k Miles)
1999 Harley Night train (blew the eng at 150k miles)
1986 harley Davidson FLTC (Sold When assigned to Europe
1982 Harley Wide Glide (sold)
1981 Kawasaki k1000LTD (sold)
1980 Triumph Bonneville (sold)
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post #2 of 43 Old Jun 21st, 2017, 10:46 am
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Re: K1600B

Quote:
Originally Posted by BeemerJoe View Post
Could this be the ultimate replacement for our beloved LT?https://ultimatemotorcycling.com/201...announced-usa/
Not for me. The GTL isn't even a good replacement so a bagger isn't even close.

This may be a good alternative for Harley bagger riders who want a modern bike.

I have given up on there ever being a true secessor to the LT. I think it was a one of a kind bike that likely will not be duplicated. The only bike that even seems to be seriously trying is the rumored next generation Gold Wing. If it has what the rumors say, it could be interesting.
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2017 KLR650 "Mule"
2007 K1200LT "Starship Enterprise", VOICE II, Navigator V, Motorrad Communicator
1987 Kawasaki Voyager XII
1976 Kawasaki KH400
1973 Kawasaki 100 G5
1970 Rockford Chibi (the orange one)

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post #3 of 43 Old Jun 21st, 2017, 11:24 am
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Re: K1600B

As a K bike lover, I have to agree the series is dead. The K1600 is just....not there. Keep them running as best you can.
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post #4 of 43 Old Jun 21st, 2017, 12:12 pm
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Re: K1600B

Quote:
Originally Posted by Voyager View Post
Not for me. The GTL isn't even a good replacement so a bagger isn't even close.

This may be a good alternative for Harley bagger riders who want a modern bike.

I have given up on there ever being a true secessor to the LT. I think it was a one of a kind bike that likely will not be duplicated. The only bike that even seems to be seriously trying is the rumored next generation Gold Wing. If it has what the rumors say, it could be interesting.
Same here. I'm convinced all the manufacturers are righteous,self centered, And don't listen to their true customer base. Honda... Wing owners have been bitchin for years(Rightfully so) About the packages honda would force on you to get something like ABS. In the past. To get ABS. With Honda. You had to get the audio package I think it was. But with that. You get a gps that to operate. You have to stop. No operating when rolling to look for fuel for example. And owners big complaint. No power windshield. Honda does not listen. Yamaha with their new Venture. It's a air cooled twin. Now we know owners wanted a liquid cooled V4 .Talk to your customers! Bmw redesigned the gtl fairing/bodywork for a reason. Customer complaints about it not protecting like an LT. I know I can't be the only one that's contacted BMW and told them the GTL. Nice and all wasn't the LT aesthetically speaking and I wasn't interested. Why am I going to buy a new bike for 26K . Then have to spend $$$ for aero wings, windshield etc to make almost as comfy and give me the same wind protection as my 13 yr old Lt? These corporate pinheads just don't listen. Gotta give Harley credit. The customer base liked the roadglide. But interviews suggested the fairing was dated. What did they do? Held it out for a year and completely redesigned the fairing. And a great job they did. I rode one. And the difference is absolutely amazing. The vent system works very well. It brought the radio/controls closer to the rider. Very smart move. If I was a HD guy. That'd be the bike. The Rushmore project was a great idea. The others need to take a lesson here.
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post #5 of 43 Old Jun 21st, 2017, 12:17 pm
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Re: K1600B

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Originally Posted by beech View Post
As a K bike lover, I have to agree the series is dead. The K1600 is just....not there. Keep them running as best you can.
Yep, I hope to keep mine going another 5 years or so and then decide what to do. Once wiring and other parts get 15+ years old, the random failures get annoying, particularly on long trips to remote places.

I am looking at a KLR650 to ride locally and when my LT is down for maintenance or repair. Mine has averaged more than two weeks of downtime per year for the 10 years I have owned it. The big issues were two weeks waiting on buckets for my first valve adjustment. Five weeks for final drive rebuild (didn't know about Saddleman) and six weeks for clutch repair. Add in the normal 12 and 24K work, tires, etc. and I easily lose 14 riding days each year. I lost maybe two days each year for the 17 years I owned my Kawasaki Voyager.

The LT is the first non-Kawasaki I have owned (other than my Chibi mini bike) and the first bike that gave me a need for a spare bike to ride during down time. It may well be my last BMW as well as my first. Too unreliable, too expensive for parts, too many special tools needed, too few dealers, and nearest dealer whom I will never patronize again due too poor treatment by their service manager.

The only way BMW will get a second sale is if they provide a true LT successor and I think the odds of that are nil.

2017 KLR650 "Mule"
2007 K1200LT "Starship Enterprise", VOICE II, Navigator V, Motorrad Communicator
1987 Kawasaki Voyager XII
1976 Kawasaki KH400
1973 Kawasaki 100 G5
1970 Rockford Chibi (the orange one)

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post #6 of 43 Old Jun 21st, 2017, 1:01 pm
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Re: K1600B

I'm new to this forum and hope I don't step on any toes? But, Uuuuh NO! BMW seems to be getting away from the true "bagger" bikes. This bike is nice and beautiful but it will never replace the LT in my opinion. except that if you want a new BMW its about your only option. Just simply bolting a set of plastic briefcase boxes to the side of a crotch rocket doesn't make it a full dress bike. In reality, the full dress BMW died in 2009 with the LT being discontinued. The K1600LT is a design I don't care for much "to me it looks like something out of the Robocop movie" and the fact that they removed the automatic center stand and for a few years loosing the reverse also is where I got frustrated. I'm a simple old school, full dress plastic that covers the whole front of my bike, including my legs, big and heavy, smooth riding, outside radio, C/B radio, armrest and floorboards bike kind of guy! That's the way I roll.

I cant switch to Honda Goldwing because they don't offer the hydraulic center stand and if you know and understand just how state of the art the servo assisted, power anti-lock brakes on the K1200 are, and how they operate, It is by far the safest braking system made for a motorcycle. So I will continue to resurrect all the LT's I can before society runs out of them.

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post #7 of 43 Old Jun 21st, 2017, 2:15 pm
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Re: K1600B

Quote:
Originally Posted by BeemerJoe View Post
Could this be the ultimate replacement for our beloved LT?https://ultimatemotorcycling.com/201...announced-usa/
No!!!
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post #8 of 43 Old Jun 21st, 2017, 2:36 pm Thread Starter
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Re: K1600B

It amazes me how loyal Lt riders are. Yes their are those nea-sayers out there who may have gotten lemons or just were unlucky with theirs. I for one after being a Harley fanatic for almost 40 years switched to BMW about 2 years ago. Started with an RT. Loved it but still missed my ElectraGlyde. Then one fantastic day i got an amazing trade on a 2006 LT. I've never ever looked back, and now I'm at that same point of fanaticism that i was for my Harley. I've put on almost 20k on the 06 in 1 years, and have had absolutely no issues. The previous owner had put on all the upgrades and it's been a joy. I have to agree. BMW messed up by discontinuing that model, and should really bring it back.
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Palm Coast, FL.

2006 K1200LT (Love it)
2002 R1150RT (Sold)
2007 Harley FLHTCU (sold at 137k Miles)
1999 Harley Night train (blew the eng at 150k miles)
1986 harley Davidson FLTC (Sold When assigned to Europe
1982 Harley Wide Glide (sold)
1981 Kawasaki k1000LTD (sold)
1980 Triumph Bonneville (sold)
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post #9 of 43 Old Jun 21st, 2017, 4:33 pm
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Re: K1600B

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Originally Posted by BeemerJoe View Post
It amazes me how loyal Lt riders are. Yes their are those nea-sayers out there who may have gotten lemons or just were unlucky with theirs. I for one after being a Harley fanatic for almost 40 years switched to BMW about 2 years ago. Started with an RT. Loved cit but still missed my ElectraGlyde. Then one fantastic day i got an amazing trade on a 2006 LT. I've never ever looked back, and now I'm at that same point of fanaticism that i was for my Harley. I've put on almost 20k on the 06 in 1 years, and have had absolutely no issues. The previous owner had put on all the upgrades and it's been a joy. I have to agree. BMW messed up by discontinuing that model, and should really bring it back.
I think bringing it back would be a mistake as it had some real issues. I think the K1600 power train is superior to the LT in almost every way. If they fixed the excessive driveline lash and the goofy oil check and coaxial plug drain system, it would be superior in every way. I would like to see BMW keep the K1600 power train, chassis and suspension, but design the fairing for LT class protection, the passenger seat for LT class pillion comfort and design integrated, non quick detach bags and trunk. This should replace the GTL. Keep the GT for those who want ugly quick detach bags and trunk, and who really are sport bike wannabes rather than two-up long distance tourers.


A power centerstand is nice, but with the much lighter bike it is less of an issue and adds weight, cost and reduces ground clearance. I would be more than happy with a two stage system like that on my 1987 Kawasaki Voyager XII. It isn't as sexy as pressing a button, but the two stage mechanical stand made hoisting the bike easy. Push down the first lever which deployed the stand until it just kissed the ground and then push the second lever with your foot and the additional leverage would easily pop the bike up onto the center stand. Easy to use, cheap, compact and stone axe reliable.


2017 KLR650 "Mule"
2007 K1200LT "Starship Enterprise", VOICE II, Navigator V, Motorrad Communicator
1987 Kawasaki Voyager XII
1976 Kawasaki KH400
1973 Kawasaki 100 G5
1970 Rockford Chibi (the orange one)

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post #10 of 43 Old Jun 21st, 2017, 6:33 pm
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Re: K1600B

Ahhh, NO.

I love my LT and after 330000 miles I still love it like the day i first drove her. Sorry BMW you are going the wrong. Looks like every other bagger. no way. Dont get me wrong I love my RT but its NOT a LT. One of the few things engineers got right. Its just the perfect riding machine. Im doing a clutch on her now and them the RT will be parked for awhile while I ride my baby. Thinking maybe a 50cc next year.
Just love being on that bike.

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post #11 of 43 Old Jun 21st, 2017, 6:49 pm
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Re: K1600B

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Originally Posted by beech View Post
As a K bike lover, I have to agree the series is dead.
They shoulda never called the Transverse fours & sixes K-bikes.
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post #12 of 43 Old Jun 21st, 2017, 10:32 pm
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Re: K1600B

You(We) need to contact the mothership and tell them what you just wrote. The only way things will change. Otherwise. They will keep doing the same.

2004 K1200LT. Big Mama
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post #13 of 43 Old Jun 21st, 2017, 10:39 pm
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Re: K1600B

Don't bother emailng NJ, twice I have gotten back polite notes saying they do not take suggestions from the public. I have emailed Germany though. And if you have a working relationship with your dealer that is a conduit also.

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post #14 of 43 Old Jun 21st, 2017, 10:58 pm
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Re: K1600B

Quote:
Originally Posted by Voyager View Post
I think bringing it back would be a mistake as it had some real issues. I think the K1600 power train is superior to the LT in almost every way. If they fixed the excessive driveline lash and the goofy oil check and coaxial plug drain system, it would be superior in every way. I would like to see BMW keep the K1600 power train, chassis and suspension, but design the fairing for LT class protection, the passenger seat for LT class pillion comfort and design integrated, non quick detach bags and trunk. This should replace the GTL. Keep the GT for those who want ugly quick detach bags and trunk, and who really are sport bike wannabes rather than two-up long distance tourers.


A power centerstand is nice, but with the much lighter bike it is less of an issue and adds weight, cost and reduces ground clearance. I would be more than happy with a two stage system like that on my 1987 Kawasaki Voyager XII. It isn't as sexy as pressing a button, but the two stage mechanical stand made hoisting the bike easy. Push down the first lever which deployed the stand until it just kissed the ground and then push the second lever with your foot and the additional leverage would easily pop the bike up onto the center stand. Easy to use, cheap, compact and stone axe reliable.

https://youtu.be/ttSA7SaW-dA
I agree 100% The K1600 engine and drive line combined with the comfort and great fairing protection of the LT. When you phase out a Long distance tourer. Shouldn't you replace it with something equal to or better? And that doesn't mean detachable bags. The GTL doesn't even have rear speakers. Yea. Suspension, engine technology wise the 1600 is great. It's like BMW just got lazy and just didn't finish the job. BTW. That centerstand on the Kawasaki is the best design. Your right. That's the way to go.

2004 K1200LT. Big Mama
1999 Suzuki Intruder VL1500LC. Betty Lou.
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post #15 of 43 Old Jun 21st, 2017, 11:10 pm
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Re: K1600B

Wow. I guess what I said about these motorcycle manufacturers being righteous and self centered arrogance wasn't to far off huh? Hmm. Well my Lt will probably be the last BMW I own. They would have to pull a rabbit out of the proverbial hat to hook me. Or as a replacement I look for another LT when this dies if they're still around.

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post #16 of 43 Old Jun 22nd, 2017, 6:49 am
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Re: K1600B

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Don't bother emailng NJ, twice I have gotten back polite notes saying they do not take suggestions from the public. I have emailed Germany though. And if you have a working relationship with your dealer that is a conduit also.
Yes, BMW could care less what you think. They are easily the most arrogant company in the motorcycle (or auto) world.

Kawasaki isn't much better. When they discontinued the Voyager XII, they gave the impression of working with the AVA (BMWMOA equivalent) and its members to define the requirements for the replacement. They got many good suggestions to add things like FI, ABS, electric windshield, etc., but keep the basic inline 4 engine with updates for competitive power. After a couple of years the chatter slowed down and then got quiet. After 4 long years they released a bike completely unlike anything any AVA member wanted. They became a Harley wannabe with the Vulcan Voyager. Another V-twin with bags and trunk. That is when I left the Kawasaki fold after 30 years and bought the LT. I don't know the VV sales figures, but I almost never see one on the road. Folks that want a Harley will buy a Harley.

I really, really don't want a Honda product of any form (long story), but the reality is that they are the only company still taking two-up luxury touring seriously. Unless the new Gold Wing is a V-twin Harley wannabe, it may be the only real upgrade path for an LT owner.

I thought the Kawasaki C14 might be a possible option as it is more comfortable than the Yamaha FJR, but lack of cruise is a deal breaker for me. I sent a letter to Kawasaki suggesting that cruise would be a great addition (this was before Yamaha finally added it to the FJR) and didn't even get a form letter reply.

2017 KLR650 "Mule"
2007 K1200LT "Starship Enterprise", VOICE II, Navigator V, Motorrad Communicator
1987 Kawasaki Voyager XII
1976 Kawasaki KH400
1973 Kawasaki 100 G5
1970 Rockford Chibi (the orange one)

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post #17 of 43 Old Jun 22nd, 2017, 6:49 am Thread Starter
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Re: K1600B

I Really think the LT will be around for a long long time and become a true classic and collectible. The "low price" trend will reverse when people realize they are hard to find. I know it'll most likely be the last bike "i own, and ride" for sure. Once hit the time when I can't hold her up, i'll retire her.


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Palm Coast, FL.

2006 K1200LT (Love it)
2002 R1150RT (Sold)
2007 Harley FLHTCU (sold at 137k Miles)
1999 Harley Night train (blew the eng at 150k miles)
1986 harley Davidson FLTC (Sold When assigned to Europe
1982 Harley Wide Glide (sold)
1981 Kawasaki k1000LTD (sold)
1980 Triumph Bonneville (sold)
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post #18 of 43 Old Jun 22nd, 2017, 5:57 pm
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Re: K1600B

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Same here. I'm convinced all the manufacturers are righteous,self centered, And don't listen to their true customer base. Honda... Wing owners have been bitchin for years(Rightfully so) About the packages honda would force on you to get something like ABS. In the past. To get ABS. With Honda. You had to get the audio package I think it was. But with that. You get a gps that to operate. You have to stop. No operating when rolling to look for fuel for example. And owners big complaint. No power windshield. Honda does not listen. Yamaha with their new Venture. It's a air cooled twin. Now we know owners wanted a liquid cooled V4 .Talk to your customers! Bmw redesigned the gtl fairing/bodywork for a reason. Customer complaints about it not protecting like an LT. I know I can't be the only one that's contacted BMW and told them the GTL. Nice and all wasn't the LT aesthetically speaking and I wasn't interested. Why am I going to buy a new bike for 26K . Then have to spend $$$ for aero wings, windshield etc to make almost as comfy and give me the same wind protection as my 13 yr old Lt? These corporate pinheads just don't listen. Gotta give Harley credit. The customer base liked the roadglide. But interviews suggested the fairing was dated. What did they do? Held it out for a year and completely redesigned the fairing. And a great job they did. I rode one. And the difference is absolutely amazing. The vent system works very well. It brought the radio/controls closer to the rider. Very smart move. If I was a HD guy. That'd be the bike. The Rushmore project was a great idea. The others need to take a lesson here.
Agreed....... All this manufacturer just want to go ahead, because technology changes so quickly....and allow them to do so.
How about looking back at the inventory you have....Beemer engineer fix the issues the Lt has had from birth, and we would have a super bike... The world would embrace it...... Pass this on the BMW corporation.
In love with my LT. She is the best ride I ever had among all the bike I have had!
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post #19 of 43 Old Jun 22nd, 2017, 9:24 pm
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Re: K1600B

It's been interesting to read this thread touting the benefits of LT ownership and design, while basically lambasting BMW for not bringing out a suitable replacement.

I loved my LT, but lusted for more power, so succumbed to the siren of the GTLE. Although I somewhat miss the EHCS, reverse gear, and good looks of the LT, the GTL/GTLE /GT is much easier to maneuver in parking lots, handle better, and have much more power and better lighting. I had PIAA's and an RDL on the LT, and added Clearwater Darlas and an RDL on the GTLE, and would equate the comfort level comparable and lighting superior to the LT.

One suggestion that I have is for the LT stalwarts to add any farkles as soon as possible, as the aftermarket is getting leaner, and leaner for the LT - cases in point, the Fix-It-Before-It-Breaks latch kit, and the BMR luggage rack. As time progresses, aftermarket suppliers will stop supporting no-longer-in-production bikes and focus efforts on currently available models.

Let the flames begin...

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post #20 of 43 Old Jun 22nd, 2017, 9:45 pm
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Re: K1600B

Instead of listening to buyers, it seems motorcycle companies look to each other and make their design changes from there. This BMW B is obviously the competition for the Honda version. For me, I would want to ride it before making a decision. Obviously, it is not made to be the next LT. It may still be a great bike.

I like the way the B looks but I like the way a lot of motorcycles look, from classic to modern design. It may be a great bike to ride for a weekend while staying in a hotel. It may not be a great bike for hauling all of the gear needed to camp across America. My understanding is passenger comfort was best achieved on the LT, but I almost never have a passenger. Unless something changes, in 10 years, I might move on to a 2020 GTL. Although, if the LT parts dry up, new decisions may have to be made. We shall see.

I don't think LT is the best bike ever. Different bikes serve different purposes and some meet those purposes better than other and not everyone wants the same purposes.
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post #21 of 43 Old Jun 23rd, 2017, 1:54 am
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Re: K1600B

You are correct. Aftermarket is getting thin. I sure did notice it. I really wanna love the GTL. I just don't. Although. The 2018 looks like they are reworking the fairng design. I'll keep my LT for as long as i can. Hopefully. The GTL or another beemer by that point might better suit me. It might be fitted closer to my liking. There are things i like about the GTL. Lighter weight. Better brakes/suspension. And the awesome Motor. But. I can't get to that point to say...YEA. I really love it.

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post #22 of 43 Old Jun 23rd, 2017, 7:04 am
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Re: K1600B

Quote:
Originally Posted by JNW003 View Post
It's been interesting to read this thread touting the benefits of LT ownership and design, while basically lambasting BMW for not bringing out a suitable replacement.

I loved my LT, but lusted for more power, so succumbed to the siren of the GTLE. Although I somewhat miss the EHCS, reverse gear, and good looks of the LT, the GTL/GTLE /GT is much easier to maneuver in parking lots, handle better, and have much more power and better lighting. I had PIAA's and an RDL on the LT, and added Clearwater Darlas and an RDL on the GTLE, and would equate the comfort level comparable and lighting superior to the LT.

One suggestion that I have is for the LT stalwarts to add any farkles as soon as possible, as the aftermarket is getting leaner, and leaner for the LT - cases in point, the Fix-It-Before-It-Breaks latch kit, and the BMR luggage rack. As time progresses, aftermarket suppliers will stop supporting no-longer-in-production bikes and focus efforts on currently available models.

Let the flames begin...

No reason for flames. Your preferred attributes of power and lighter weight favor the GTL. My preferred attributes of comfort and drivetrain smoothness favor the LT. What's wrong with that? BMW simply no longer makes a bike that provides the attributes I favor and thus I comment on that from time to time. I am just perplexed why so many GTL owners get butt hurt when you fail to worship their current ride.

I have not commented based on conjecture. I have close to 5,000 miles of GTL riding experience. 2400 miles on a 2013 in Switzerland and Italy and 2600 miles on a 2015 in England, Scotland and Wales. My wife and I both agree that the GTL is not just a little deficient in comfort compared to the LT, but a lot deficient, particularly for her. And my LT is completely stock in that regard. Stock seat and stock windshield. I am comparing apples to apples, stock bike to stock bike. Sure, I could invest $2,000 into a $30,000 GTL and maybe with new windshield, air shields, seat, trunk support reinforcement, etc., approach the comfort of my stock (and paid for) LT, but why? I could invest a similar amount into an $18,000 FJR1300 and do the same and have a much better dealer that is 40 miles away rather than 110. The GTL just offers me no compelling reason to spend $30,000.

It comes down to how you ride. I ride two-up, luggage full, mostly in the eastern US and Canada. Most of my riding is interstate or sweeping two lane roads in all sorts of weather. 98% of my miles are at fairly steady speeds and not scraping the hard parts. The LT excels here. 2% is moving the bike around a parking lot, fast acceleration or peg scraping. The GTL excels there. I prefer a bike that does well what I do 98% of the time. The GTL is simply not that bike.

Some need to always buy the newest toy, be it cell phones or motorcycles. I have no such need. I buy what best suits me. I still use an iPhone 5s as I prefer small phones. I probably won't buy a 7 or 8 until I have no alternative. Same with the GTL. If I have to replace my LT due to accident or it gets too unreliable, I may step down to a GTL, but I would look hard at the Gold Wing first and possibly other bikes, such as the new Yamaha Venture and even the FJR now that it had cruise control. If only they hadn't used an air cooled V-twin in the new Venture. What were they thinking?
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post #23 of 43 Old Jun 23rd, 2017, 7:11 am
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Re: K1600B

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You are correct. Aftermarket is getting thin. I sure did notice it. I really wanna love the GTL. I just don't. Although. The 2018 looks like they are reworking the fairng design. I'll keep my LT for as long as i can. Hopefully. The GTL or another beemer by that point might better suit me. It might be fitted closer to my liking. There are things i like about the GTL. Lighter weight. Better brakes/suspension. And the awesome Motor. But. I can't get to that point to say...YEA. I really love it.
I was intrigued by the addition of reverse assist and the fairing changes this year. I may try to rent one in another year or two to see if this addresses the wind issues for the passenger. It still won't address the bouncing trunk that beats against the passenger on rough roads though... I am hoping my LT will last long enough for bmw to address enough of the GTL deficiencies to make it worth $30,000 to me.

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post #24 of 43 Old Jun 24th, 2017, 1:00 pm
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Re: K1600B

I hear The Exclusive doesn't bounce because of the frame for the armrests. And there is a 1600 member who welded up a frame on his GTL to eliminate the bounce. I'm with you. I will rent a 2018 or newer at some point. And go from there. I think at some point they will address more issues. The Goldwing is still up top. And the mothership still has work ahead. And I'm really not a huge wing fan. But. That's the standard for touring I think.

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post #25 of 43 Old Jun 24th, 2017, 1:42 pm
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Re: K1600B

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I hear The Exclusive doesn't bounce because of the frame for the armrests. And there is a 1600 member who welded up a frame on his GTL to eliminate the bounce. I'm with you. I will rent a 2018 or newer at some point. And go from there. I think at some point they will address more issues. The Goldwing is still up top. And the mothership still has work ahead. And I'm really not a huge wing fan. But. That's the standard for touring I think.
That could be. I have not ridden an armrest equipped GTL.

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post #26 of 43 Old Jun 24th, 2017, 4:27 pm
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Re: K1600B

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That could be. I have not ridden an armrest equipped GTL.
The armrests mount underneath the top case. Although the armrests are fixed, the top case still bounces around on my GTLE. I haven't tried removing the top case off, but my understanding is the armrests would need to be removed separately if you want a cleaner look without the top case on. As I rarely ride two-up, I don't notice any bouncing.

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post #27 of 43 Old Jun 24th, 2017, 8:03 pm
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Re: K1600B

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The armrests mount underneath the top case. Although the armrests are fixed, the top case still bounces around on my GTLE. I haven't tried removing the top case off, but my understanding is the armrests would need to be removed separately if you want a cleaner look without the top case on. As I rarely ride two-up, I don't notice any bouncing.
I am curious: why a GTLE for solo riding rather than a GT? I ride an LT mainly because it works so well two-up. And I don't ride a 1600 because it doesn't.

If I rode solo, I would ride a GT. Actually, I would ride an FJR1300. I test rode one the year they added cruise control. It's power train put the K1600 to shame for smoothness and precise fuel injection mapping. It lacks the raw power of the 1600, but was much nicer to ride. Unfortunately, it just isn't a two-up machine. For me alone, it would be a great ride and the $10,000 I'd save over a BMW would pay for a few really nice trips!

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post #28 of 43 Old Jun 24th, 2017, 9:24 pm
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Re: K1600B

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I am curious: why a GTLE for solo riding rather than a GT? I ride an LT mainly because it works so well two-up. And I don't ride a 1600 because it doesn't.

If I rode solo, I would ride a GT. Actually, I would ride an FJR1300. I test rode one the year they added cruise control. It's power train put the K1600 to shame for smoothness and precise fuel injection mapping. It lacks the raw power of the 1600, but was much nicer to ride. Unfortunately, it just isn't a two-up machine. For me alone, it would be a great ride and the $10,000 I'd save over a BMW would pay for a few really nice trips!
I bought an LT specifically for long distance touring and took several trips before and after retiring. My wife (Sandy) flew and I rode to meet up in Denver, Chattanooga, and Coeur d'Alene, as she was still working and doesn't like riding on freeways. On the way up to CDA, I rode up with a couple riding a K1600GT with a top case added and was impressed with their ability to pass on two lane roads without effort. At the Chattanooga CCR, they had a GTLE on static display in the hotel lobby and I made it a point to stop by with Sandy and look at it.... At CDA, she and I rode with another couple that had a GTLE, and Sandy liked the pillion comfort features (the higher pillion seat in relation to the LT didn't come up).

After getting back home, over a span of several months, I test rode a GTL, GT, and '15 K1200RT and found the K1600's easier to ride than the LT and preferred them over the RT, due to size and vibration. However, I liked the riding position of the GTL much better, as it was more like the LT.

I almost bought a GT that already had an RDL on eBay from Iowa (lost the bid), and a '14 GTLE from Texas (lost that bid too). Sandy suggested that I just buy a new one. Next week, I went to my local dealer and ordered my bike and had plans to spend '16 and forward on several long distance tours, after taking delivery in May '16. However, after suffering with RDL withdrawal pains (in the butt), I decided to postpone any longer distance rides until after I got another RDL, but wasn't able to get a ride-in appointment until early October '16. A couple months before Sandy was slated to retire, she developed a blood clot in November and was later diagnosed with cancer and I've cancelled several vacations since (we would have been on an African safari right now), the SLC MOA rally next month, and a Mediterranean cruise in August. In the interim, I take short half day local rides with a fellow GTL/S1000XR/K1300 rider. We also got good news yesterday, that Sandy's chemo treatments have been working and have been extended for another 12 weeks with the possibility of surgery thereafter.

Sorry for the long, long answer, but I also needed to ventilate. Bottom line, don't postpone or procrastinate, as you never know what life has in store for you...

Dave Beck
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post #29 of 43 Old Jun 25th, 2017, 7:31 am
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Re: K1600B

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I bought an LT specifically for long distance touring and took several trips before and after retiring. My wife (Sandy) flew and I rode to meet up in Denver, Chattanooga, and Coeur d'Alene, as she was still working and doesn't like riding on freeways. On the way up to CDA, I rode up with a couple riding a K1600GT with a top case added and was impressed with their ability to pass on two lane roads without effort. At the Chattanooga CCR, they had a GTLE on static display in the hotel lobby and I made it a point to stop by with Sandy and look at it.... At CDA, she and I rode with another couple that had a GTLE, and Sandy liked the pillion comfort features (the higher pillion seat in relation to the LT didn't come up).

After getting back home, over a span of several months, I test rode a GTL, GT, and '15 K1200RT and found the K1600's easier to ride than the LT and preferred them over the RT, due to size and vibration. However, I liked the riding position of the GTL much better, as it was more like the LT.

I almost bought a GT that already had an RDL on eBay from Iowa (lost the bid), and a '14 GTLE from Texas (lost that bid too). Sandy suggested that I just buy a new one. Next week, I went to my local dealer and ordered my bike and had plans to spend '16 and forward on several long distance tours, after taking delivery in May '16. However, after suffering with RDL withdrawal pains (in the butt), I decided to postpone any longer distance rides until after I got another RDL, but wasn't able to get a ride-in appointment until early October '16. A couple months before Sandy was slated to retire, she developed a blood clot in November and was later diagnosed with cancer and I've cancelled several vacations since (we would have been on an African safari right now), the SLC MOA rally next month, and a Mediterranean cruise in August. In the interim, I take short half day local rides with a fellow GTL/S1000XR/K1300 rider. We also got good news yesterday, that Sandy's chemo treatments have been working and have been extended for another 12 weeks with the possibility of surgery thereafter.

Sorry for the long, long answer, but I also needed to ventilate. Bottom line, don't postpone or procrastinate, as you never know what life has in store for you...

Very sorry to hear about Sandy, but good that you have some good news of late. Cancer treatment has cone a long way. I agree 100% on the procrastination part. Don't put off too many things until later. Later may never come.

It sounds like you bought the GTL for two-up riding which makes a lot of sense. Unfortunate that you have to ride it solo for the time being. Hopefully, that won't be the case too long.
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post #30 of 43 Old Jun 25th, 2017, 10:51 am
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Re: K1600B

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That could be. I have not ridden an armrest equipped GTL.
Me neither.Although with the frame for the armrests. It makes sense that it would stop the bounce. If I go with a GTL. It would be an exclusive anyways.
The another thing I have a problem with is the audio system. No rear speakers. I could live with that though as long as the bluetooth works decent. Which on early models some said was kinda flaky. But I guess that's better also. Yea. The more I think about it. The more I believe the GTL will be my next ride by default. What choices are out there? After having the multi cylinder smoothness of of a brick 4 cylinder. What? I'm gonna go to a HD? A Indian? A Yamaha Venture? Don't think so. The new Harley Roadglides are real nice. And the Indians are really quite something. But a totally different ride than an LT. Consider a Goldwing? Not real fond of the looks. But maybe. By the time my LTs done. I'm hoping the market. Particularly BMW has more to offer or at least addresses the need for a true tourer.

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post #31 of 43 Old Jun 25th, 2017, 11:48 am
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Re: K1600B

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I'm new to this forum and hope I don't step on any toes? But, Uuuuh NO! BMW seems to be getting away from the true "bagger" bikes. This bike is nice and beautiful but it will never replace the LT in my opinion. except that if you want a new BMW its about your only option. Just simply bolting a set of plastic briefcase boxes to the side of a crotch rocket doesn't make it a full dress bike. In reality, the full dress BMW died in 2009 with the LT being discontinued. The K1600LT is a design I don't care for much "to me it looks like something out of the Robocop movie" and the fact that they removed the automatic center stand and for a few years loosing the reverse also is where I got frustrated. I'm a simple old school, full dress plastic that covers the whole front of my bike, including my legs, big and heavy, smooth riding, outside radio, C/B radio, armrest and floorboards bike kind of guy! That's the way I roll.

I cant switch to Honda Goldwing because they don't offer the hydraulic center stand and if you know and understand just how state of the art the servo assisted, power anti-lock brakes on the K1200 are, and how they operate, It is by far the safest braking system made for a motorcycle. So I will continue to resurrect all the LT's I can before society runs out of them.

Ron
I agree. (The GTL) Is not a replacement for the LT. My LT is an 04. So I don't have nor want a power centerstand. And I do have servo brakes.Although I'm not a big fan of them. Pumps are to unreliable and problematic. So those things are not what's keeping me from a Wing. I just think it needs a facelift. And the lack of a power wind shield,Which wing owners have been wanting for years.Other than that. A Wing may be the ticket.

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post #32 of 43 Old Jun 25th, 2017, 6:52 pm
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Re: K1600B

Guys your throwing the meatloaf out before you even tasted it, yes my wife's meatloaf sucks but that is not my point. Granted it is probably the Germans half assed attempt to attract the American bagger crowd and not much touring thought went into its design, but until we ride one lets keep an open mind. Lets be honest if we could jam a K1600 engine in our LT's that would be awesome! The issue is for the guys like me who can not wrench, keeping the aging LT's won't work, if it breaks there are fewer and fewer independents as well as dealers that even want to work on them and even if they do your talking major $. I need to find a replacement at some point. Until I see a BMW Bagger and get to ride it , I will still keep hope that it will have enough LT MoJo to make me happy. If not I keep searching. Thats my 2 cents!
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post #33 of 43 Old Jun 25th, 2017, 8:38 pm
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Re: K1600B

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Guys your throwing the meatloaf out before you even tasted it, yes my wife's meatloaf sucks but that is not my point. Granted it is probably the Germans half assed attempt to attract the American bagger crowd and not much touring thought went into its design, but until we ride one lets keep an open mind. Lets be honest if we could jam a K1600 engine in our LT's that would be awesome! The issue is for the guys like me who can not wrench, keeping the aging LT's won't work, if it breaks there are fewer and fewer independents as well as dealers that even want to work on them and even if they do your talking major $. I need to find a replacement at some point. Until I see a BMW Bagger and get to ride it , I will still keep hope that it will have enough LT MoJo to make me happy. If not I keep searching. Thats my 2 cents!
If a bagger is what you want. A bagger is the last last thing this LT owner wants.
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post #34 of 43 Old Jun 27th, 2017, 12:31 pm
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Re: K1600B

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If a bagger is what you want. A bagger is the last last thing this LT owner wants.
I want a bike that rides like a LT or GoldWing. I want the trunkless look of a bagger, hence the F6B or K1600B. But I want the power and handling of a sport-tourer.

So the K1600B might be for me, as long as the suspension is not a serious compromise! A four cylinder 1200cc trunkless Gold Wing would tickle my fancy, too!

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post #35 of 43 Old Jun 27th, 2017, 1:35 pm
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Re: K1600B

"But I want the power and handling of a sport-tourer."
Find yourself a late model K1300S. You will never look back.
But the MCN says the new Indian Chief Elite is the best "bagger" out there now.

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post #36 of 43 Old Jul 16th, 2017, 12:41 pm
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Re: K1600B

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MCN says the new Indian Chief Elite is the best "bagger" out there now.
But that fairing is just ugly IMO. I'd rather have something like the new Road Glide or a Windjammer.

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post #37 of 43 Old Jul 18th, 2017, 8:21 am
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Re: K1600B

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It's been interesting to read this thread touting the benefits of LT ownership and design, while basically lambasting BMW for not bringing out a suitable replacement.

I loved my LT, but lusted for more power, so succumbed to the siren of the GTLE. Although I somewhat miss the EHCS, reverse gear, and good looks of the LT, the GTL/GTLE /GT is much easier to maneuver in parking lots, handle better, and have much more power and better lighting. I had PIAA's and an RDL on the LT, and added Clearwater Darlas and an RDL on the GTLE, and would equate the comfort level comparable and lighting superior to the LT.

One suggestion that I have is for the LT stalwarts to add any farkles as soon as possible, as the aftermarket is getting leaner, and leaner for the LT - cases in point, the Fix-It-Before-It-Breaks latch kit, and the BMR luggage rack. As time progresses, aftermarket suppliers will stop supporting no-longer-in-production bikes and focus efforts on currently available models.

Let the flames begin...

I know I've said the K1600 is no true replacement for the LT. Which it isn't. But. I can't see myself with anything currently out there right now. It looks like it will be a GTL. I do like several things on the Indian Roadmaster. But overall. No. How do i go from liquid cooled multi cylinder smoothness. Power windscreen. Heated everything. And wind,weather protection like nothing else to a aircooled twin? The Goldwing yea. Great engine and many things it has are close but not Quite. If that damn Vision hadn't been so freakin ugly. I really did love the ride, even with a aircooled twin. So. It's lookin like a GTL when the time comes.

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post #38 of 43 Old Jul 18th, 2017, 8:57 am
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Re: K1600B

The 1600 GT/GLT just doesn't cut it for a replacement. I just noticed when I signed on the forum that 75 was signed on for the K1200LT forum - 8 for the 1600GT/GTL forum - 5 for the the K1200/1300GT 5 - GS series 4. My point is that it appears that the LT is still the King, but BMW will not admit to that fact. Like someone else had said, keep them repaired and running as long we can.
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post #39 of 43 Old Jul 18th, 2017, 9:07 am
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Re: K1600B

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I know I've said the K1600 is no true replacement for the LT. Which it isn't. But. I can't see myself with anything currently out there right now. It looks like it will be a GTL. I do like sevnceral things on the Indian Roadmaster. But overall. No. How do i go from liquid cooled multi cylinder smoothness. Power windscreen. Heated everything. And wind,weather protection like nothing else to a aircooled twin? The Goldwing yea. Great engine and many things it has are close but not Quite. If that damn Vision hadn't been so freakin ugly. I really did love the ride, even with a aircooled twin. So. It's lookin like a GTL when the time comes.
i have ridden almost every alternative to the LT and only the Wing comes close, but I have reasons for not wanting a Honda product. You only get to screw me over once.

The new Venture looks like it may match the LT for comfort and weather protection. The only obvious drawbacks are air cooled engine to bake your legs at stops, lousy fuel mileage, but can likely burn the poorest gas available, no ESA or traction control, and apparently no centerstand. Really?? Otherwise it looks quite good and you get the Yamaha reliability and dealer network.

However, just not sure I can live with air cooled engine that gets 34 mpg. If I had to trade tomorrow, I know I have to trade down and the 2018 GTLE looks like the least loss in the trade down. The good news is that my LT has never run better and if the new seals and o-ring can keep the oil where it belongs, I should easily have five more years before I have to trade.
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post #40 of 43 Old Jul 18th, 2017, 10:02 am
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Re: K1600B

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i have ridden almost every alternative to the LT and only the Wing comes close, but I have reasons for not wanting a Honda product. You only get to screw me over once.

The new Venture looks like it may match the LT for comfort and weather protection. The only obvious drawbacks are air cooled engine to bake your legs at stops, lousy fuel mileage, but can likely burn the poorest gas available, no ESA or traction control, and apparently no centerstand. Really?? Otherwise it looks quite good and you get the Yamaha reliability and dealer network.

However, just not sure I can live with air cooled engine that gets 34 mpg. If I had to trade tomorrow, I know I have to trade down and the 2018 GTLE looks like the least loss in the trade down. The good news is that my LT has never run better and if the new seals and o-ring can keep the oil where it belongs, I should easily have five more years before I have to trade.
Well. I'm going in for a new knee Monday. So. I'm done for the year in more reasons than one. My IABS3 servo failed. So in a few months ill be doing a bypass on the crap servo brake system. Then no more brake problems or worrying if it fails far from home. ABS is a nice feature,But not this system. Never was a big fan of iABS servos. But it will eventually need a clutch at some point I'm sure. Then. The new seals, slave cylinder will go in at that time if I still have it. Really though. Everything else issue wise will have been done. And it should literally last for years.

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post #41 of 43 Old Oct 17th, 2018, 5:19 pm
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Re: K1600B

I have a hard time believing all you guys saying how the bagger doesn't meet your needs and pointing towards the new Goldwing have test ridden or even looked at comparison reviews. Every comparison between the new Wing Base/Tour and K1600B/GA has the K1600 pretty much trouncing the wing.

The B is more similar in looks, capability, and every other aspect to the Goldwing Base, and the Grand America is more similar to the Goldwing Tour than any similarity to any cruiser "bagger". Frankly it's pretty hard to tell them apart.

Tom




and ......



Tom

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post #42 of 43 Old Oct 17th, 2018, 7:29 pm
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Posts: 7,093
Re: K1600B

Quote:
Originally Posted by TPadden View Post
I have a hard time believing all you guys saying how the bagger doesn't meet your needs and pointing towards the new Goldwing have test ridden or even looked at comparison reviews. Every comparison between the new Wing Base/Tour and K1600B/GA has the K1600 pretty much trouncing the wing.

The B is more similar in looks, capability, and every other aspect to the Goldwing Base, and the Grand America is more similar to the Goldwing Tour than any similarity to any cruiser "bagger". Frankly it's pretty hard to tell them apart.

Tom
I think you are in the wrong forum and wrong thread. You replied to a thread that has been dormant since before the new Wing was released.

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Voyager is offline  
post #43 of 43 Old Oct 21st, 2018, 6:13 am
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Location: Ringgold, GA, USA
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Re: K1600B

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Originally Posted by Voyager View Post
I think you are in the wrong forum and wrong thread. You replied to a thread that has been dormant since before the new Wing was released.
Not too sure about that; yes the thread is well over a year old and since then BMW has introduced the GA so I think he was showing the current models of the bikes and styles as opposed to what was available last year, especially the B Model.

My first BMW was the LT but that was way back in 2004 and I put about 90K on the clock, wife liked the bike and so did I but as we all know the bike had its' issues; the bike is outdated and if you can turn a wrench you can keep it running for years! The bike has been out of production for 9 years.

Replaced the LT with a 2013 GTL, for one up it was fine (we do ride two up) but the wife never did like the GTL for the reason of the "floating" top case and it was too tall for her; again this is personal preference.

Now when the GA came out earlier this year (and for us) that changed everything. The pillion seat is 2.75" shorter than the GTL, the top case is solid (I never did nor did I ever have the need to remove the top case) and the bike is just sexy! The GA is what we wanted. Most of my LT/GTL riding buddies know that I like to ride fast and the 103 max MPH is not an issue! I also didn't care for a blacked out scooter OR the bagger platform BUT guess what I ended up with! We have about 5K on the clock and love the bike

All being said, to each his own; ride what you want to ride!

Brett
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2019 K1600GA Blue

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