ABS Pump Failue ? - BMW Luxury Touring Community
 6Likes
  • 1 Post By jzeiler
  • 3 Post By jzeiler
  • 1 Post By Urbanhermit
  • 1 Post By Urbanhermit
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 21 Old Dec 31st, 2015, 9:52 pm Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Pensacola , FL, USA
Posts: 153
ABS Pump Failue ?

Has anybody felt an ABS pump failure? Hoping against hope that's not what happened but am 95% sure it is:

Caught in feet-down crawl traffic needing front brake for about 15 minutes, then at a red light, holding pressure on front. Felt a very subtle nudge or bump, very faint, but a feeling that caused me to pump the brake lever a couple times. It felt just a bit off, just enough to make me feel uneasy, then shrug to myself. Red triangle and "BRAKE FAILURE" start flashing. Light turns green, I'm rolling 35ish, give a couple of experimental squeezes, get a firm jolt (new stainless lines), but then holding the front brake on lightly to prepare for a turn, suddenly mush -- and I overshot the turn. "Cooling off" at destination apparently restores normal function until I apply brake and hold, and then mush again with the warning lights. This is a repeatable phenomenon.

Is there ANY possible cause for this besides ABS pump failure?
Urbanhermit is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 21 Old Jan 1st, 2016, 6:15 am
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Little Switzerland, NC, USA
Posts: 87
Re: ABS Pump Failue ?

What model year is bike?
Have you checked brake fluid levels?
Sounds similar to my 2002 LT symptoms, do you have access to a GS 911 diagnostic tool?

Fault codes will tell the story.

Regards,
Boots
IBA#50871

Come ride with me;

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


2006 R12GS 100K miles, current ride
1972 R60/5 Toaster 44K miles, current ride
2002 K12LTE 58K miles, SOLD
kedwards005 is offline  
post #3 of 21 Old Jan 1st, 2016, 7:43 am
Senior Member
 
johnT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Under a Rock, , USA
Posts: 633
Re: ABS Pump Failue ?

Check the brake fluid level.

True Wisdom Only Comes From Pain.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
johnT is offline  
 
post #4 of 21 Old Jan 1st, 2016, 7:45 am
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Helsinki, Finland, Europe, Northern hemisphere
Posts: 594
Re: ABS Pump Failue ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Urbanhermit View Post
Has anybody felt an ABS pump failure? Hoping against hope that's not what happened but am 95% sure it is:
Unfortunately you are correct. Very typical to have problems with ABS. Perhaps partly due to people neglecting annual brake fluid change. As kedwards said: Start by checking fluid levels, then have fault codes read.

Born to be wild so why not

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
C-A-D is offline  
post #5 of 21 Old Jan 1st, 2016, 2:44 pm Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Pensacola , FL, USA
Posts: 153
Re: ABS Pump Failue ?

Thanks, kedwards, John, and C-A-D. Know it's not the fault of old fluid because that was flushed/refilled when the stainless steel brake lines were installed less than 500 miles ago. If levels could do this I'll burn incense, bow down to a Voodoo doll, or wear a tutu to a Harley biker bar for it to be the reason. I'll check. My guru is 250 miles away, so I posted here before trailering over there.
Urbanhermit is offline  
post #6 of 21 Old Jan 2nd, 2016, 10:49 am
Wrencher Extraordinaire
 
jzeiler's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hazel Green, AL, USA
Posts: 13,233
Re: ABS Pump Failue ?

I would give it another chance as heavy brake usage under idling conditions will pull the battery down considerably ( I see a strong voltage drop on my voltmeter at a red light). A marginal battery will take some time to recover. Worth a shot to get a good charge and see what happens.
Patric likes this.

John
2009 K1300GT Red Rocket
2009 R1200GS (Gone)
2005 K1200LT Ocean Blue Blue Wizard 110 K and counting...
2006 Bushtec Turbo+2 Spell
2004 330 Ci Convertable
K4AN

Have ridden a Motorcycle in all 48
But lack DE, MA, RI and CT with the 2005 LT

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
jzeiler is offline  
post #7 of 21 Old Jan 2nd, 2016, 4:45 pm
Member
 
rosmba's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Posts: 57
Re: ABS Pump Failue ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by C-A-D View Post
Unfortunately you are correct. Very typical to have problems with ABS. Perhaps partly due to people neglecting annual brake fluid change. As kedwards said: Start by checking fluid levels, then have fault codes read.
one has to wonder why? I have ABS on cars and have had it on two Harleys and never had to change the fluid or had an ABS failure.
What is screwed up in the design of this system that demands yearly fluid changes and the replacement of the stock brake lines? Is this just a very poorly designed system, as the rear drive seems to be?

Rick Smith
Hagerstown, MD
rosmba is offline  
post #8 of 21 Old Jan 3rd, 2016, 6:48 am
Senior Member
 
MikeERideWNC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Murphy, NC, USA
Posts: 793
Re: ABS Pump Failue ?

I second the battery.
I have often seen LT's throw the warning when the battery is low.

Traffic is the reason I take the twisty or back roads to go places.
It takes the same amount of time and I have more fun going through an area I may have never seen before.

Visit
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
_ Why is there never enough time to do it right the first time, but always enough time to do it over?
MikeERideWNC is offline  
post #9 of 21 Old Jan 3rd, 2016, 8:24 am
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Helsinki, Finland, Europe, Northern hemisphere
Posts: 594
Re: ABS Pump Failue ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rosmba View Post
one has to wonder why? I have ABS on cars and have had it on two Harleys and never had to change the fluid or had an ABS failure.
What is screwed up in the design of this system that demands yearly fluid changes and the replacement of the stock brake lines? Is this just a very poorly designed system, as the rear drive seems to be?
Really do not have a good answer but few thoughts:

- Do not know how many car ABS-systems have inbuilt Servo-pumps to boost brakes - so the structure is complicated
- The amount of brake fluid in bike is really low compared to cars - so absorbed water ruins the fluid fast
- No need to switch brake lines until they do get old - exactly same in cars. I have switched many pieces of brake hoses in my cars during past years

Still I feel the servo-boosted brake system was a big mistake and that is the reason BMW gave up on it - just for the reason for it being so prone for failures.

Born to be wild so why not

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
C-A-D is offline  
post #10 of 21 Old Jan 3rd, 2016, 7:55 pm
Wrencher Extraordinaire
 
jzeiler's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hazel Green, AL, USA
Posts: 13,233
Re: ABS Pump Failue ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rosmba View Post
one has to wonder why? I have ABS on cars and have had it on two Harleys and never had to change the fluid or had an ABS failure.
What is screwed up in the design of this system that demands yearly fluid changes and the replacement of the stock brake lines? Is this just a very poorly designed system, as the rear drive seems to be?
It is not a good design if you don't want to do the proper maintenance.

I flush all my vehicles every three years,even the cars and many do require it. Nothing wrong with the rear drive design but rather improper assembly at the factory and during dealer repairs.

Yes the design on the servo ABS is complicated and it has a relatively small amount of fluid so the maintenance is even more critical.
Patric, sailor and deputy5211 like this.

John
2009 K1300GT Red Rocket
2009 R1200GS (Gone)
2005 K1200LT Ocean Blue Blue Wizard 110 K and counting...
2006 Bushtec Turbo+2 Spell
2004 330 Ci Convertable
K4AN

Have ridden a Motorcycle in all 48
But lack DE, MA, RI and CT with the 2005 LT

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
jzeiler is offline  
post #11 of 21 Old Jan 5th, 2016, 5:48 am Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Pensacola , FL, USA
Posts: 153
Re: ABS Pump Failue ?

Well, doesn't look like I'm going to have to wear a tutu to a Harley biker bar. Brake fluid is okay in both reservoirs. Battery has been on a trickle charger for days. Still getting the rapid blinking of the warning delta though on center stand, engine off, the hand brake felt good.

I think my only chance now is that the system might require the forward motion sensor check to clear the warning signals. However I hear a different pump whine than I've ever noticed before when I apply the brake. Faint, high-pitched, but sort of gravelly, as if multiple pitches sounding together.


But then again since Obamacare, it would probably cost me many times the cost of a pump replacement to get treated for the results of the tutu visit to the bar.
Urbanhermit is offline  
post #12 of 21 Old Jan 5th, 2016, 4:46 pm
Wrencher Extraordinaire
 
jzeiler's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hazel Green, AL, USA
Posts: 13,233
Re: ABS Pump Failue ?

The rapid blink is a "kiss of death" unless a GS-911 read out shows it to be pressure differential fault. Those can sometimes be fixed by pulling off the relief valve and cycling it to free it up. There is a guy in SA that has fixed quite a few for local riders but they are not easy to work on.

John
2009 K1300GT Red Rocket
2009 R1200GS (Gone)
2005 K1200LT Ocean Blue Blue Wizard 110 K and counting...
2006 Bushtec Turbo+2 Spell
2004 330 Ci Convertable
K4AN

Have ridden a Motorcycle in all 48
But lack DE, MA, RI and CT with the 2005 LT

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
jzeiler is offline  
post #13 of 21 Old Jan 5th, 2016, 7:29 pm
Lifetime Supporter
 
Patric's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Zephyrhills, Florida USA
Posts: 1,440
Re: ABS Pump Failue ?

Quote:
I think my only chance now is that the system might require the forward motion sensor check to clear the warning signals. However I hear a different pump whine than I've ever noticed before when I apply the brake. Faint, high-pitched, but sort of gravelly, as if multiple pitches sounding together.
Hi, I was thinking some forward motion may make the lights go out, ...I think the pump has 2 speeds , so it might explain the sound thing... or not...

I had the blinking ABS lights around 10 years ago, I put brake fluid in...that didn't help. I put in a new battery, ..It still had the blinking lights for a few days, then it went away. It has been good ever since.

Patric Blackman
2002 K1200LT/Hannigan2+2
2010 R1200GSA ...1987 Helix...
AMA Charter Lifemember
37 Year Member of both BMWMOA & BMWRA

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Patric is offline  
post #14 of 21 Old Jan 6th, 2016, 8:28 am Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Pensacola , FL, USA
Posts: 153
Re: ABS Pump Failue ?

Maybe this is assumed by respondents, but I don't have just blinking lights -- I've got full servo failure and almost no braking effect.

Thanks, jzeiler, for the tip about the relief valve. I'll make sure my guru doesn't overlook the possibility.
Patric likes this.
Urbanhermit is offline  
post #15 of 21 Old Jan 6th, 2016, 8:34 pm
Lifetime Supporter
 
johnbaker15's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Chelmsford, Ma, USA
Posts: 1,595
Re: ABS Pump Failue ?

As John said sort of, you need one of these.

04 BMW K1200GT K1200 K 1200GT 1200 GT ABS Brake Pressure Modulator | eBay

John Baker

2005 BMW K1200LT
1979 Suzuki GS1000E
1978 Honda CB350
1975 Suzuki GT380
johnbaker15 is offline  
post #16 of 21 Old Jan 9th, 2016, 8:12 am Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Pensacola , FL, USA
Posts: 153
Re: ABS Pump Failue ?

John, thank you for the suggestion, but I'll walk before I have anything to do with e-Bay, just like Sears got my last nickel in 1984.

Besides, at the expense level involved, I'd not be comfortable buying used from a complete unknown source and without recourse -- and my experience with e-Bay shows me they offer no real recourse.
Urbanhermit is offline  
post #17 of 21 Old Jan 9th, 2016, 2:11 pm
Wrencher Extraordinaire
 
jzeiler's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hazel Green, AL, USA
Posts: 13,233
Re: ABS Pump Failue ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Urbanhermit View Post
I'll walk before I have anything to do with e-Bay, just like Sears got my last nickel in 1984.
Guess you don't hold a grudge do you? I had a machinist that worked for me and he got treated bad at Sears once on a tool and never stepped foot in there again.

I don't blame you on the e-bay deal they didn't even know the mileage of the bike let alone if the unit worked. May have been the cause that resulted in parting out the bike, ABS failure!!!

Hope you find a good fix.

John
2009 K1300GT Red Rocket
2009 R1200GS (Gone)
2005 K1200LT Ocean Blue Blue Wizard 110 K and counting...
2006 Bushtec Turbo+2 Spell
2004 330 Ci Convertable
K4AN

Have ridden a Motorcycle in all 48
But lack DE, MA, RI and CT with the 2005 LT

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
jzeiler is offline  
post #18 of 21 Old Jan 10th, 2016, 6:43 am Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Pensacola , FL, USA
Posts: 153
Re: ABS Pump Failue ?

The only reason that automotive fraud class action suit against Sears in California, circa late 1970s/early 1980s didn't break out in Alabama was that my mechanically-retarded friend's girlfriend was a perpetual victim and had a dysfunctional relationship with her lawyer son. I had driven her car a few days before she took it to Sears in Mobile, left it for an oil change, shopped, and came back to find it on a rack with all four wheels off and the brakes pulled apart. She was told that the brakes were so worn it was against federal law for them to put them back together again -- yes! -- and they wanted $500 for a complete brake job. In the mid-80s. She was living on Social Security. Poormouthed them down to $400. I found out about it and went ballistic. There was nothing wrong with the brakes when I drove the car. Upshot of my going ballistic was I got calls from Sears Tower in Chicago, the Mobile store manager, and the automotive manager. I did not return any. Put it all before the girlfriend. She whined, retreated into her victim role, complained about her son, and did nothing.

There is a lot more I know first-hand about Sears but it's not appropriate for this forum. I've pushed the limits with this much.

But "Satisfaction guaranteed," my ass.
Patric likes this.
Urbanhermit is offline  
post #19 of 21 Old Jan 10th, 2016, 9:12 am
Lifetime Supporter
 
johnbaker15's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Chelmsford, Ma, USA
Posts: 1,595
Re: ABS Pump Failue ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Urbanhermit View Post
John, thank you for the suggestion, but I'll walk before I have anything to do with e-Bay, just like Sears got my last nickel in 1984.

Besides, at the expense level involved, I'd not be comfortable buying used from a complete unknown source and without recourse -- and my experience with e-Bay shows me they offer no real recourse.
While I understand your reluctance to deal with an unknown vendor, unknown part history, Ebay does have a full money back return policy. I have purchased a number of new and used items on Ebay and have had only one time that I had to use their policy. They contacted to seller, he returned my money with shipping charges included.

Unfortunately our selection for a solution is limited to by-pass, $2500 to BMW or try a used part.

John Baker

2005 BMW K1200LT
1979 Suzuki GS1000E
1978 Honda CB350
1975 Suzuki GT380
johnbaker15 is offline  
post #20 of 21 Old Jan 10th, 2016, 4:00 pm
Lifetime Supporter
 
JNW003's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Northridge, California, USA
Posts: 1,391
Re: ABS Pump Failue ?

I bought my '07 LT through eBay from a guy that lives about 10 miles away from me. Thoroughly happy with the transaction and very satisfied with the bike over the 27K miles I have ridden it all over the US.

Dave Beck
'16 K1600GTLE
'07 K1200LT (sold 9/24/16)
'74 Suzuki GT750L (long, long gone)


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
JNW003 is offline  
post #21 of 21 Old Jan 11th, 2016, 7:11 am Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Pensacola , FL, USA
Posts: 153
Re: ABS Pump Failue ?

e-Bay absolutely blew off a serious complaint I had years ago. No recourse whatsoever. I was out all the money and the effort of trying to recover it. Never again. Just like Sears has "Satisfaction Guaranteed" over their doors, and in 1985 I quit as a Home Improvement Products salesman because it was proven to be 100% hypocrisy.
Urbanhermit is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the BMW Luxury Touring Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
2006 LT ABS and Fuel Pump Fuse Hilton K1200LT 5 Feb 11th, 2014 9:55 pm
My Father purchased 2002 K1200LT with 7000 miles the abs pump stays on all the time Autodeal1 K1200LT 6 May 2nd, 2012 6:02 am
ABS pump not starting - rear only dslempke K1200LT 6 Dec 5th, 2009 9:34 am
03 LT ABS Pump turns on for no reason jroth3 K1200LT 12 May 10th, 2009 6:41 am
BMW to introduce a "G" series motorcycle? eljeffe Bike Talk 24 Oct 10th, 2006 4:56 pm

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome