Crank but no start - BMW Luxury Touring Community
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post #1 of 21 Old Jun 6th, 2015, 12:58 pm Thread Starter
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Crank but no start

Just had some receint work done by dealership, new fuel filter, new air filter,and screen, and break fluid replace. Put about a thousand miles on the bike, pulled up to a gas station, filled up, then tried to start the bike, bike truns over strong, but will not start.

Put the bike on a trailer, and took it home, pulled all the tupperware off, checked spark, the spark is strong. Put the bike in neutral, turned the key, I can hear the fuel pump run - not to be confused with the break pump. I have not pulled a plug yet, just put a used plug in and grounded it to check for spark. Im guessing a fuel problem. I still have a few more trouble shooting Ideas, like pulling the fuel line and checking flow etc... If anyone has any Ideas, that might save me some work, it would be greatly appreciated, thanks.
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post #2 of 21 Old Jun 6th, 2015, 1:07 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Crank but no start

I pulled the quick disconnect, there was some fuel in the line, but it did not seem like it was pressurized, gas just driped out, and if I cranked it with it disconected it did not squirt any gas out. Im not really familiar with this fuel system, but its seems to me that it should be under pressure if the pump is working.
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post #3 of 21 Old Jun 6th, 2015, 1:27 pm
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Re: Crank but no start

Sounds like the dreaded split fuel line in the gas tank. Look in the tank to see if you see fuel moving around while you crank.

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post #4 of 21 Old Jun 6th, 2015, 1:32 pm
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Re: Crank but no start

It sounds like the hose in the tank came off or has gone bad. Mine went bad on the freeway at 75 mph. coasted to stop had it towed to dealer. They said they have been running into this offend on the older bikes. They don't like the new fuel. Jim
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post #5 of 21 Old Jun 6th, 2015, 3:43 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Crank but no start

I cranked it, looked in the tank, did not see any bubbles or gas movement.

So I am guessing that since I pull the quick disconnects , and no pressure squirts gas after cranking, there is a leak somewhere. since the dealer just replaced the fuel filter, he may have not tightened the hose clamps good enough, or you say the hose splits, I looked at the invoice, and I think they replaced the hoses in the tank.

So it looks like I need to pull the tank, and pull the pump out.

I replaced a fuel filter in a R1200C, and there are several hose section looping the filter into the pump.
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post #6 of 21 Old Jun 6th, 2015, 4:12 pm
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Re: Crank but no start

You do not have to pull the tank off to pull the fuel pump assy out. Just drain the tank, put it on the side stand and remove the tipover bar frame (two bolts). They you can get the pump off. My bet is a hose popped off.

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post #7 of 21 Old Jun 6th, 2015, 5:14 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Crank but no start

That would be sweet if I could do that, I have a K1200LT, and the fuel pump is tucked in past the tipover bars, its really tight. I may take it to the dealer, they put the fuel filter in, probably didn't tighten the hose. I am looking at this tank, it it doesnt look easy to remove. Maybe I will look for a Utube on it, may be an easy way to loosen it. A least you don't have to take a bunch of bolts out, looks like a single screw top.
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post #8 of 21 Old Jun 6th, 2015, 5:50 pm
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Re: Crank but no start

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Originally Posted by martin18152 View Post
That would be sweet if I could do that, I have a K1200LT, and the fuel pump is tucked in past the tipover bars, its really tight. I may take it to the dealer, they put the fuel filter in, probably didn't tighten the hose. I am looking at this tank, it it doesnt look easy to remove. Maybe I will look for a Utube on it, may be an easy way to loosen it. A least you don't have to take a bunch of bolts out, looks like a single screw top.
Since the dealer worked on it last, you can take it to them, but they will charge you a fair bit if it is a failed hose. If the hose came loose, then you should be able to argue defective workmanship and if they are reputable they will not charge you.

My hose developed a pin hole leak last year. I had just filled the tank. The biggest headache was siphoning out 6 gallons of gas, but it wasn't too bad. Then, do as John said and you can quickly slide the pump/filter assembly out the bottom of the tank. It was amazingly easy once you remove the tip-over frame.

You can then decide what type of clamp to use. Many use the OEM Oetikers and you can't go wrong there, but they really aren't designed to be reusable so you need to keep a supply on hand as well as the tool to crimp them properly. And they can be a pain to remove. I use a good quality fuel injection type screw clamp and have had no problem with them on both my QDs (been on there for 7 years and 40K+ miles) or on the in-tank filter (3 years and nearly 24K miles). And if another hose fails while on the road, all I need is my screwdriver and torque-calibrated hand to make the repair and no need to carry spare clamps and extra tools.

However, several here have had bad luck with the screw type clamps. I honestly don't know why, but I suspect either an inferior clamp or improper tightening, but without seeing things first-hand, I can't know. I just know that I have used screw clamps for 40+ years with no problem.

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post #9 of 21 Old Jun 7th, 2015, 4:40 pm
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Re: Crank but no start

+1 On the in tank fuel line split.

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post #10 of 21 Old Jun 7th, 2015, 8:20 pm Thread Starter
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Ended up pulling out the tank and the hose to the filter was popped off. eight hours later everything is back together bikes running great .

Sometimes you're just better off doing it yourself didn't really want to go to the hassle of leaving my bike at the BMW dealership for another week
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post #11 of 21 Old Jun 9th, 2015, 11:00 am Thread Starter
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You can really just remove the tip over bar and slip the pump and filter out of an LT?

It looks pretty tight under. If I have to do it again, I will give it a try, I would love to see a pic or vid of it, if anyone has a link.

Headed over to the dealer to see if I can get some consideration on it, I need to buy a 150 dollar chrome moulding rocker panel
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post #12 of 21 Old Jun 9th, 2015, 11:35 am
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Re: Crank but no start

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Originally Posted by martin18152 View Post
You can really just remove the tip over bar and slip the pump and filter out of an LT?

It looks pretty tight under. If I have to do it again, I will give it a try, I would love to see a pic or vid of it, if anyone has a link.
I agree, I never would have thought you could get the pump assembly out without at least pulling the tank up off the rear mounting screws and if you have gone that far, why not just pull it. Just did my filter so in 50K, I may give that a shot.

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post #13 of 21 Old Jun 9th, 2015, 11:46 am
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Re: Crank but no start

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I agree, I never would have thought you could get the pump assembly out without at least pulling the tank up off the rear mounting screws and if you have gone that far, why not just pull it. Just did my filter so in 50K, I may give that a shot.
I did it last summer and it was surprisingly easy once the tip over frame was removed. Keep in mind that the fuel assembly isn't a solid cylinder that is the size of the hole in the tank and needs to come out straight down. Once the bottom drops free of the tank, it can be moved away from the bike and maneuvered out fairly easily as long as you are careful.
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post #14 of 21 Old Jun 9th, 2015, 1:22 pm Thread Starter
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Come to think of it, the pump was fairly thin, then it hoses and filter after that, the filter is probably harder than the pump.

I used a ring compressor to unscrew the cap with the tank out, with it in , might have to have a sort of strap wrench.
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post #15 of 21 Old Jun 9th, 2015, 1:28 pm
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Re: Crank but no start

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Come to think of it, the pump was fairly thin, then it hoses and filter after that, the filter is probably harder than the pump.

I used a ring compressor to unscrew the cap with the tank out, with it in , might have to have a sort of strap wrench.
I use a small rubber strap wrench. The ring doesn't need to be put on super tight. Mine came from the factory much tighter than it needs to be which seems to be a common theme with many BMW fasteners.
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post #16 of 21 Old Jun 10th, 2015, 12:21 pm
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Re: Crank but no start

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I use a small rubber strap wrench. The ring doesn't need to be put on super tight. Mine came from the factory much tighter than it needs to be which seems to be a common theme with many BMW fasteners.
I got the strap wrench from Autozone and was surprised that I needed the largest one they had. Bought the next one down ( without measuring with other than my calibrated eyeball) and had to take it back and get the larger one. If the rubber seal is soft and in good shape, it shouldn't take that much to get it to seal. If it is harder, it might take just a bit more. I read a buliten on BMW increasing the torque on the tank nut for leaking. Just keep in mind that it is plastic

Gordon
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post #17 of 21 Old Jun 10th, 2015, 12:30 pm
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Re: Crank but no start

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I got the strap wrench from Autozone and was surprised that I needed the largest one they had. Bought the next one down ( without measuring with other than my calibrated eyeball) and had to take it back and get the larger one. If the rubber seal is soft and in good shape, it shouldn't take that much to get it to seal. If it is harder, it might take just a bit more. I read a buliten on BMW increasing the torque on the tank nut for leaking. Just keep in mind that it is plastic
I bought a two wrench set from Autozone and use the smallest one.

Most leaks are caused by a previous over tightening.

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post #18 of 21 Old Jun 10th, 2015, 1:52 pm
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Re: Crank but no start

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I bought a two wrench set from Autozone and use the smallest one.

Most leaks are caused by a previous over tightening.
My tank nut is almost 5 inches across. It needed a pretty big filter band wrench to fit it. Are they different sizes on different years I wonder?

Gordon
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post #19 of 21 Old Jun 10th, 2015, 2:56 pm
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Re: Crank but no start

Big for a filter wrench.
Small for a strap wrench.

Doug B.
2000 LT purchased July 2013
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post #20 of 21 Old Jun 10th, 2015, 3:04 pm
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Re: Crank but no start

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Big for a filter wrench.
Small for a strap wrench.
Ahh, I was going after what was used in one of the Illinois instructional videos.

Size is relative

Gordon
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1998 R1100RT Never should have sold it
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post #21 of 21 Old Jun 11th, 2015, 8:00 am Thread Starter
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Re: Crank but no start

Harbor Freight had a pack of two strap wrenches, small and large. I havent tried either yet, hoping I don't have to, but they are adjustable, and should work. I'm going to carry it with me along with a few tools, so if a hose breaks or comes lose I can fix it on the road.

The symptons up to the final disconnect, which could also be a sign of a cracking hose, are : sudden engine stops at Idle, and the cruse control surging at steady state. At least these symptoms went away once the hose was reconnected.
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