"Bucket" (cam follower) request - BMW Luxury Touring Community
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post #1 of 10 Old Jan 9th, 2015, 2:20 pm Thread Starter
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"Bucket" (cam follower) request

Calling all buckets....

Before I place an order, I thought I'd check with you guys.

I need four 0.305mm cam followers (buckets)
and one 0.300mm bucket.

I have a bucket load (punny huh?) of 0.295 and 0.290 buckets to trade. Also a couple of extra 0.285mm and 0.280mm buckets.

Anybody got some of those 0.300 and 0.305mm ones they'd like to swap?

Thanks

Last edited by CharlieVT; Jan 9th, 2015 at 3:27 pm.
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post #2 of 10 Old Jan 9th, 2015, 9:09 pm
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Re: "Bucket" (cam follower) request

Strange that after grinding the exhaust valves you would need THICKER buckets! I would have thought you would be needing thinner ones, unless they ground the ends of the stems and took too much off. What do you think the reason for this is?

I don't want to achieve immortality through my work...I want to achieve it through not dying.

David Shealey
Dandridge, TN
EX: '01 Black LT, BAT BYKE (Totaled at 110,000 miles)
IBA SS, BB, BBG, 10/10ths.
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post #3 of 10 Old Jan 9th, 2015, 10:41 pm
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Re: "Bucket" (cam follower) request

Quote:
Originally Posted by CharlieVT View Post
Calling all buckets....

Before I place an order, I thought I'd check with you guys.

I need four 0.305mm cam followers (buckets)
and one 0.300mm bucket.

I have a bucket load (punny huh?) of 0.295 and 0.290 buckets to trade. Also a couple of extra 0.285mm and 0.280mm buckets.

Anybody got some of those 0.300 and 0.305mm ones they'd like to swap?

Thanks
The South central stash has a single 3.05 and three 3.00 followers
3.00's would make the valves slightly loose, better than tight.
There may be 1 or 2 more in there,will have to look closer.
Trade for whatever you want to.

Let me know.

Dan M
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post #4 of 10 Old Jan 10th, 2015, 8:17 am Thread Starter
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Re: "Bucket" (cam follower) request

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Originally Posted by dshealey View Post
Strange that after grinding the exhaust valves you would need THICKER buckets! I would have thought you would be needing thinner ones, unless they ground the ends of the stems and took too much off. What do you think the reason for this is?
Hi Dave,

Short version: I cut the stems too short.

Old carpenter's joke: "I don't understand, I've cut it off three times already, and it's still too short!"

Here's the long version:
When you gave me the suggestion to have the stems shortened, the head had already been dropped off at AJ Cycle (AJ's uses a local machine that they have a long time relationship with.) I could have taken the head directly to the machine shop, but chose to let Alan and David at AJ's deal with the machine shop.

After I got your suggestion, I called Alan at AJ's and suggested the stem shortening approach. Alan said he'd bring it up with the machinist but the stem reduction didn't get done. When I picked up the head Alan told the machinist would trim the stems if I wanted, but I'd have to assemble, measure for the needed reduction and then bring the valves back.

In hindsight, if I had measured before I dropped off the it would have been easier, or if I had talked directly with the machinist it might have gotten done.

So after getting the head back I assembled the head and made measurements. I have a bunch of spare 0.290 and 0.295mm buckets from earlier adjustments. After the valve job I needed 5 or so in the 0.270 -0.275mm range. (Before the original disassembly of the head the gaps were at the tight side of the specs, and there were mostly 0.280-0.285mm buckets in there. So I'd say that the valve grind caused a decrease in the clearance in the range of about 0.01mm)

My idea was to grind the stems so I could use the 0.290-0.295mm buckets, and have my others for later when things tightened up a bit.

Measurements and calculations in hand I took my valves to my friend Stanley at Lynde Motorsports. (I would have had Stanley do my valves in the first place but his machines are pretty old and he didn't have a collet small enough for the BMW stems.) (Stanley has been a great help to over the years during my Airhead rebuilding period. Not many guys will invite you into their shop and turn you loose with their machines. He's a nice guy).

I used Stanley's valve grinder myself to shorten the stems after he gave me a brief "how-to" demo. Not sure what happened, but I suspect operator error. When I was zeroing the valve stem I wasn't all that careful about where I bottomed the valve stem on the grinding wheel. I should have been careful to use the very outer edge of the grinding wheel where the actual cut was being made. A slight concavity of the grind stone may have given me my error.

End result, I over shortened some of the stems by about 0.01mm.
So now instead of needing thinner buckets, I need thicker buckets.
Live and learn.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5auwi8AJnoc
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post #5 of 10 Old Jan 10th, 2015, 8:53 am
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Re: "Bucket" (cam follower) request

Sure glad I never did anything like that. Yeah, right.
As the old saying goes, experience is what you have right after you needed it!

Quote:
Originally Posted by CharlieVT View Post
Hi Dave,

Short version: I cut the stems too short.

Old carpenter's joke: "I don't understand, I've cut it off three times already, and it's still too short!"

Here's the long version:
When you gave me the suggestion to have the stems shortened, the head had already been dropped off at AJ Cycle (AJ's uses a local machine that they have a long time relationship with.) I could have taken the head directly to the machine shop, but chose to let Alan and David at AJ's deal with the machine shop.

After I got your suggestion, I called Alan at AJ's and suggested the stem shortening approach. Alan said he'd bring it up with the machinist but the stem reduction didn't get done. When I picked up the head Alan told the machinist would trim the stems if I wanted, but I'd have to assemble, measure for the needed reduction and then bring the valves back.

In hindsight, if I had measured before I dropped off the it would have been easier, or if I had talked directly with the machinist it might have gotten done.

So after getting the head back I assembled the head and made measurements. I have a bunch of spare 0.290 and 0.295mm buckets from earlier adjustments. After the valve job I needed 5 or so in the 0.270 -0.275mm range. (Before the original disassembly of the head the gaps were at the tight side of the specs, and there were mostly 0.280-0.285mm buckets in there. So I'd say that the valve grind caused a decrease in the clearance in the range of about 0.01mm)

My idea was to grind the stems so I could use the 0.290-0.295mm buckets, and have my others for later when things tightened up a bit.

Measurements and calculations in hand I took my valves to my friend Stanley at Lynde Motorsports. (I would have had Stanley do my valves in the first place but his machines are pretty old and he didn't have a collet small enough for the BMW stems.) (Stanley has been a great help to over the years during my Airhead rebuilding period. Not many guys will invite you into their shop and turn you loose with their machines. He's a nice guy).

I used Stanley's valve grinder myself to shorten the stems after he gave me a brief "how-to" demo. Not sure what happened, but I suspect operator error. When I was zeroing the valve stem I wasn't all that careful about where I bottomed the valve stem on the grinding wheel. I should have been careful to use the very outer edge of the grinding wheel where the actual cut was being made. A slight concavity of the grind stone may have given me my error.

End result, I over shortened some of the stems by about 0.01mm.
So now instead of needing thinner buckets, I need thicker buckets.
Live and learn.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5auwi8AJnoc

I don't want to achieve immortality through my work...I want to achieve it through not dying.

David Shealey
Dandridge, TN
EX: '01 Black LT, BAT BYKE (Totaled at 110,000 miles)
IBA SS, BB, BBG, 10/10ths.
No bike now, but maybe in the future.
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post #6 of 10 Old Jan 11th, 2015, 3:37 pm
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Re: "Bucket" (cam follower) request

Quote:
Originally Posted by CharlieVT View Post
Calling all buckets....

Before I place an order, I thought I'd check with you guys.

I need four 0.305mm cam followers (buckets)
and one 0.300mm bucket.

I have a bucket load (punny huh?) of 0.295 and 0.290 buckets to trade. Also a couple of extra 0.285mm and 0.280mm buckets.

Anybody got some of those 0.300 and 0.305mm ones they'd like to swap?

Thanks
I have a 305 laying around. PM me an address and it's yours.

John Baker

2005 BMW K1200LT
1979 Suzuki GS1000E
1978 Honda CB350
1975 Suzuki GT380
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post #7 of 10 Old Jan 11th, 2015, 5:20 pm Thread Starter
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Re: "Bucket" (cam follower) request

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Originally Posted by johnbaker15 View Post
I have a 305 laying around. PM me an address and it's yours.
PM sent, many thanks.
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post #8 of 10 Old Jan 11th, 2015, 9:44 pm
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Re: "Bucket" (cam follower) request

Look on the bright side Curtis. You have plenty of thinner ones available for after the break-in. That, and you didn't screw up so bad that you ruined the valves. That's a pretty good day around my house.


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post #9 of 10 Old Jan 12th, 2015, 7:23 am Thread Starter
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Re: "Bucket" (cam follower) request

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Originally Posted by deanwoolsey View Post
Look on the bright side Curtis. You have plenty of thinner ones available for after the break-in. That, and you didn't screw up so bad that you ruined the valves. That's a pretty good day around my house.
Yeah! The cup's half full!

I scared myself for a few hours when I had messed up my calculations. (created a spreadsheet formula where I was subtracting instead of adding, or something like that.)
I had reached the conclusion that I had ground the valve stems way too much and needed buckets thicker than are available! Wide spread depression for a few hours.

Then I went through all my measurements again and realized I was gonna be okay.
Got the calculations right the first time using the stubby pencil approach, then got it wrong the double check with the spreadsheet calculations (panic and depression), and then corrected that error.

Hey, its a hobby!

A couple of kind folks have offered up some buckets (they'll get since thanks, thinner buckets, and Pure Vermont Maple Syrup in exchange.)

"I thought I made a mistake once, but I was wrong about that."
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Last edited by CharlieVT; Jan 12th, 2015 at 7:35 am.
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post #10 of 10 Old Jan 14th, 2015, 9:07 pm
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Re: "Bucket" (cam follower) request

Experience is directly proportional to your screw ups.

Or something like that.

I'm plenty experienced in a lot of things.

B D R
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