Rear end failier - bearing had done less that 1k!! - BMW Luxury Touring Community
 
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post #1 of 23 Old Jun 20th, 2006, 5:06 am Thread Starter
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Rear end failier - bearing had done less that 1k!!

Conformed today that the rear end 'grinding' noise was a rear end failier.
BMW are doing the job for free. I just hope they put the right bearing in this time.
They say that there is only one part number though

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post #2 of 23 Old Jun 20th, 2006, 6:31 am
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Is your dealer checking the bearing preload? or just replacing the bearing and hoping it works past warranty?

Just curious

Roy

Roy Gregersen

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post #3 of 23 Old Jun 20th, 2006, 7:13 am Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbear
Is your dealer checking the bearing preload? or just replacing the bearing and hoping it works past warranty?

Just curious

Roy
Pass - what is bearing preload?

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post #4 of 23 Old Jun 20th, 2006, 7:15 am
 
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Question

"K1200LT '99 - 60k and finally getting sorted"
- So I guess it's officially "sorted"?!
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post #5 of 23 Old Jun 20th, 2006, 8:27 am
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c00k1e
Pass - what is bearing preload?
Preload is the amount of "pressure" placed on a bearing when it is installed. For example, if you were putting a bearing into a wheel on a car, you might tighten the nut that sits in front of the bearing until you reach a certain amount of torque (maybe 50 lbs/ft) and then you would back off the nut 1/4 turn loose. (Something that the manufacture would tell you).

So the dealer should set that bearing in place (some manufacturer spec) and not just "put it in".

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post #6 of 23 Old Jun 20th, 2006, 8:43 am Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by messenger13
"K1200LT '99 - 60k and finally getting sorted"
- So I guess it's officially "sorted"?!
Yep - changing it now!!

"Whenever you find you are on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect" Mark Twain


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post #7 of 23 Old Jun 20th, 2006, 9:01 am
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Bearing preload continued

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mopos
Preload is the amount of "pressure" placed on a bearing when it is installed. For example, if you were putting a bearing into a wheel on a car, you might tighten the nut that sits in front of the bearing until you reach a certain amount of torque (maybe 50 lbs/ft) and then you would back off the nut 1/4 turn loose. (Something that the manufacture would tell you).

So the dealer should set that bearing in place (some manufacturer spec) and not just "put it in".

According to the service manual preload is supposed to be .05 - .1mm or .002-.004". This is a pain to check according to our local service tech but it should be done especially with repeated failures. To much or to little preload can cause premature bearing failures.

The preload on the final drive is to keep the tapered roller bearing on the other end of the output shaft in place. Tapered bearings require some preload to operate properly.

Roy

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post #8 of 23 Old Jun 20th, 2006, 10:42 am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c00k1e
Conformed today that the rear end 'grinding' noise was a rear end failier.
BMW are doing the job for free. I just hope they put the right bearing in this time.
They say that there is only one part number though
Try to see the bearing yourself, if it is made by SKF instead of FAG, and has 17 balls instead of 19, that is the correct bearing.

Also, since you have had a premature failure, I would insist that they follow the pre-load checking procedure in the service manual, which requires special tools that the dealer may or may not have. If they cannot rebuild it correctly, then you should insist that they just replace the final drive assembly with a factory new one.

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post #9 of 23 Old Jun 20th, 2006, 12:30 pm
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Sorry in Advance

Sorry...

I learn so MUCH from David,
But when you talk about Fags with 17balls...I have chuckle!!!

Bill

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post #10 of 23 Old Jun 20th, 2006, 12:30 pm
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Cool

The 17 ball bearing does not exist any more according to Chicago BMW. They told me last week that all the bearings with the new number (for the 17 ball) for the last couple months has been shipped from the Father-land with the new improved 19 ball. Go figure.
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post #11 of 23 Old Jun 23rd, 2006, 3:35 am Thread Starter
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Just spoke to my local dealer.
Good news - Say they will swop out all damaged parts, no cost and they do check bearing preload
Bad news - They havnt started the fix yet. They phoned fatherland who got shirty about 17 balls "you vil get vot you are given" aparently.

The problem is - I dont know if I will ever feel safe on this bike again!!

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post #12 of 23 Old Jun 23rd, 2006, 7:48 am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pieceofficer
Sorry...

I learn so MUCH from David,
But when you talk about Fags with 17balls...I have chuckle!!!
The last 'guy' must be Lance Armstrong....zowie!


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post #13 of 23 Old Jun 23rd, 2006, 9:01 pm
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preloaded balls

i just want to thank you guys for cracking me up here on a rainy friday night....

cant decide if it was the germanic accent post or just checking the balls

Kip
99 LT
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post #14 of 23 Old Jun 27th, 2006, 4:30 am Thread Starter
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Unhappy

Dealer has 'finished' the bike (pending test ride). They say NO 17 balls are available anymore. None in stock in the UK and Germany not playing ball.
They confirmed that the bearing failed that they fitted and say that it did no other damage, however they have had to "shimmed up" something to make it all work.

They also said that they AND UK BMW have never heard of a rear end failier! Simple to check I guess, 'cos they have now and should anyone call them, the answer should now be - "we have heard of one"

I swear that this thing is going to go pearshaped when I use it next, I just hope I am totally wrong. Touring the Alps now seems something I am going to worry through and not enjoy.

Anyone got any ideas for me?

"Whenever you find you are on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect" Mark Twain


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post #15 of 23 Old Jun 27th, 2006, 8:28 am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by captainasty
The 17 ball bearing does not exist any more according to Chicago BMW. They told me last week that all the bearings with the new number (for the 17 ball) for the last couple months has been shipped from the Father-land with the new improved 19 ball. Go figure.
Wonder just how many they have shipped in either the 17 or 19 ball configuration? That number would be a really interesting bit of information! If there have not been many failures, then there would be very few sales of that replacement part!

Lee Nowell
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post #16 of 23 Old Jun 27th, 2006, 9:36 am
 
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Its too bad one couldnt cross-reference a tapered roller bearing to use in place of the OEM ball bearing unit. Much higher radial/axial load capacity and less sensitive to grit getting in the bearing race/groove and chewing things up.
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post #17 of 23 Old Jun 27th, 2006, 10:45 am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sofitel505
Its too bad one couldnt cross-reference a tapered roller bearing to use in place of the OEM ball bearing unit. Much higher radial/axial load capacity and less sensitive to grit getting in the bearing race/groove and chewing things up.
That cannot be done in the present housing. The entire housing assembly would have to be completely redesigned, along with the crown gear itself. Opposed tapered roller bearings can take huge loads, but require very stiff and robust housings for bearings that large. There is a small opposing tapered roller opposing the large ball bearing now, but it is only there to maintain alignment of the pinion/crown bearing engagement, not to carry any appreciable load. Opposing tapered rollers create quite a bit of axial load, and the housing has to be able to handle that, the relatively light aluminum housing as it exists could not do it reliably.

The newer BMW final drives are not having bearing failures that we know of, and they are very similar in design, using a large ball bearing for the main axle support. There were initial failures on the new final drives after introduction, but the failure was totally different in nature, not related to the ball bearing.

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post #18 of 23 Old Jun 27th, 2006, 1:30 pm
 
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A-haa. I knew it couldnt be that easy or those crafty Krauts would have already thunk of it.
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post #19 of 23 Old Jun 27th, 2006, 1:50 pm
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Talking

I'm not sure of how many 17 ballers there are but I have 2 sets. I bought them about 1.5-2 years ago for rear end projects.
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post #20 of 23 Old Jun 27th, 2006, 11:04 pm
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Boy, I am really confused now. Last week had mine repalce with what I thought to be a new bearing....but it had 19 balls......could it be I got a new 19 ball bearing?

O. K. Upchurch III
Irvine, California

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post #21 of 23 Old Jun 28th, 2006, 5:49 am Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OKUIII
Boy, I am really confused now. Last week had mine repalce with what I thought to be a new bearing....but it had 19 balls......could it be I got a new 19 ball bearing?
Well, thats what they just put in mine less than 1k ago - and again this week, 'cos the last one failed.
I just hope they have fitted it better this time

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post #22 of 23 Old Jun 29th, 2006, 3:27 am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c00k1e
They also said that they AND UK BMW have never heard of a rear end failier!
Bull. BMW UK paid for my rear end failure, even though it was repaired in Germany (bike bought in Wales). I hate that kind of double talk BS.

Ken
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post #23 of 23 Old Jun 29th, 2006, 5:56 am Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meese
Bull. BMW UK paid for my rear end failure, even though it was repaired in Germany (bike bought in Wales). I hate that kind of double talk BS.
This is the problem, when your machanic lies to you over petty things, how much confidence can you have in him?
Obviously I want them to sort out the problem that they caused, but what if the bike has the same problem 2up @ 100mph?
I have to have confidence in this bike - I ride the alps later in the year!

"Whenever you find you are on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect" Mark Twain


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