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post #1 of 29 Old Jul 22nd, 2006, 9:05 pm Thread Starter
 
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K1200GT or Ducati ST3

I have a K1200LT and am considering adding a sport touring bike to the stable. Does anyone have any information regarding a comparison of the Ducati ST3 and the BMW?
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post #2 of 29 Old Jul 22nd, 2006, 9:11 pm
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Duc

My buddy owned a DUC. Service intervals are closer together, parts expensive, valve adjustments more frequent, ride less comfortable and adjustable, louder, etc....

The thing drove like a rocket with great power and handling!

Jim Andrews
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post #3 of 29 Old Jul 22nd, 2006, 9:25 pm
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A recent issue of Rider magazine reviewed (I THINK) the ST3, the BMW ST, Honda Interceptor and Triumph something. Sorry to be a little vague... I'm on the road and don't have the magazine with me. At least it will give you their thoughts on the ST3.

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post #4 of 29 Old Jul 22nd, 2006, 9:29 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JK75RT
My buddy owned a DUC. Service intervals are closer together, parts expensive, valve adjustments more frequent, ride less comfortable and adjustable, louder, etc....

The thing drove like a rocket with great power and handling!
first of all, the cost of owning either bike is about the same..... BOTH RIDICULOUSLY OVERPRICED
but...
they are both excellent, but exceedingly different in every aspect
it's like comparing apples to oranges
gutteral twin vs. smooth I-4
only YOU can decide which is for you
go ride both and get what's right for you.... they are both excellent machine

Greg Savel
Clearwater, FL USA

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live like you mean it...
but take your family and friends along for the "ride"
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post #5 of 29 Old Jul 31st, 2006, 10:37 am
 
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What about the illustrious FJR1300?!

OK...OK...I'm sorry, but I just HAD to.

Wow! You definitely picked two awesome bikes to compare, and I couldn't fault you for picking the ST3. After all...them Ducs are mighty sexy!

Some food for thought... When I owned and rode my Ninja quite a bit, the one thing that always bothered me was how different all the controls were going from the LT to the Ninja, or vice versa. You would have the same issue with the LT and the ST3. If you owned the LT and the GT, riding each bike would require NO learning curve. As small of a factor as this may seem, I hated the thought that in a split-second emergency situation, I wouldn't be able to find the horn or whatever fast enough. Just something to think about. Also, I think the GT is going to be cheaper to service, believe it or not.

Talk to ScottyDawg. He's the local Duc expert around here.
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post #6 of 29 Old Jul 31st, 2006, 7:39 pm
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Another option

If you're looking for something different from your LT I'd go with the Ducati. The GT is too close to the LT; for me it would have to be either/or, not both.
For another option, I'd look at a Hayabusa. Throw on a set of soft bags, a tailpack and tankbag and you've got the ultimate sport tourer. And it's the best bargain in motorcycles of all time - new or used.

Bruce Hodges
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post #7 of 29 Old Jul 31st, 2006, 8:07 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bruce2000ltc
If you're looking for something different from your LT I'd go with the Ducati. The GT is too close to the LT; for me it would have to be either/or, not both.

Bruce,

I really don't get that statement. The GT has less in common with the LT than any other BMW. I'd almost say it's closter to the ST3 or ST4 than the LT from a performance perspective. That's almost like saying the K1200S or K1200R is too close to the K1200RS.


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post #8 of 29 Old Jul 31st, 2006, 8:26 pm
 
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Exclamation Me too...

Quote:
Originally Posted by bruce2000ltc
If you're looking for something different from your LT I'd go with the Ducati. The GT is too close to the LT; for me it would have to be either/or, not both.
For another option, I'd look at a Hayabusa. Throw on a set of soft bags, a tailpack and tankbag and you've got the ultimate sport tourer. And it's the best bargain in motorcycles of all time - new or used.
I have to second the disagreement here. I currently own an LT and GT and they couldn't be more different other than their controls configuration. Their ergos are different. Completely different engine. Different powerband. WAY different suspension. Different gauges. And more than 200# lighter, makes for a HUGE difference.

As for a Hayabusa...wow! Did that come flying in from left field, or what? I think the Hayabusa makes for a pretty lame sport-tourer. Heck! I'd pick a Honda VFR over a Hayabusa . . . if it's purely a cheap sport-tourer one is looking for. Hayabusas are great in a straight line, but they suck in the twisties. My '98 ZX-11 at up a Hayabusa on the track. As did a VFR. And both bikes were "supposed" to be much slower. Not that day. That Hayabusa was a pig in the turns. I'll run any Hayabusa with my new GT, as long as there are curves involved.
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post #9 of 29 Old Jul 31st, 2006, 9:44 pm
 
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Stay away from the Kawasaki and Suzuki offerings. If you need a great second bike for tearing around, take real close look at the Honda VFR. Real sweet motor, nice ergos, and if you need nice bike for short to medium length touring it will work nicely.

In the hands of a capable rider it will eat virtually every litre bike, including the aforementioned Ninja, which are historically bad in the switchbacks trying to keep up to the 600-800cc class.
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post #10 of 29 Old Jul 31st, 2006, 10:43 pm
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GregK100rs
In the hands of a capable rider it will eat virtually every litre bike, including the aforementioned Ninja, which are historically bad in the switchbacks trying to keep up to the 600-800cc class.
Oh sure...nothing compares to those K100RSes!

Come to CCR, so we can ride. Show me what a stud you really are. (Your last name isn't 'Rossi' is it?!)
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post #11 of 29 Old Jul 31st, 2006, 10:59 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by messenger13
Oh sure...nothing compares to those K100RSes!

Come to CCR, so we can ride. Show me what a stud you really are. (Your last name isn't 'Rossi' is it?!)

probabkly not, but i bet yours is
Joe Messenger Rossi!

<g>

Tom

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post #12 of 29 Old Jul 31st, 2006, 10:59 pm
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by messenger13
I have to second the disagreement here. I currently own an LT and GT and they couldn't be more different other than their controls configuration. Their ergos are different. Completely different engine. Different powerband. WAY different suspension. Different gauges. And more than 200# lighter, makes for a HUGE difference.

As for a Hayabusa...wow! Did that come flying in from left field, or what? I think the Hayabusa makes for a pretty lame sport-tourer. Heck! I'd pick a Honda VFR over a Hayabusa . . . if it's purely a cheap sport-tourer one is looking for. Hayabusas are great in a straight line, but they suck in the twisties. My '98 ZX-11 at up a Hayabusa on the track. As did a VFR. And both bikes were "supposed" to be much slower. Not that day. That Hayabusa was a pig in the turns. I'll run any Hayabusa with my new GT, as long as there are curves involved.
Joe, Make sure you let him know you want to race,
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post #13 of 29 Old Aug 1st, 2006, 6:03 am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by messenger13
What about the illustrious FJR1300?!

OK...OK...I'm sorry, but I just HAD to.

Wow! You definitely picked two awesome bikes to compare, and I couldn't fault you for picking the ST3. After all...them Ducs are mighty sexy!

Some food for thought... When I owned and rode my Ninja quite a bit, the one thing that always bothered me was how different all the controls were going from the LT to the Ninja, or vice versa. You would have the same issue with the LT and the ST3. If you owned the LT and the GT, riding each bike would require NO learning curve. As small of a factor as this may seem, I hated the thought that in a split-second emergency situation, I wouldn't be able to find the horn or whatever fast enough. Just something to think about. Also, I think the GT is going to be cheaper to service, believe it or not.

Talk to ScottyDawg. He's the local Duc expert around here.
This is one of the reasons I bought an R1150RT as a second bike. Once I got used to the BMW control layout, nothing else was as comfortable or natural to use. Best of luck on your decision!

'07 - R1200RT Slippery Silver

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'03 R1150RT - MAXed out
'03 K1200LTC - Gone to the Darko side
'00 Kawasaki Concours - Buzz
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post #14 of 29 Old Aug 1st, 2006, 8:23 am
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Confession

Okay, I have to admit that part of my post was just trying to get a rise out of you GT owners.
I was into sport touring for 18 years before I bought my first LT in '02. One of the things I like about the LT is that performs more like a sport tourer than the competition - I still have a bike that loves a twisty back road and the comfort my wife deserves.
I'm not surprised when I read posts where LT owners are considering selling their LT and buying a GT. With BMW's the line between sport touring and touring is pretty thin. The GT is a fantastic sport tourer but also does a decent job as a tourer and the LT is a great touring bike that does a decent job as a sport tourer. While vastly different, they are too close in their intended riding applications for me to have both of them in my garage.
Joe's combination of an LT and a ZX-11 makes more sense to me.

Bruce Hodges
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post #15 of 29 Old Aug 1st, 2006, 1:20 pm
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Check out a Triumph Sprint ST. I own a '99, bought it new. Excellent bike, very similar to a VFR, but with better sounding engine.
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post #16 of 29 Old Aug 1st, 2006, 2:31 pm
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Cool GT VS Ducati

Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyS
I have a K1200LT and am considering adding a sport touring bike to the stable. Does anyone have any information regarding a comparison of the Ducati ST3 and the BMW?
After 1,500 miles on the GT, I recommend you ride it. I privately answered Tony in more detail. Key point, SO prefers GT ride quality and fit for her hips. We have now completed two trips on the GT that she would never have considered taking on the LT. We also love being able to take the bags into the hotel or the home where we are staying. The next weekend we rode from Cleveland to Niagara Falls Canada and home.

Rob Nelson

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post #17 of 29 Old Aug 2nd, 2006, 7:15 pm
 
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I am a 2 bike owner. I am going to replace my '94 R1100 with either an
FJR 1300 or K1200GT. I haven't decided which. I want a high performance sport tourer which I can comfortably spend a full day on.

My ST3s is all round the best bike I have ever owned. Engine, suspension (I had that rebuilt to my specs), brakes, etc. Best handling machine I have ever ridden. But it is basically a sport bike with a slightly relaxed riding position. Much less a tourer. It is great in the Santa Cruz Mountains of CA where I ride, but not great for an extended trip.
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post #18 of 29 Old Aug 3rd, 2006, 11:36 am
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by messenger13
Oh sure...nothing compares to those K100RSes!

Come to CCR, so we can ride. Show me what a stud you really are. (Your last name isn't 'Rossi' is it?!)
I've got a better idea. Why don't you come to Shannonville Raceway, here in Ontario. It's a very easy way to safely illustrate who's all talk to who's not.

There's even a nice set of racing leathers I could set aside for you. The name on the shoulders would be yours or Rossi, maybe something more home grown, like M. Duhamel.
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post #19 of 29 Old Aug 3rd, 2006, 6:22 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GregK100rs
I've got a better idea. Why don't you come to Shannonville Raceway, here in Ontario. It's a very easy way to safely illustrate who's all talk to who's not.

There's even a nice set of racing leathers I could set aside for you. The name on the shoulders would be yours or Rossi, maybe something more home grown, like M. Duhamel.

and it's on! <g>

Tom

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(the only bmw's in the stable)
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post #20 of 29 Old Aug 3rd, 2006, 8:10 pm
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You can't be serious

[ Hayabusas are great in a straight line, but they suck in the twisties. My '98 ZX-11 at up a Hayabusa on the track. As did a VFR. And both bikes were "supposed" to be much slower. Not that day. That Hayabusa was a pig in the turns. I'll run any Hayabusa with my new GT, as long as there are curves involved. [/QUOTE]

Joe you passed a Busa once and that makes it a pig? I would bet it was a differance in riders. Busa rider may have just bought the bike and was learning how to ride it.
NEWS FLASH R1200GS is worlds best handling motorcycle. I have been going to Deals Gap for years and have passed GSXR's, R1's, ZX10's,etc, many times so that must mean that the GS is superior, huh.
Several magazines compared K1200s, (not the GT) to the Busa and the Busa still was picked ahead of K1200s in handling. Oh wait I remember reading in the FJR vs GT thread that the motorcycle rags are a bunch of idiots because they didn't like, or pick the right bike as a winner. Everybody knows that a bunch of people on a BMW forum that have probably never even rode a FJR or Busa will give you straight answer as to which bike is the best.
I owned a K1200s for awhile and the GS works better in the tight stuff(deals gap stuff) but the Ks works better in the sweepers and more open stuff. The GS works great in the sweepers but will lose ground on the straightaways. All that means is you bought a bike with more horsepower. A good rider will still outrun a rider of lesser skill who has more horsepower, unless the road has a lot of long straightaways.
Joe I go on record and say that a well ridden Busa on the Skyway(your favorite road) will suck the headlights out of your GT. Remember the Busa weighs less and has 30 MORE horsepower than your GT. Hope the guys on the Busa site don't get wind of this or CCR might be overrun with Suzuki's
looking for some butt to kick.

Paul Francis
Taswell Indiana


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2008 Can Am Spyder
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post #21 of 29 Old Aug 3rd, 2006, 10:21 pm
 
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It very hard for us BMW owners to say anything negative about our bikes when compared to others, especially the Jap stuff.

I would put any skilled rider on a Honda CBRR600 against any average rider on anything else regardless of HP, CC's, or Brand in any race. Any race the requires some curves, sweepers, and switchbacks. Most average riders don't know how to select a line, where the peak or optimal power is in the rev range while decellerating, where the rpms should be while they exist the apex to use the power. And one of the best areas to dust off an average rider isn't in the accelleration, it's always under braking. These guys always break way to early, losing valuable momentum, on the wrong line.

Actually, I could take any skilled rider and mount him on a nice sporty Beemer, and he would dust the average Joe Smuck on his Busa, Ninja or FZ anytime. Which reminds me of a race I withnessed between a K1 and a GSXR. The skill guy won the race, he was on the K1, the Gixxer rider was a bike riding rookie of only 2 years on the road. Switch bikes, and a different winner.
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post #22 of 29 Old Aug 3rd, 2006, 10:38 pm
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Unhappy It's the rider, man!

Quote:
Originally Posted by GregK100rs
The skill guy won the race, he was on the K1, the Gixxer rider was a bike riding rookie of only 2 years on the road. Switch bikes, and a different winner.
I hate to admit it, but once in the foothills of Kentucky, I was blown off by a hippie on an older Sportster! Yikes! Please don't let that get out! He was local, used to the roads, and rode-it-like-he-stole-it! I like to think I'm pretty swuft in the curves, but not that day! I had to stop and look at my fairing to see if there were any tire marks on it from whence he overtook me in a sharpie! Talk about "bump and grind!"

Sometimes it's the rider!
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post #23 of 29 Old Aug 4th, 2006, 3:57 am
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GregK100rs
I've got a better idea. Why don't you come to Shannonville Raceway, here in Ontario. It's a very easy way to safely illustrate who's all talk to who's not.

There's even a nice set of racing leathers I could set aside for you. The name on the shoulders would be yours or Rossi, maybe something more home grown, like M. Duhamel.
If you're talking free track time . . . I'm there! PM me the details.
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post #24 of 29 Old Aug 4th, 2006, 9:55 am
 
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I'm on it 5 days a week. Any day you show up I'll be there. Just let me know. And don't be shy with the throttle hand.
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post #25 of 29 Old Aug 4th, 2006, 10:13 am
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GregK100rs
I'm on it 5 days a week. Any day you show up I'll be there. Just let me know. And don't be shy with the throttle hand.
Sending a PM. You actually sound like somebody I should be getting to know.
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post #26 of 29 Old Aug 4th, 2006, 10:35 am
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wardenross
I hate to admit it, but once in the foothills of Kentucky, I was blown off by a hippie on an older Sportster! Yikes! Please don't let that get out! He was local, used to the roads, and rode-it-like-he-stole-it! I like to think I'm pretty swuft in the curves, but not that day! I had to stop and look at my fairing to see if there were any tire marks on it from whence he overtook me in a sharpie! Talk about "bump and grind!"

Sometimes it's the rider!
I was on the 401 cruising on my CBR1000 and a Harley guy (scumbag biker type) came flying by me lane splitting. I viewed him as prey. I kicked the CBR down three cogs and blipped the throttle and dialed him in within a single km. He was traveling at such a high rate of speed I could see his head being buffeted around from the turbulence from the tombstone windshield he had. As I sat on his flank watching his perilous maneuvers I came to realize he knew what he was doing. Although, he appeared to be a typical scumbag, there was certainly a life time of daredevil riding experience under his belt. Tiring of playing with him, I pulled along side, gave him a look and let him see my tail lights. He actually tried to keep pace with me. Harleys and high speed in traffic donít mix.
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post #27 of 29 Old Aug 4th, 2006, 2:58 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bosshoss
Joe I go on record and say that a well ridden Busa on the Skyway(your favorite road) will suck the headlights out of your GT. Remember the Busa weighs less and has 30 MORE horsepower than your GT. Hope the guys on the Busa site don't get wind of this or CCR might be overrun with Suzuki's
looking for some butt to kick.

funny the few i know with a busa say it sucks as far as handling, compared to thier gsxr and one also has a ZX11 something or another, the one with the gxr and the busa races, he races the gxr? suzuki someshit anyhow on track, the busa is for blowing folks away on saturday night or at the strip, drag strip that is.

Now i'm not say ing the busa is a POS like the owners say as far as handling cause i have never rode a busa, but i have the others.

Tom

'07 GS Adv (mine), '06 GS <(My brides)
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post #28 of 29 Old Aug 4th, 2006, 2:59 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wardenross
I hate to admit it, but once in the foothills of Kentucky, I was blown off by a hippie on an older Sportster! Yikes! Please don't let that get out! He was local, used to the roads, and rode-it-like-he-stole-it! I like to think I'm pretty swuft in the curves, but not that day! I had to stop and look at my fairing to see if there were any tire marks on it from whence he overtook me in a sharpie! Talk about "bump and grind!"

Sometimes it's the rider!

if I can get my bud mark around here when you hot shots are here on yer fancy fast handling bikes, well I'll say ya better be fast and fast everywhere

oh
he rides a FXR

Tom

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post #29 of 29 Old Aug 4th, 2006, 4:22 pm
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[QUOTE=tmgs]funny the few i know with a busa say it sucks as far as handling, compared to thier gsxr


I agree with your friends. The GSXR is 100-125 pounds lighter than the Busa, the GSXR is a road racing bike the Busa isn't. I was comparing the Busa to the GT the Busa may not carve the corners like a GSXR but it is not a pig.
EQUAL riders on a GT and a Busa on a road with high speed sweepers, my money is on the Busa. My post was trying to say that it is the RIDER not the bike. Just because you dusted the guy on the sportbike on your LT or GT or whatever dosen't mean the your bike handles better than a sportbike. Was he even trying? or did he just start riding and was trying to learn.

Paul Francis
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