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post #1 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 2:47 pm Thread Starter
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Smoking bans

Should smoking be banned in private business, stores, restaurants and bars, and parks?
I got into a heated debate (imagine that) with a friend of mine who is a city commissioner of a moderate sized city near here.
Even though I am a right wing conservative Christian, issues like this bring out the Libertarian in me. I say let the business decide!!! City buildings and property, well that’s up the the city, but private business, that’s just going to far.
I say “I know what places allow smoking, if I don’t want to be around smokers I don’t go there.”
Simple. Not really because then he pulls out the health issue. Well if that’s the case then be consistent and ban trans fats, booze, guns, and motorcycles. Also his city has been trying for years to outlaw a titty bar that has been there long before it was annexed into the city!
Also he is a “non smoker” except that he smokes cigars!
Watch out, we will be next! The nanny state is looking out for you!

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post #2 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 3:30 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Hi,

I'm a smoker ( I've been trying unsuccessfully to give up for some time) about to have another bash.

I don't have a problem with banning smoking in public indoor places, in fact, since these rules came in in this country, I've actually reduced the number of ciggies I smoke when out quite a bit, and find the atmosphere in Pubs, Clubs etc much nicer for the lack of smoke.

If you want to light one up, go outside, and if it's pissing down with rain, you have a choice, smoke and get wet, or don't smoke. I don't have a problem going 7 or 8 hours when I sleep, or when on a long haul flight, so a couple of hours when I'm out for an evening has become less of an issue as time goes on.

On the other hand, as the Government is now loosing huge sums of Tax revenue because so mnay are giving up, or have reduced their intake of cancer giving smokes, they have to find additional ways of getting our money in the form of new taxes.

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post #3 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 3:38 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

It's banned in ANY public building here in Austin for a few years now. At first most bars said it would run them out of business. We did loose a few clubs but we would have anyway for 1 reason or another. I know as a NON smoker I enjoy going out more not that I'm party animal

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post #4 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 3:47 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Having had pneumonia 5 times and not being able to be in a smokie ba for 5 seconds without getting very short of breath, the ban here has been a godsend. I can finally go to the local pub and have a drink.
Smoking was banned in the workplace here years ago. I can't imagibe trying to work with someone puffing away next to me!!

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post #5 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 4:40 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by norriscooper
. . . be consistent and ban trans fats, booze, guns, and motorcycles.
They're working on it. Funny thing is, it's usually the right wing conservative christian folks who think they can dictate how everyone else lives.

My wife gets physically ill around smokers. Even if they're not smoking at the moment, the smell permeates their hair, clothes, and everything they own. I don't have quite as strong a reaction in that I can put up with the smell, but why should I have to?

We were living in the UK when the smoking bans started really taking effect over there. Many restaurants had a small, non-smoking section that was separated from the smoking section by nothing more than some imaginary line, meaning there was pretty much no difference. After the ban, we found going out to restaurants and pubs much more enjoyable, as did quite a lot of folks. The pubs also screamed that it would force them out of business, but I think most of them actually got more traffic afterwards.

While I'm not for anyone telling me how to live, I am against someone invading my personal space with their nasty addictions.

Maybe they could set up a few specific smoking-only places? Sort of like the old opium dens. At least you would be recognizing the addiction in that case.

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post #6 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 5:10 pm Thread Starter
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Exclamation Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by meese
Funny thing is, it's usually the right wing conservative christian folks who think they can dictate how everyone else lives.

While I'm not for anyone telling me how to live, I am against someone invading my personal space with their nasty addictions.

Maybe they could set up a few specific smoking-only places? Sort of like the old opium dens. At least you would be recognizing the addiction in that case.
First you shouldn't stereotype us. And secondly it's not your space, it belongs to the restaurant or pub.

They do have smoking sections in the restaurant around here that do allow smoking, they are placed when the vents suck the air away from the nonsmokers.
For the record I do not smoke, never have, never will, I don't even drink. Not for religious reasons, just my choice. I don't like to be around smokers either!

I'm just telling you it's the nose of the ah cough-cough, Camel !

Smoke, smoke, smoke that cigarette
Puff, puff, puff until you smoke yourself to death.
Tell St. Peter at the Golden Gate
That you hate to make him wait,
But you just gotta have another cigarette.

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post #7 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 5:26 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by meese
My wife gets physically ill around smokers. Even if they're not smoking at the moment, the smell permeates their hair, clothes, and everything they own. I don't have quite as strong a reaction in that I can put up with the smell, but why should I have to?
And I get nauseated around people that don't use deodarant (or bathe), don't brush their teeth and have horrible breath and the people that use heavy amounts of perfume/colgone.
I shouldn't have to put up with them and their "nasty habits". Not to mention the people with their cigars, and the ones with chew/dip with their tobacco flecked teeth and sour breath and the ever present "spit cup".
Now, are there any other "offensive" habits or behaviors we want the government to ban, so every little drone will be happy? What about people with gas? Smelly feet?, Dirty fingernails? Greasy hair? Chew with their mouths open? Talk with mouths full of food? Chomping on gum in public? Maybe people that hum to themselves? Line em all up and mow em down, they bother me!
Seems thast people are always complaining about the government getting "too involved" in what they do when it is sayyyy wearing a helmet, seatbelts, etc. BUT! when it is something that they happen to agree with they have NO problem with big brother meddeling in other people's lives/affairs.
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post #8 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 6:58 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by meese
They're working on it. Funny thing is, it's usually the right wing conservative christian folks who think they can dictate how everyone else lives.
Yeah, but it has been my experience that the self-righteous liberals who resort to tactics that restrict freedom of expression and lawsuits to press their agenda more often then the self-righteous conservative christian folks. Both are equally wrong, but it has been my experience that the liberals resort to dictating restriction or forced acceptance of how people should live their lives.


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post #9 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 7:53 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by norriscooper
Well if that’s the case then be consistent and ban trans fats, booze, guns, and motorcycles. [...]Also he is a “non smoker” except that he smokes cigars!
Watch out, we will be next! The nanny state is looking out for you!
This is an attempt at applying a logical fallacy to stir the emotions of the uninformed. You gotta try harder, as this one has been around for a long time .
The real issue is our theocratic government trying to force their values down the peoples throats that is the most scary .
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post #10 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 7:58 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Just to clear up a little misconception of the term "public property". Public property is owned by GovCo. City, County, Federal office buildings, parks, etc. Bars, restaurants, businesses in general that don't stick a gun to your head and MAKE you give them your hard earned money are private property that the public is welcome to visit. If you walk in and don't like the health rating, the smells, whatever, you're free to vote with your feet, not spending a dime if you don't want to. GovCo on the other hand, will always be ready to separate you from your money.

Clear as mud?

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post #11 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 8:43 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

I don't smoke and am allergic to tobacco, I can acquire a sinus infection if I am around it for too long. I personally appreciate the non smoking places. It is going too far, in Louisiana they are trying to ban smoking in your car if you have a minor in the car. Next it will be in your house, bathroom, and outhouse! I think it is going too far. It goes with making choices, I should have the right to choose. When a bar gets smokey I have the choice to leave. I also have the choice to stop you from smoking in my car, house, or office, but not yours!

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post #12 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 8:59 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

YEA...SMOKING BANS!!!

The more restrictive the better!

In fact take it further.
Don't provide health insurance to smokers.
Make the cost of a pack of smokes the same it currently cost to buy a carton...with the extra going to quit smoking programs.
Six weekends of community service, picking up butts, for throwing a cigarette out of your car or snuffing a butt on the ground and leaving it there.

I think, on average, smokers are a pretty selfish and inconsiderate bunch. Most think nothing of blowing smoke into your next breath of air. Most think
nothing of littering the world with their butts. Nothing pisses me off more than people smoking around me. The argument that restraunts and bars are
private is crap...they are public establishments!

...and Meese, lay off the conservative/liberal bullshit you're so quick to sling. This is not a political issue...it's a quality of life issue. And as you've said
many times before... both sides pull the same shit, just on different sides of the issues and with different tactics.


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post #13 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 9:01 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tbird
YEA...SMOKING BANS!!!

The more restrictive the better!

In fact take it further.
Don't provide health insurance to smokers.
Make the cost of a pack of smokes the same it currently cost to buy a carton...with the extra going to quit smoking programs.
Six weekends of community service, picking up butts, for throwing a cigarette out of your car or snuffing a butt on the ground and leaving it there.

I think, on average, smokers are a pretty selfish and inconsiderate bunch. Most think nothing of blowing smoke into your next breath of air. Most think
nothing of littering the world with their butts. Nothing pisses me off more than people smoking around me. The argument that restraunts and bars are
private is crap...they are public establishments!

...and Meese, lay off the conservative/liberal bullshit you're so quick to sling. This is not a political issue...it's a quality of life issue. And as you've said
many times before... both sides pull the same shit, just on different sides of the issues and with different tactics.
Why fuck around? Ban tobacco altogether.


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post #14 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 9:52 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tbird
YEA...SMOKING BANS!!!

The more restrictive the better!

In fact take it further.
Don't provide health insurance to smokers.
Make the cost of a pack of smokes the same it currently cost to buy a carton.
Weeee. This is fun! Lets remove any kind of health care for people that don't wear halmets or seatbelts! After all they are risking thier lives! Now, if you get caught without either of those on, your vehicle insurance will increase by a factor of 10 and the government will get that money too!
And if you drink...sorry no health care for you either..its bad for you. Get caught DUI? Automatic 10 year prision term, no parole! AND no license when you get out..ever!
Lets see, what other controls should we let the government put on our lives? Mandatory blood pressure checks, EKG's, and cholesterol checks! If you fail any of them you are fined and your health care is revoked until you pass!
Ready to draw the line yet? Or just when it affects YOU?

Yeah! Lets just be completely asinine about this whole thing!
On a whole I think people that want to dictate how others should live, have a pole up their collective asses and should shut up and get on with living their OWN lives. When YOU are perfect, THEN and ONLY then do you have ANY room to criticize others and their habits or lack there of.

All of these self-serving, self-righteous dingleberries need to be flogged.
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post #15 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 9:57 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

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Originally Posted by eljeffe
Why fuck around? Ban tobacco altogether.
But I bet he is one of the ones that wants pot legalized and sees absolutely no problem with it.
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post #16 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 10:00 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Yeah, but I'm serious. Instead of all this bullshit fucking around with smoking bans and other stupid ideas, why don't we just ban tobacco altogether? If it's this evil substance, capable of killing so many, why the fuck is it still legal?


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post #17 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 10:13 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

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Originally Posted by eljeffe
If it's this evil substance, capable of killing so many, why the fuck is it still legal?
The same could/has been said about alcohol. Tobacco isn't a "mind altering" drug so it is doubtful it will ever be banned, unless some "mommy" types get in the position to have it banned. Of course, the tobacco industry would frown on that and the people responsible for the ban would probably wake up dead one morning. After all, its annual income of billions of $$ would be gone...not to mention the tens of millions the govt collects in taxes each year.
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post #18 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 10:18 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

I don't see alcohol killing nearly as many people as tobacco. And the money saved by not having people needing treatment from tobacco related illnesses should easily cover any tax revenue generated by the taxes.

I was a smoker for nearly 20 years. I gave it up 3 years ago, and even when I want one, I can't break down and have another one. I don't give a shit whether someone smokes around me, but if we're going to pussyfoot around with bans here and there, we better just shit or get off the pot and ban it completely. It's stupid to claim we're solving some problem with a bandaid fix here or there. Just ban the shit and get it over with.


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post #19 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 10:29 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by eljeffe
I don't see alcohol killing nearly as many people as tobacco.
100,000/year from alcohol vs 400,000 from tobacco...Now, once we ban tobacco, how long before they ban alcohol? Then how long before the ban on, say, fatty foods? Where does it stop? I can tell you..it won't stop. Give an inch and they'll take a mile. Give up one freedom and the next one won't seem so much, and the next one even less.....
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post #20 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 10:35 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by eljeffe
I don't see alcohol killing nearly as many people as tobacco. And the money saved by not having people needing treatment from tobacco related illnesses should easily cover any tax revenue generated by the taxes.

I was a smoker for nearly 20 years. I gave it up 3 years ago, and even when I want one, I can't break down and have another one. I don't give a shit whether someone smokes around me, but if we're going to pussyfoot around with bans here and there, we better just shit or get off the pot and ban it completely. It's stupid to claim we're solving some problem with a bandaid fix here or there. Just ban the shit and get it over with.

I agree and oddly enough have never thought about that as a solution. Norris, those things you mention...trans fats, booze, guns and motorcycles don't affect others when they are being used like smoking does and for you to use that as a basis for the action is ridiculous.

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post #21 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 10:48 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

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Originally Posted by MaverickAR
Norris, those things you mention..., booze, guns and motorcycles don't affect others when they are being used like smoking does and for you to use that as a basis for the action is ridiculous.
Really? Drunk drivers don't affect others? Kids on motorcycles riding like morons don't affect others? I beg to differ.
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post #22 of 114 Old Jul 20th, 2008, 11:25 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Lets see...
Ban the shit great something else they can sell on street corners. I say tax the shit out of it....oh wait they already do. SO lets tax it more !!!

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post #23 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 1:40 am
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by norriscooper
First you shouldn't stereotype us. And secondly it's not your space, it belongs to the restaurant or pub.
I won't if you won't. But jeez, can none of y'all see the smilies?

As for voting with our wallets, I totally agree. But most establishments have found that banning smoking has actually increased their clientele. And whether you believe it's a freedom of choice issues or just don't care, the fact is that the tide has been turning for a long time. Smoking is no longer cool and sexy, now it's just a messy, smelly social stigma.

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post #24 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 4:25 am
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oisin
....The real issue is our theocratic government trying to force their values down the peoples throats that is the most scary .
I think that's what Norris is talking about? Also?
As a libertarian, my panties blow up ANY TIME A/ANOTHER big government nanny law is enacted! Smoking, chewing, strip joint, helmet, fast food, alcohol, drug use, cell phone, etc....I know outlawing "stupid" might be tempting--but....

I just wonder who the f'k is gonna' enforce all this tom foolery? Cause I sure the f'k ain't!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tbird
....The argument that restraunts and bars are private is crap...they are public establishments!
Private property!? There ain't no such stinkin' thing as private property!
Quote:
...and Meese, lay off the conservative/liberal bullshit you're so quick to sling. This is not a political issue...it's a quality of life issue. And as you've said many times before... both sides pull the same shit, just on different sides of the issues and with different tactics.
Yeah, Ken! As long as it's a "quality of life issue," you have no private property rights. Let that be a lesson to you, mister!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Morley
But I bet he is one of the ones that wants pot legalized and sees absolutely no problem with it.
Actually, I want ALL "DRUGS" legalized. The "drug war" is much like prohibition. Been there, done that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by eljeffe
Yeah, but I'm serious. Instead of all this bullshit fucking around with smoking bans and other stupid ideas, why don't we just ban tobacco altogether? If it's this evil substance, capable of killing so many, why the fuck is it still legal?
That's what I love about nanny-staters, Jeff. They will tax your fat ass to death--telling you how evil your "habit" is--but will not outlaw it. Why? Cause the state "collects" way to many taxes from it! Kind of hard to seriously condem what you're endorsing through large taxes!

And I was abbreviating the "F" word! What was I thinking?
Quote:
Originally Posted by nelson61
Lets see....Ban the shit great something else they can sell on street corners. I say tax the shit out of it....oh wait they already do. SO lets tax it more !!!
So "they" can sell it on street corners--again! Hey, are you against an underground economy?!

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post #25 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 5:51 am
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Re: Smoking bans

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Originally Posted by jayjacobson
Actually, I want ALL "DRUGS" legalized. The "drug war" is much like prohibition. Been there, done that.
Too right
Legalise doctors managing drugs and you get;
NO MORE drug dealers
NO MORE theft for drug money
NO MORE deaths from bad drugs
No MORE young people being coerced into drug use - there will be no profit in it!
The polulation of drug users will one day die out and the problem will be solved - slowly, but surely

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post #26 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 6:16 am
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by c00k1e
Too right
Legalise doctors managing drugs and you get;
NO MORE drug dealers
NO MORE theft for drug money
NO MORE deaths from bad drugs
No MORE young people being coerced into drug use - there will be no profit in it!
The polulation of drug users will one day die out and the problem will be solved - slowly, but surely
One more thing, Cook1e: all those worthless big government hacks (DEA, etc.) also out of business! Maybe then, we can get back to being REAL police officers. Weed the real terrorists out of our communities--instead of the created ones!

"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." (Some really OLD friggin' White dude who couldn't have possibly known what he was talking about!) WARNING: Official HATE speech!
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post #27 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 6:29 am
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by eljeffe
Why fuck around? Ban tobacco altogether.
Eliminate the addictive substance in tobacco, and the problem will go away on it's own. The tobacco companies have admitted in their own internal documents, that they manipulate the nicotine levels "to maintain the customer base". I'm not one for more laws, but doesn't that sound more than a little...criminal?

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post #28 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 6:53 am
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by hoog62
Eliminate the addictive substance in tobacco, and the problem will go away on it's own. The tobacco companies have admitted in their own internal documents, that they manipulate the nicotine levels "to maintain the customer base". I'm not one for more laws, but doesn't that sound more than a little...criminal?
Dave, speaking of criminal: I found out that those EVIL big coffee companies have been manipulating caffeine levels for years! Think of all those hearts that they have helped to lock up tighter than a rusty old drum. And the whole time all those poor bastards thought they were just drinking their morning hot vitamin juice!

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post #29 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 8:08 am
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by eljeffe
If it's this evil substance, capable of killing so many, why the fuck is it still legal?
Always follow the money trail.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morley
After all, its annual income of billions of $$ would be gone...not to mention the tens of millions the govt collects in taxes each year.
Exactly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by c00k1e
No MORE young people being coerced into drug use - there will be no profit in it!
I don't think so. When large pharmaceutical companies spend millions on advertising to "increase their customer base" isn't that coercion on a grand scale? Have you never heard "Ask your doctor if _____ is right for you!"?

Quote:
Originally Posted by hoog62
. . . but doesn't that sound more than a little...criminal?
Only when they get caught. Up to that point, it's just capitalism working at its finest. And even when they do get "caught", who really pays the penalties, and who gets off scott-free?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jayjacobson
I found out that those EVIL big coffee companies have been manipulating caffeine levels for years!
No way. $tarbuck$ is just another outstanding example of fine American entrepreneurialism. Just like WalMart. The fact that its customers are screaming because they're talking about closing down 40% of their stores just proves what a valuable contribution they make to society. It has nothing to do with addiction. Honest.

Great. Now I'm multi-posting just like Jay.

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post #30 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 9:53 am
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by jayjacobson
Dave, speaking of criminal: I found out that those EVIL big coffee companies have been manipulating caffeine levels for years! Think of all those hearts that they have helped to lock up tighter than a rusty old drum. And the whole time all those poor bastards thought they were just drinking their morning hot vitamin juice!
Yeah, but that's OK since I drink coffee for the buzz.

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post #31 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 10:01 am
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by hoog62
Yeah, but that's OK since I drink coffee for the buzz.
BUZZ? What buzz?
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post #32 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 10:30 am
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Cool No one is talking about second hand smoke...

...and now back to our regularly scheduled programming and Norris's original beef:

I believe that you should be allowed to commit suicide any way you want: excessive alcohol, lack of exercise, trans fats, pills, etc. It's just a matter of how quickly you want to do it.

Shooting yourself in the head is a short, pain free and inexpensive way to end it all and doesn't take anyone else out in the process - unless you miss.

Smoking cigarettes is a long, painfull and expensive way to off yourself as well. The only problem is that along the way second hand smoke will most likely (over time) take out loved ones as well as complete strangers. Even if it doesn't outright kill the misery of drowning in your own lungs - emphysema - may be even worse than death.

The science is there folks, there is no longer any debate whether or not second hand smoke is deadly.

I can't think of any other vice that affects your neighbors so dramatically and can end up killing them - except maybe El Jeffe farting!

As much as I loathe big government, in this case they ARE looking out for your best interest.

It's a public health issue, period. That cigar smoking city commissioner that Norris got into a pissing match with is a total hypocrite, but then again he is a politician!


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post #33 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 10:36 am
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Re: Smoking bans

The argument that government should compel private business to adopt policies that may be detrimental to their perceived best interest has already been aired. The case was taken to the Supreme Court by business who argued that they should not be compelled to serve blacks.

Lets get beyond this nonsense. Tobacco smoke effects others and just as boaters are responsible for the wake, smokers should be responsible for second hand smoke.

Business may be surprised to find that banning smoking in their establishments is actually in their best interest just as serving blacks.

Karl
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post #34 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 10:36 am
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by andy
BUZZ? What buzz?
You d-d-d-d-don't d-d-d-d-drink enough of it-t-t-t-t-t, d-d-d-d-do you?

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post #35 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 10:50 am
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Re: No one is talking about second hand smoke...

Quote:
Originally Posted by RonKMiller
I can't think of any other vice that affects your neighbors so dramatically and can end up killing them - except maybe El Jeffe farting!
Fuckin' aye, bubba!


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post #36 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 11:40 am
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Re: Smoking bans

Wow. It would seem this thread has touched a nerve or two....
In my opinion most of these smoking bans have actually come about because of the the Liberals in places where they began, i.e, "Berkley types". However, upon doing some quick research using "The google" (lol, I really never get sick of saying that...) I found out that in fact, and unfortunately I might add, it appears Meese may actually be correct (for once) . The very first ban on tobacco (Eljeffe style ) was put in place by Pope Urban VII in 1590 - and apparently got a good foothold from there on out. Wiki page
Interesting, I didn't realize this battle went back this far - I guess I assumed in the old days people just tolerated smoking because that was just how it was... Hmph.
Anyhoo....
In my opinion, it's not really a freedom thing because if there is even one smoker in an establishment, it affects everyone. And it's not so easy as just saying well, if you don't want to smell smoke, just don't go there. If it's a workplace, I need a job. If it's a restaurant, I may not be able to find one without even one smoker in it, and even then someone could come in (and they often did back when this it was allowed) after you've been seated.
Basically, it's kind of like playing loud music, "your right to do it stops at my ear drum". Or in this case, my nostrils.
I don't really see it as a Big Brother issue, so much as a standard of living, or quality of life issue. Just my opinion of course....

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post #37 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 12:58 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

I wonder what second hand Copenhagen is doing to my cats?



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post #38 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 1:19 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Kevin,

I'm with you, but my point is rather than screw around with these ineffective bans in bars, restaurants, hotel parking lots, etc., and the IF real motivating factor is the removal of smoking from the culture because it's so bad for us, then we should just ban the stuff and move on. Quit subsidizing tobacco farmers, and you won't need a ban. It will just go away on its own.

I could care less if anyone smokes around me. It's their life. It's their decision. These prissy liberal shits who whine and complain whenever a smoker (or anyone else that offends their fragile sensibilities) is around them should just go elsewhere -- like someplace that has made a decision to not allow smoking -- and stay the fuck out of the bars and pubs I like to hang out in.

And before you anti-smoking radicals jump my ass, here's a little FACT for you - smokers are much more social and apt to engage in conversation with a stranger than non-smokers. It's a fact, not experience, there are many studies on it. Go look it up. So if I choose as a non-smoker to hang out in a bar that allows smoking, then you can go choose to go hang our someplace where it's been banned.


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post #39 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 1:19 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by grifscoots
I wonder what second hand Copenhagen is doing to my cats?
Probably cuts down on the shedding quite a bit.


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post #40 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 1:21 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

This thread seems to have degenerated into a political rant, which looking at it from a european point of view is quite sad.
Firstly I don´t think that banning or not banning smoking in public places has got much to do with political inclinations, especially over here anyway.
There is all this talk about smokers rights, but what about non-smokers rights ?. Over here smoking is banned in the work place but not in small bars and restaurants. Any public place over a 1000 square feet has to have designated "smoke free" areas, which simply does not work, and as people can no longer smoke at work they are now smoking more in bars etc, polluting the air more than previously.
Of course it takes a brave person to ban smoking in his establishment when he knows that they allow it next door. Is it because people that smoke drink more than people that don´t ?.
The only solution is to ban smoking in public places all together, and having said that, people that know me would never classify me as a liberal !.
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post #41 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 1:37 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Jeff needs to work on his ability to express his true feelings - this lack of confidence is hurting his "inner child" and his ability to "let go".

Hey, wait a minute - that sounds a LOT like me!

You know what cigarette smokers talk non stop about when they "get together"?

"Geez, this shit is really killing me, my ...

(insert one or more)

1. cough
2. lung cancer
3. oral cancer
4 emphysema
5. gum disease
6. yellow teeth
7. smelly puke breath
8. wheezing
9. teeth falling out
10. social life outside of fellow cigarette smokers

... really needs some attention. I really SHOULD quit...

I really do have a lot of empathy (yeah, I know - hard to believe) for cigarette smokers. I've read recently that it is more difficult to kick than my heroin habit.


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post #42 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 1:37 pm Thread Starter
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Question Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by eljeffe
And before you anti-smoking radicals jump my ass, here's a little FACT for you - smokers are much more social and apt to engage in conversation with a stranger than non-smokers.
Good point. Might be something too that. The times I have been a juror, I would hang with the smokers only because they would let them go outside every few hours. I can't stand being cooped up indoors. I would just stand upwind from them. They were a fun bunch, wonder how many are still alive!

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post #43 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 1:38 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by RonKMiller
Probably cuts down on the shedding quite a bit.
Not. I figure it's time to change the sheets when I can't tell what color they are anymore. Hairy monsters.



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post #44 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 1:40 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

One thang that no one has pointed out: a woman that smokes is more likely to go down on you than a woman who doesn't smoke...... unless it's your wife.



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post #45 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 1:46 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

They have actually proposed banning smoking in all public parks around here. That's right, outdoor parks. 'Cause you know....if you can smell it, it must be killing you!

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post #46 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 1:48 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Be careful, I might just fart in your general direction.

Can you say genocide?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RonKMiller
Jeff needs to work on his ability to express his true feelings - this lack of confidence is hurting his "inner child" and his ability to "let go".

Hey, wait a minute - that sounds a LOT like me!

You know what cigarette smokers talk non stop about when they "get together"?

"Geez, this shit is really killing me, my ...

(insert one or more)

1. cough
2. lung cancer
3. oral cancer
4 emphysema
5. gum disease
6. yellow teeth
7. smelly puke breath
8. wheezing
9. teeth falling out
10. social life outside of fellow cigarette smokers

... really needs some attention. I really SHOULD quit...

I really do have a lot of empathy (yeah, I know - hard to believe) for cigarette smokers. I've read recently that it is more difficult to kick than my heroin habit.


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post #47 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 2:16 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by eljeffe
Kevin,

I'm with you, but my point is rather than screw around with these ineffective bans in bars, restaurants, hotel parking lots, etc., and the IF real motivating factor is the removal of smoking from the culture because it's so bad for us, then we should just ban the stuff and move on. Quit subsidizing tobacco farmers, and you won't need a ban. It will just go away on its own.

I could care less if anyone smokes around me. It's their life. It's their decision. These prissy liberal shits who whine and complain whenever a smoker (or anyone else that offends their fragile sensibilities) is around them should just go elsewhere -- like someplace that has made a decision to not allow smoking -- and stay the fuck out of the bars and pubs I like to hang out in.

And before you anti-smoking radicals jump my ass, here's a little FACT for you - smokers are much more social and apt to engage in conversation with a stranger than non-smokers. It's a fact, not experience, there are many studies on it. Go look it up. So if I choose as a non-smoker to hang out in a bar that allows smoking, then you can go choose to go hang our someplace where it's been banned.
Jeff, you really need to stop holding all that anger inside like that man, you gotta let it out a little... it's going to kill you before the second hand smoke does.....

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post #48 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 2:18 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by eljeffe
Be careful, I might just fart in your general direction.

Can you say genocide?
UNCLEAN!



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post #49 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 2:21 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by grifscoots
One thang that no one has pointed out: a woman that smokes is more likely to go down on you than a woman who doesn't smoke...... unless it's your wife.
I wounder if you can get second hand smoke cancer that way???

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post #50 of 114 Old Jul 21st, 2008, 3:46 pm
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Re: Smoking bans

Quote:
Originally Posted by grifscoots
One thang that no one has pointed out: a woman that smokes is more likely to go down on you than a woman who doesn't smoke...... unless it's your wife.
This is why I come to this forum, the nuggets of info you just can't get on the boating forums.

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