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post #1 of 22 Old Feb 19th, 2008, 2:10 pm Thread Starter
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Are you ready for digital TV

The FCC has a deadline for all standard (analog NTSC) transmission to end on February 18, 2009. At that time you must have a digital tuner on your TV to receive over the air broadcasts. This will not affect satellite or cable TV subscribers. This website gives you more information and has a spot to apply for up to two $40 coupons to use toward digital converters if you need them. The digital converter will receive the new ATSC transmissions and convert them to a standard RF modulated RF signal for use with older TVs.

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post #2 of 22 Old Feb 19th, 2008, 2:16 pm
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Re: Are you ready for digital TV

I think this is a 'good thing', but then again, I am not affected by this. At least, I don't think that I will be. I've been a DISH customer for the past 7 years. If I were to change, it would be some bigger/better/faster/newer technology anyway.

I do have a brother that has a 65" wide screen HD TV with RABBIT EARS ON THE TOP OF IT though. What a dope! At least this will finally get him to order some form of real TV. His kids are pretty excited, as you could imagine.
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post #3 of 22 Old Feb 19th, 2008, 2:18 pm
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Re: Are you ready for digital TV

Verizon FIOS - Check!
2 Plasma and 1 LCD HDTVs - Check!

Yep. I'm ready!

I weep for those that are still analog

Todd R.
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post #4 of 22 Old Feb 19th, 2008, 2:20 pm
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Re: Are you ready for digital TV

Too bad all that good technology is only good to air the lousy TV and basic cable programing we currently suffer through...
Of course I can go buy a Blu-Ray player now that the industry decided on a standard. Alternatively I can keep using my ole (read cheap and paid for) DVD player and rent movies until I am forced to upgrade to Blu-Ray.
Anyone wants to buy some used VCRs???

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post #5 of 22 Old Feb 19th, 2008, 2:46 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Are you ready for digital TV

Quote:
Originally Posted by messenger13
I think this is a 'good thing', but then again, I am not affected by this. At least, I don't think that I will be. I've been a DISH customer for the past 7 years. If I were to change, it would be some bigger/better/faster/newer technology anyway.

I do have a brother that has a 65" wide screen HD TV with RABBIT EARS ON THE TOP OF IT though. What a dope! At least this will finally get him to order some form of real TV. His kids are pretty excited, as you could imagine.
ATSC is a very good thing, if you want full bandwidth HDTV. Cable carriers and Satellite providers can trim the HDTV bandwidth such that it is barely better than NTSC. While DirecTV has launched quite a few satellites in an attempt to keep up with the bandwidth, they still frequently provide less than optimal bandwidth for each HDTV channel. Dish is also trying to keep up, but they are rolling out HDTV channels faster than they are increasing their total bandwidth. You can expect 4-7mb datastreams off of satellite, far less than the 12-20 that is optimal for MPEG4 HDTV. At a customer's home last week, I saw a hockey game he had captured from a Dish HDTV feed and it had more compression artifacts than I have ever seen in HDTV. He said all of his channels have been getting far worse as Dish has offered more and more HTDV programming. While DirecTV is no prize either, we have noticed that the feeds remain about the same quality, even as they add more HDTV programming.

ATSC broadcast allows full bandwidth at 1080i and Blu Ray can offer full bandwidth at 1080p - everything else is compressed and as they scramble to provide more HTDV feeds, you can bet the compression will increase.

Randy Prade
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post #6 of 22 Old Feb 19th, 2008, 2:51 pm
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Re: Are you ready for digital TV

Can that new fangled HD thingy TV make me see better, so that I can see a difference?
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post #7 of 22 Old Feb 19th, 2008, 3:04 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Are you ready for digital TV

Quote:
Originally Posted by andy
Can that new fangled HD thingy TV make me see better, so that I can see a difference?
NO!

How's that.

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post #8 of 22 Old Feb 19th, 2008, 3:29 pm
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Re: Are you ready for digital TV

All my Paul S. videos for the LT are on VHS.

Does this mean I'll have to get blue-ray ones?

Bob
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post #9 of 22 Old Feb 19th, 2008, 4:00 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Are you ready for digital TV

Quote:
Originally Posted by BecketMa
All my Paul S. videos for the LT are on VHS.

Does this mean I'll have to get blue-ray ones?

Bob
Nope. They will still play on any current TV. VHS players are not worth repairing and will go away soon. You would be smart to burn the tapes onto DVD before too long.

Randy Prade
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post #10 of 22 Old Feb 19th, 2008, 4:54 pm
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Re: Are you ready for digital TV

Quote:
Originally Posted by Randy
Nope. They will still play on any current TV. VHS players are not worth repairing and will go away soon. You would be smart to burn the tapes onto DVD before too long.
Ok.. rather than provide a target, I'll just ask the question... "How do you burn to DVD? ... and... do you need a Blu-Ray burner?(No... ) '

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post #11 of 22 Old Feb 19th, 2008, 5:09 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Are you ready for digital TV

Quote:
Originally Posted by cfell
Ok.. rather than provide a target, I'll just ask the question... "How do you burn to DVD? ... and... do you need a Blu-Ray burner?(No... ) '
I use a video capture card in my computer, record a digital file, then burn it to DVD. Alternately you can use a home DVD recorder to burn tapes to DVD (as long as the tapes are not copy protected). Sams has a Samsung VCR/DVD recorder combo for about $150.

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post #12 of 22 Old Feb 19th, 2008, 5:13 pm
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Re: Are you ready for digital TV

Go to Tiger Direct and getya one. See the last page for the $$$ Blu-ray model.

Blessings!
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post #13 of 22 Old Feb 19th, 2008, 5:14 pm
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Re: Are you ready for digital TV

Quote:
Originally Posted by bmwhd
Verizon FIOS - Check!
2 Plasma and 1 LCD HDTVs - Check!

Yep. I'm ready!

I weep for those that are still analog
+1 on the FIOS!

Blessings!
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post #14 of 22 Old Feb 19th, 2008, 6:09 pm
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Re: Are you ready for digital TV

Well I guess I won't be watching TV after Feb 2009. Not that I watch a lot of it, not much on anymore. But I will miss CSI Miami with Eva La Rue

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post #15 of 22 Old Feb 19th, 2008, 7:30 pm
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Re: Are you ready for digital TV

Quote:
Originally Posted by messenger13
I think this is a 'good thing', but then again, I am not affected by this. At least, I don't think that I will be. I've been a DISH customer for the past 7 years. If I were to change, it would be some bigger/better/faster/newer technology anyway.

I do have a brother that has a 65" wide screen HD TV with RABBIT EARS ON THE TOP OF IT though. What a dope! At least this will finally get him to order some form of real TV. His kids are pretty excited, as you could imagine.
He may not be the dope. He can get HD with the over the air antenna. Us Dish customers only get standard digital on dish unless we up grade to Dish HD but we still won't get HD locals, we could get the food channel in HD. I have to use my Antenna to watch local HD or see the Browns in HD.

Just Go
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post #16 of 22 Old Feb 19th, 2008, 8:21 pm
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Re: Are you ready for digital TV

Yeah, ready times 2. Cable company loves me!

Also damn glad Blu-ray seems to have won the HD DVD war.

Ride On!


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post #17 of 22 Old Feb 19th, 2008, 8:40 pm
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Re: Are you ready for digital TV

Quote:
Originally Posted by mwnahas
He may not be the dope. He can get HD with the over the air antenna. Us Dish customers only get standard digital on dish unless we up grade to Dish HD but we still won't get HD locals, we could get the food channel in HD. I have to use my Antenna to watch local HD or see the Browns in HD.
You don't get the local HD channels with DISH? I have Directv and all the locals are HD now...

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post #18 of 22 Old Feb 20th, 2008, 7:52 am
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Re: Are you ready for digital TV

Local channels are not in all areas on satelite. I have the local channels on Dish now but I won't have satelite or cable in a few months as I will be retired and I shouldn't be home enough to pay for t.v. Free HD channels come in great with an antenna. They definately look better than the analog channels with the same antenna.
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post #19 of 22 Old Feb 20th, 2008, 8:23 am
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Re: Are you ready for digital TV

No TV = No problems

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post #20 of 22 Old Feb 20th, 2008, 6:50 pm
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Re: Are you ready for digital TV

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted Shred
You don't get the local HD channels with DISH? I have Directv and all the locals are HD now...
Dish is behind the times.

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post #21 of 22 Old Feb 20th, 2008, 7:52 pm
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Re: Are you ready for digital TV

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Originally Posted by Randy
... ATSC broadcast allows full bandwidth at 1080i and Blu Ray can offer full bandwidth at 1080p ...
Randy, can you tell me the difference between 1080i and 1080p ?? The very latest top-of-the-line TVs are labeled 1080p, but if it's 1080i, then it's often labeled 720p - is this correct?

- Bob

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post #22 of 22 Old Feb 20th, 2008, 8:23 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Are you ready for digital TV

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Originally Posted by bob_menton
Randy, can you tell me the difference between 1080i and 1080p ?? The very latest top-of-the-line TVs are labeled 1080p, but if it's 1080i, then it's often labeled 720p - is this correct?

- Bob
The I stands for Interlaced and the P for progressive. Interlacing the picture meant that the image is 'painted' with two alternating passes, called fields. With an interlaced picture the datastream can be smaller because you only need enough data to create 540 lines of resolution at each pass. With a progressive image you paint all the lines in one pass. The upside to an interlaced image is reduced data rate, the down side is that the registration of these two fields is not always perfect, leading to edge artifacts on any non-horizontal edges. The bandwidth allocation for transmitted ATSC TV only allows for interlaced 1080 (lines of resolution vertically). Blu Ray data rate allows for the full 1080p image. 720p is a lower data rate progressive scan image. It was built in to the ATSC standard as a compromise, allowing for the maximum progressive scan resolution with the bandwidth allocation provided by the 6mhz bandwidth of the standard NTSC frequencies for over the air broadcasts. Delivery by satellite, fiber or cable could provide the bandwidth for a true 1080p image, but you can believe they will need a substantial total bandwidth increase before that will happen.

NTSC (the TV we've had all of our lives) is broadcast at 525 lines of vertical resolution (interlaced) with a 4mhz bandwidth. That translated to a maximum of about 400 X 525 lines of resolution. Because of the need for a CRT to retrace between scans some of that resolution is lost. When color was added to NTSC in the 50s another chunk of the resolution was lost to the color subcarrier. That yielded a resolution of about 330w X 490h. This became 480i under the ATSC standard

ATSC - the new digital standard calls for several resolutions:
  • 640 (or 720) X 480 (can be interlaced or progressive scan)
  • 960 (or 1280) X 720 (always progressive)
  • 440 (or 1920) X 1080 (interlaced or progressive)
To add confusion any of these can be at 24 or 30 frames per second.

When you buy a new TV you should look for full HD or 1080p. It will look the best as the availability of HD programming evolves.

Randy Prade
Aurora, CO

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Last edited by Randy; Feb 21st, 2008 at 9:29 am.
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