Take the ERC with a 250 or the LT? - BMW Luxury Touring Community
 
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post #1 of 16 Old Jul 10th, 2008, 2:34 pm Thread Starter
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Take the ERC with a 250 or the LT?

Hi,

You all were so much help to me the last time I thought I'd run another question by you.

I currently have a Honda Rebel 250 and I have put 1300 miles on it so I'm a "newbee". I have taken the basic motorcycle riding course and I practice (in a parking lot with cones and everything) the skills I learned there about everyday. Yesterday I asked if I should go ahead and buy a K1200LT or wait until I have more experience. The response I received from you all was overwhelming that I wait, so I swallowed hard and decided to wait until I have more riding experience. It was sooooo difficult!!!

I'm now considering taking the ERC course. The question is: should I take the ERC on my 250 or should I wait and take it with the K1200LT? If I spent $25K on an LT and dumped it in the ERC course I would probably loose my lunch....

Thanks so much for your help on my last question...


Steve
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post #2 of 16 Old Jul 10th, 2008, 3:00 pm
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Re: Take the ERC with a 250 or the LT?

Quote:
Originally Posted by smartypants
Hi,

You all were so much help to me the last time I thought I'd run another question by you.

I currently have a Honda Rebel 250 and I have put 1300 miles on it so I'm a "newbee". I have taken the basic motorcycle riding course and I practice (in a parking lot with cones and everything) the skills I learned there about everyday. Yesterday I asked if I should go ahead and buy a K1200LT or wait until I have more experience. The response I received from you all was overwhelming that I wait, so I swallowed hard and decided to wait until I have more riding experience. It was sooooo difficult!!!

I'm now considering taking the ERC course. The question is: should I take the ERC on my 250 or should I wait and take it with the K1200LT? If I spent $25K on an LT and dumped it in the ERC course I would probably loose my lunch....

Thanks so much for your help on my last question...


Steve
The ERC is best taken with 3,000 miles under your belt. Wait and practice.Take it with the LT later and again every year or two. And if you drop the LT,so what, the only damage is to your pride and scratches on the plastic bumpers.

dan
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post #3 of 16 Old Jul 10th, 2008, 3:06 pm
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Re: Take the ERC with a 250 or the LT?

As a newbee, would do the ERC on a bike you feel safe with. The Rebel sounds like the proper bike to use in this case.

I did the ERC on my LT along with @ 6 others on their LT's .... But our group was experienced riders with most having 10 years or more riding.

The ERC on the LT was a hand full !! .... no one dropped one, but many a WIDE eye was noted

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post #4 of 16 Old Jul 10th, 2008, 3:22 pm
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Re: Take the ERC with a 250 or the LT?

It is generally recommended that an individual gain somewhere around 3000 miles riding experience prior to returning to take an ERC. Given that your currently riding a fairly small and light weight bike, if your incentive in taking the ERC is strictly to further develop and refine your skill level, I'd say taking the class on your Rebel at this point is probably a fine idea.

Beyond that, as I'm sure your realize, the step up from the 250 Honda to the LT is a huge one. Depending on your skill level as well as confidence level you might want to make that transition in two steps. Perhaps some additional time on something in the 650 to 700 cc class would better prepare you for handling the beast in the LT. If time and or financing prohibit that, I would suggest, as above, take the ERC on the 250, ride it for an additional period of time to develop your skill level and then make the jump up to the LT. I would then ride the LT consevitively for an additional 1000 miles or so before taking the ERC on the new bike. You need to develop your confidence in handling the LT and become intimately familiar with all it's controls before signing up for the ERC. If you take your shinny new LT to class with an inherent fear of dropping it, well, Ya know it's gona happen! Remember, one of the primary goals of an ERC is not to teach you how to ride your bike. It is however to provide you with a safe and controlled enviornment in which to practice and further refine all of your existing skills while riding your own motorcycle and under the watchful eye of a trained coach who can help you to become a safer and more proficient rider.

Lynn Keen
North East Florida
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'99 Canyon Red RETIRED AT 93,000 MI
'05 GRAPHITE METALLIC retired at 87,000 MI
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post #5 of 16 Old Jul 10th, 2008, 3:47 pm
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Re: Take the ERC with a 250 or the LT?

I've dropped my LT once so far....at ERC. Was doing the zig-zag through widely spaced cones. Once it started to go, I tried in vain to keep it upright. Didn't try to catch it, but quickly straightened the wheel. The black tip-over bar cover kissed the blacktop. I was the first in the class session to pick up a dropped bike. I'd owned the bike for 6 months/6000 miles at the time. I didn't feel so bad about it when I saw a Harley *bounce* several times on its side, get picked up, and dropped again 20 feet later.

Get some more miles on the Rebel before you try ERC. There's plenty of experience still to be gained, and its not something that should be rushed. Also, learning a new bike at the same time as learning the ERC skills is something *I* wouldn't try. I'd leave the LT home, and bring the Rebel, since its easier to pick up, and would be less upsetting to see damaged.

...Bob
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post #6 of 16 Old Jul 10th, 2008, 4:23 pm
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Re: Take the ERC with a 250 or the LT?

Everyone has told you to wait until you reach the magical "3000 miles" mark. If I were you, I would trade the 250 for a 650 of some sort, (it doesn't have to be a BMW). Suzuki has a fantastic bike for you, SV650, or the new GS650F. I've been teaching the MSF classes for a while and I tell my students not to get too hung up on the 3000 mile mark. I suggest you get yourself a standard sized bike like I mentioned and ride the hell out of it. Get completely comfortable with all types of traffic situations. Go out and purposely ride in the rain, etc....

Parking lot work around some cones is a good start but you're fooling yourself if you think you can go from a 250 to an LT. BTW, the LT is one of if not the most difficult bike on the planet to maneuver in a parking lot setting. It is a fantastic LD bike and can be ridden quite briskly in the curvy stuff but it's a heavy motorcycle.

Be patient and work your way up to an LT, you'll be glad you did.
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post #7 of 16 Old Jul 10th, 2008, 7:13 pm
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Re: Take the ERC with a 250 or the LT?

You better get some miles behind you...
I friend of mine got 109K out of his 250. He sold it with 9K on the clock.
IT looked like SH1TE!

You should try it.

Visit
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_ Why is there never enough time to do it right the first time, but always enough time to do it over?
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post #8 of 16 Old Jul 10th, 2008, 7:27 pm
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Re: Take the ERC with a 250 or the LT?

Here is a good picture of the bike:



Anyone seen him before? On the right.
He is paralysed from the waste down, He rides a Bandit 1200 and a Hyosong 250.
He is faster than most sportbike riders on a 250.


When you get that fast, then buy an LT.

Visit
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_ Why is there never enough time to do it right the first time, but always enough time to do it over?
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post #9 of 16 Old Jul 10th, 2008, 10:05 pm
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Re: Take the ERC with a 250 or the LT?

I'm another one with the buy a larger motorcycle before buying an LT. Take the ERC by all means with the 250 if you want, but before you jump on an LT you need a LOT more experiance with a more motorcyle. And that's not even getting in to the low-speed hadling issues.

The main reason people recommend buying a 250cc motorcycle in the first palce is to teach you the basics about riding. To build confidence in riding. And to minimize the risk. What that means is a 2500 cc motorcycle is a featherweight.

It's designed to accelerate slowly. It's designed for manuverability. It's low weight means you are less likely to drop it, have it skid out from under you (assuming you kick it back up if it starts to go), etc. All these are good things.

All of it changes as you go up in CCs. A 600 ~ 1000 cc motorcycle will accelerate like a bat out of ****. Can stop on a dime. Or stop that front wheel quick enough to slide out from under you or do an unexpected stoppie.

Some larger motorcycles, like my '02 Concours (1000 cc) & the LT (1200 cc), carry more weight up top than others. Being top heavy can take some getting used to, and you can pretty much guarentee it's going to go over at some time. My Councours was dropped in my garage with my wife on one side and me on the other. Neighter of us could stop it, but we were able to lay it down on a tire safely so no damage occured. I got the go-ahead to order tipover bars right then and there. The LT already has them.

You are not going to stop a 500, or 850, lbs motorcycle from falling over at low speed once it reaches that critical point. No matter how striong you are. A lot of the ERC is low-speed manuvering. When I take it, I'll take it on my '96 RT and then maybe later my '06 LT. I've been riding on and off for 25 years and I'd never recommend to someone with so little hands-on experiance to buy an LT as their first, or second, motorcycle. Not that it can't be done, but it is not a wise decision/choice.

2006 Magnesium Black Metallic K1200LT (sold - sigh)
1996 Sinus (aka Cirrus) Blue Metallic R1100RT
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post #10 of 16 Old Jul 11th, 2008, 4:37 am
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Re: Take the ERC with a 250 or the LT?

I say, "just do it", you will have a blast. Then when you get the LT "just do it" again.

John
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post #11 of 16 Old Jul 11th, 2008, 9:12 am
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Re: Take the ERC with a 250 or the LT?

Quote:
Originally Posted by smartypants
Hi,

You all were so much help to me the last time I thought I'd run another question by you.

I currently have a Honda Rebel 250 and I have put 1300 miles on it so I'm a "newbee". I have taken the basic motorcycle riding course and I practice (in a parking lot with cones and everything) the skills I learned there about everyday. Yesterday I asked if I should go ahead and buy a K1200LT or wait until I have more experience. The response I received from you all was overwhelming that I wait, so I swallowed hard and decided to wait until I have more riding experience. It was sooooo difficult!!!

I'm now considering taking the ERC course. The question is: should I take the ERC on my 250 or should I wait and take it with the K1200LT? If I spent $25K on an LT and dumped it in the ERC course I would probably loose my lunch....

Thanks so much for your help on my last question...


Steve
My suggestion is to take it on both. Learning those skills on the lighter bike will be immensely helpful, and then doing it again once you get a couple of months of riding under your belt on the LT will just make your integration with and enjoyment of it that much better. Pretty cheap entry price for a high level of confidence and comfort in your skills and your (soon to be) new machine.

David Taylor
San Jose, CA
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post #12 of 16 Old Jul 11th, 2008, 11:35 am
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Re: Take the ERC with a 250 or the LT?

I took the ERC after 10,000 miles on a 800CC Suzuki. It still had some spots in which I wasn't comfortable; but I didn't come close to dropping the bike. I probably could have done it at 5,000 miles; but maybe not. I certainly could NOT have done it after 3000 miles total and switching from your size bike to the LT.
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post #13 of 16 Old Jul 11th, 2008, 12:12 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Take the ERC with a 250 or the LT?

Thanks everyone for the input! You all have come through again!
I've read about LT tip-over protection devices? Apparently these devices prevent paint/plastic scratches in the case of a tip-over. Any input on these?

Thanks again
Steve
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post #14 of 16 Old Jul 11th, 2008, 12:48 pm
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Re: Take the ERC with a 250 or the LT?

Quote:
Originally Posted by smartypants
Thanks everyone for the input! You all have come through again!
I've read about LT tip-over protection devices? Apparently these devices prevent paint/plastic scratches in the case of a tip-over. Any input on these?

Thanks again
Steve
Not really, There is a crash bar located under them that prevents the body panels from caving in, but the plastic parts that covers the crash bars is SACRIFICED to some degree if bike does go over.

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post #15 of 16 Old Jul 11th, 2008, 4:51 pm
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Re: Take the ERC with a 250 or the LT?

I would take the ERC on the bike you feel most comfortable on at this time. The lessons you learn on the 250 move to the LT.

If you already have the LT ride it more before the ERC and remember what you learned at the class with the 250. Next year sign up for the ERC again and this time take the LT.

The trick is don't ever worry about dropping it. It is a bike and can be fixed and the wings do a good job of protecting it. I came close to dropping mine at the ERC this year. I wasn't afraid because my old bike had been on its side several times and the black plastic was scraped but in the long run no big deal.

The ERC course will help you either way. Go for it. If you think you can do it then try. The worse that can happen is the instructor tells you your not ready and to leave.

Tom Ress
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post #16 of 16 Old Jul 11th, 2008, 9:56 pm
 
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Re: Take the ERC with a 250 or the LT?

It depends why you are taking the ERC.

I take the ERC every time I get a new bike.
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