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post #1 of 55 Old Apr 21st, 2008, 7:00 pm Thread Starter
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Another Dead Harley

I was working at UT Medical in Knoxville so you know I drop my MR Spyder up.

On the way home down US 129 there was an ambulance heading north with lights going.
When I got down by the lake the slide truck with a shiny comed out Harley with massive front end damage went by.

When will they learn that those bikes are for straight roads lined with bars and strip clubs?

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post #2 of 55 Old Apr 21st, 2008, 8:33 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeERideWNC
I was working at UT Medical in Knoxville so you know I drop my MR Spyder up.

On the way home down US 129 there was an ambulance heading north with lights going.
When I got down by the lake the slide truck with a shiny comed out Harley with massive front end damage went by.

When will they learn that those bikes are for straight roads lined with bars and strip clubs?
yeah right, have you ever watched a flat track race. it's about 50% curve and harleys are very competitive in them. if you are going to bash harley, try to be more convincing. to start with you might want get all of the facts, then present them rather than imply that they won't corner. they certainty will corner. i owned harleys for sixteen years and i kept the pipes and the primary skinned up. that includes an original '57 and a '75 super glide. both were stock. get a life.
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post #3 of 55 Old Apr 21st, 2008, 8:49 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

MikeERideWNC its dumb ass comments like you made that give motorcycle rider
a bad name

Mike
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post #4 of 55 Old Apr 21st, 2008, 8:58 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Sorry to offend you...

I see a lot of Harley's here on slide trucks.
Maybe the flat track riders aren't riding here.


Maybe it dumbass bikers who can't make it through a curve that give bikers a bad name.
Especially on Deal's Gap.

Get a clue.

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post #5 of 55 Old Apr 21st, 2008, 9:02 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Dave, you are right,my bad

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post #6 of 55 Old Apr 21st, 2008, 9:03 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Gotta say, Mike, that your comment is very offensive. Or perhaps nothing more that a statement of your own ignorance. Like my daddy always used to say sometimes: no one knows you're stupid until you open your mouth and tell them.
I have a HD Deuce (and the LT). Neither my son-in-law or his friend, both on Yamaha FJRs can catch me in the mountains. I've dogged the R-1 through sweepers, only to lose ground on the straights. And I can run right with my son's Ninja 636. If you think a Harley can't handle, you don't know Harleys.
Enjoyed your sympathy and compassion for a fellow bike rider. Guess if you die on a Harley, no big deal.
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post #7 of 55 Old Apr 21st, 2008, 9:04 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

MikeERideWNC nothing personal,it just hit a bad nerve

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post #8 of 55 Old Apr 21st, 2008, 9:09 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Michael, why would YOU apologize? It was an extremely insensitive crack made with no concern for the pain or suffering of another rider or his family. Shows what the guy's made of.
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post #9 of 55 Old Apr 21st, 2008, 9:19 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

I apologized for attacking him personally,but that does not change my opinion about his statement.

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post #10 of 55 Old Apr 21st, 2008, 9:27 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

do your homework if your going to criticize a wreck you didn't see rather than imply it is the motorcycle and not the motorcyclist. and for that matter how do you know weather there wasn't something else that contributed to the rider going down? could it have been debris on the road, tar snake, oil, someone pull out in front of the rider. but to imply that only flat trackers are capable of riding harleys on corners shows that you are real sharp. was the rider drinking or high on drugs was the road wet? did you have your eyes open or were you just imaging the whole thing to make you feel like you are superior to those ignorant hicks that ride harleys and maybe just maybe make you feel inferior for some reason? perhaps one of those harley riders growled at you once and threatened to kick your butt. i really don't know and really don't care. if you want to show you ignorance, that is up to you. but you started wth the premise that harleys are for going on straight roads then you switched to well there are no flat track riders. so just why is it that you are so predjuested against harleys? it is apparent to me that you are. if you don't have any better opinions than what you have shared above then perhaps, you ought to keep them to yourself.
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post #11 of 55 Old Apr 21st, 2008, 9:32 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Quote:
Originally Posted by fpmlt
Michael, why would YOU apologize? It was an extremely insensitive crack made with no concern for the pain or suffering of another rider or his family. Shows what the guy's made of.
the guy who started this thread ain't growed up yet. he shows himself to be an elitist who feels that his opinion is the only opinion that matters. i feel for his wife.
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post #12 of 55 Old Apr 21st, 2008, 11:54 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Wow, you guys are really piling on. Let me come out in defense of MikeERideWNC.

I live in a hilly area with picturesque twisting roads. There is a local bike-tavern a few miles away, filled with Hell's-Angels wannabees (I wandered in there once by mistake during a charity ride and am still happy to have come away in one piece... my Aerostich was deemed out of place in the land of leather and chains). On nice days the roads here are filled with (don't know what brand) cruisers. Not too many sport bikes - their extremists, the stunt riders, tend to head for Harriman Park.

From my own personal observation, I can say that a large number of riders here display a complete lack of riding abilities. I am often following a parade-formation of bikes, blocking the road, weaving across solid line, holding up a long column of minivans (!). I see often very poor line selection and control in turns. I see often riders who are afraid to ride; last Saturday I followed a couple in requisite Nazi helmets who rode 25-28mph on my road, posted 40mph (and which is nice for a leisurely 50) - who even did not have the consideration to pull to the right to let my bike through.

Even though MikeERideWNC seems to have offended a favorite bike of some forum members, we should all look at the big picture. Yes, there are racers on Harleys, there are many skilled riders on cruisers, there are Harleys in the top finishing list of the IBA.

However, they are all overshadowed by a large number of "lifestyle bikers", who got into motorcycling for various reasons - but none related to the skills of riding.

This can be evidenced by objective accident statistics. 2008 data from National Safety Council indicate that motorcycle-related fatalities have more than doubled in the 1996-2006 period while bike registrations only went up by 60%. As result death rate doubled from 21.8 to 42.5 deaths per 100 million miles ridden.

There is more insightful info available, but the bottom line is that riders are becoming more and more of a danger to themselves. One could argue "so what?" - it affects only those involved, but the fact is that it affects all of us participating in the sport.

If we do not promote riding techniques and habits that result in safer riding, we will soon face a clampdown. Riding will be restricted not only by an outright ban (as I have already encountered in many localities), but by stringent limitations on motorcycle insurance, health insurance, employment contracts (which are also happening).

So, let's not get bent out of shape on whether the original post was or was not respectful to the presumably dead rider. That is completely counterproductive. I wish that there would be more comments along what I thought was MikeERideWNC's actual intention: how do we prevent a descent of our sport into total chaos?

My solution is completely impractical, unfortunately: much more strict licensing/examination requirements, associated with tiered licenses. It is too bad that I just do not see how ever that would get implemented here - any such idea would be greeted with howls of protest from those who think that even getting today's perfunctory license is too much bother. And yet, being familiar with the Western European licensing approaches, I see how well these work. Their accident rate is significantly lower, despite much higher speeds and much denser traffic.

Since my idea is no good, what say ye?

Robert in Northern NJ

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post #13 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 5:48 am
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Folks, I've said this before, but there is way too much Harley bashing on this site. I spent most of my riding life on Harleys and do not regret it. I hung with a riding bunch, not bar hoppers (OK, we did a little of that) or pretenders. Most of my crowd did 15K a year which is not your typical image of a HD rider. Many did many more. I sold my 7 year old Harley 2 months ago and got $11,400 for it. Lets see an LT do that.

Having said that, I am glad I found the LT and will most likely never go back to a Harley. Just stop the HD bashing. It demeans us all.

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post #14 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 6:12 am Thread Starter
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Please note the Harley rider is OK.

The bike is dead.
Some of you read to deaply into my comment and really, take another Xanax and relax.



***Cruisers out number sport bikes six to one.
Last year the WNC reported one of every three vehicle accidents involved a motorcycle.
I personally would like to know the percentage of Cruisers, tourers and sport bikes.
I see many more cruiser crashed in the mountains than any other bike.

Talk to the locals here.
Though they are aggravated by the speeding motorcycle, the average Harley rider really pisses off the local non-motorcycle riding public.
The first major complaint is the mere fact that they ride 35-45 miles per hour in every fifty-five zone.
Some of my neighbors actually have to go to work. Just because you are here on vacation doesnít mean the rest of us are.
The loud pipes are another main factor.
If loud pipes save lives why donít all manufactures vent the exhaust out of the front of the bike?
Again, when the Harley rider leaves the bar at 0200 the sound of big bore V-twin is not what the residents want to hear.


It does not hurt my feeling to see another Harley Davidson's motorcycle removed from my local roads.


Really some of you are to thin skinned.


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post #15 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 6:15 am
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Hey, guys...

You've probably heard similar words relating to the FALLEN RIDER.... . "There, but for the grace of God, go I." I can recall numerous incidents where I could have been that "statistic".

Those words also refer to words I've spoken when "the moment" hit a nerve...only to realize they hurt more than they helped.

I am sure no one likes seeing a fallen rider... The rest, well, us RIDERS are a passionate group, aren't we?

...............
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post #16 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 7:28 am
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Re: Another Dead Harley

RDWalker, your comments above are very well said.
I'm a hunter and gun owner, but feel it should be very difficult to obtain a firearm. It's a similar situation. It should be difficult to get a MC lic. There should be training involved.
I hate to see any rider go down. My wife actually can't stand the fact I own a bike. (now two ) She will never ride with me. She's seen and read too many articles about donor-cycles..
There is a very large % of bikers that are "lifestyle" bikers. Here in St Louis they ride 30 miles to Alton, IL. (no helmet law there) sit at a bar for hours. (Fast Eddies) then ride 20 miles north along the river road to another bar. Then head home at night. Not every biker, but way too many.
They do tend to give us all a black eye.

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post #17 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 7:37 am
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Re: Another Dead Harley

I'm glad to hear the rider was ok. Did he have many injuries? Will he have to miss work and struggle to make ends meet?
I think we need to remember this is a fellow rider. No matter what he rides or how he rides it.

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post #18 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 9:07 am
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Thumbs up Re: Another Dead Harley

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeinpgh
I'm glad to hear the rider was ok. Did he have many injuries? Will he have to miss work and struggle to make ends meet?
I think we need to remember this is a fellow rider. No matter what he rides or how he rides it.
Good point Mike!

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post #19 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 9:13 am
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Excellent reply Mike.

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post #20 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 9:49 am
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Touchy..touchy ...touchy... Being the only BMW rider in a family full of Harley riders, I get more crap from them then I give. Being that my brother who rides a 47' Pan Head is the only "real" HD rider of the bunch, I have to agree that most of the HD riders I know are the boutique type riders.


We have had this discussion before. The HD guys get all ticked off because of an off handed comment about the "all American bike". My wife and I's favorite shirt to wear is the one below. Even wore it to the HD dealer with my HD lovin'/riding sister-n- brother in laws.

Last time I checked, this was a BMW forum. Maybe some would be more comfortable here: http://hdforums.com/

Part of what makes a forum fun is the ability to open discussions. Once you get the kind of responses that MikeERideWNC got, and the personal attacks, it just becomes a sort of censorship. Should I post that? Will some one get annoyed? Ticked ? Attack me personally and pull my wife into the conversation?

I think if a comment about another brand of bike is too much to handle, an open forum may not be the right place for you to be.

Heck, with all the discussion on KLR's, Concours, sometimes I have to check to make sure I am in the right forum myself.

I do wonder if omurphy and ka0mlh even have a Beemer. Just wondering.

Anyway, state your point...don't make it personal.

Taking aside a fellow rider went down, I thought the statement: When will they learn that those bikes are for straight roads lined with bars and strip clubs?...was actually quite funny !


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post #21 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 10:52 am
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Re: Another Dead Harley

+1, KIC!

And, love the shirt. You do have some balls though, to go in it into HD-land. Impressed....

Robert in Northern NJ

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post #22 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 11:06 am
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Re: Another Dead Harley

not that it matters but yes i do ride a bemmer,my first post was made do to the fact that because of some ones riding skills got hurt that he or she deserved it. it had nothing to do with it being a harley.so being that some one that has gone down i should not stop to help because of what he is riding.

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post #23 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 11:10 am
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Here's my persceptive on why you see so many Harley's involved in accidents:

A lot of guys go through that mid-life crisis and watch as a motorcycle goes by, wishing it was them. Then one day they decide it's time they took up riding. For some reason, probably the harley mystic, but they feel the need to go out and buy a brand new Harley. Too much power and too little experience soon come into play and there's an accident. The same thing happens on sportbikes, but it's the youngun's that get them, and there are just far more new Harley's out there right now because of all the babyboomers getting the urge to ride.

I see this as much of a dealer problem as anything else. Why would a dealer sell a big bike to someone that 1) has never ridden before, 2) has just completed the course, or 3) hasn't ridden in 20 yrs and think they remember how to ride? Profits and greed. What they need to do is tell the buyer he needs to start small and cheap. How many low mileage bikes do you see for sale? They buy them ride them a few months, then decide it's not for them, or they scare the crap out of themselves.

Imagine if you will, a 6'3" 250# guy on a Suzuki GS425. That was me 25+yrs ago. I had enough sense to know that I'd kill myself on anything bigger until I got used to riding. My wife used to say I was a moose on a stool. I think more people need to be that moose on a stool until they learn how to handle a heavy bike with lots of power.

That's just my opinion.....and we all know opinions are like a$$holes. Everyone has one.


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post #24 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 12:10 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Quote:
Originally Posted by dwsdad
Here's my persceptive on why you see so many Harley's involved in accidents:
I would like to see some actual numbers. I'm not convinced that Harleys are overrepresented in accident statistics, especially taking into consideration the number of people who ride them. I know people who work in ERs, and they all say the same thing--its the sportbike riders who are showing up in ambulances.

Anecdotally, the Harley riders I know and ride with are older, highly experienced riders ... a similar demographic to LT riders.
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post #25 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 12:51 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Statistically...

On my 50th Birthday my wife woke me to say.. "Let's go buy a motorcycle." OKAY! Going to be a good day!

I had to pay $2000 to "insure" it.... why? Because of my age, new bike, yada yada.

Fast forward 6 months... I get a refund on my HD insurance ... and buy the LT.. cost........ $360 per year!!!!!

WHAT?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!??!

Yup... So, if you ONLY go on the "insurance" guys numbers, either they figure they have the $$$$ to spend on insurance so they jack up the price OR there is a higher incidence of "payout" in that type/age class. (P.S. At the time I had ridden motorcycles for about 38 years.)

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post #26 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 1:15 pm
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Wink Re: Another Dead Harley

MikEride you sure know how to stir the pot...congratulations, I love it, keep up the good work.
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post #27 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 2:43 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

[QUOTE=CalLT]I would like to see some actual numbers. I'm not convinced that Harleys are overrepresented in accident statistics, especially taking into consideration the number of people who ride them. I know people who work in ERs, and they all say the same thing--its the sportbike riders who are showing up in ambulances.

Anecdotally, the Harley riders I know and ride with are older, highly experienced riders ... a similar demographic to LT riders.[/QUOTE

Sorry, no hard facts. Only what I hear & see on the local news. Harley/cruiser crashes out number sportbike crashes at least 3 -1 in San Antonio. And of course, most deaths are caused by not wearing a helmet. 2 days ago, a guy on a Harley was cruising down 35 by New Braunfels and ran into a parked car. He was not wearing a helmet. So how does one run into a parked car, on the freeway?


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post #28 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 3:04 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Quote:
Originally Posted by CalLT
I would like to see some actual numbers. I'm not convinced that Harleys are overrepresented in accident statistics, ... I know people who work in ERs, and they all say the same thing--its the sportbike riders who are showing up in ambulances.

Anecdotally, the Harley riders I know and ride with are older, highly experienced riders ... a similar demographic to LT riders.
No numbers per brands, but from that 2008 NSC report I mentioned, under-30 age group represented 32% of fatally injured motorcyclists, while 47% were 40 and above. That is a ratio of almost one-and-half times.

That clashes with the anecdotal statistics of ER workers you mentioned - since it is reasonable to assume that the under-30 group is more likely to ride sport bikes, while the older segment rides big machines (cruisers and, yes, a smattering of LTs). My guess is that these opinions simply reflect some preconceptions since I very much doubt that anyone in an ER actually keeps track of numbers and types of bikes ridden by the injured.

Obviously, you are riding with the good guys (those "older, highly experienced riders"), but the statistics show that there is an alarming influx of inexperienced riders coming into the sport. And they do crash.

There were some hard statistics in recent industry report column in MCN. I cannot recall them off-hand, but again, the cruiser segment is much more represented in new-bike purchases, more than other types.

Still, I am not sure what is the point of this discussion - my take on this all is that riders of ALL types of bikes should possess a good skill set. And that our licensing system should be revamped to force that.

Robert in Northern NJ

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post #29 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 3:28 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Quote:
Originally Posted by rdwalker
No numbers per brands, but from that 2008 NSC report I mentioned, under-30 age group represented 32% of fatally injured motorcyclists, while 47% were 40 and above. That is a ratio of almost one-and-half times.

That clashes with the anecdotal statistics of ER workers you mentioned - since it is reasonable to assume that the under-30 group is more likely to ride sport bikes, while the older segment rides big machines (cruisers and, yes, a smattering of LTs). My guess is that these opinions simply reflect some preconceptions since I very much doubt that anyone in an ER actually keeps track of numbers and types of bikes ridden by the injured.

Obviously, you are riding with the good guys (those "older, highly experienced riders"), but the statistics show that there is an alarming influx of inexperienced riders coming into the sport. And they do crash.

There were some hard statistics in recent industry report column in MCN. I cannot recall them off-hand, but again, the cruiser segment is much more represented in new-bike purchases, more than other types.

Still, I am not sure what is the point of this discussion - my take on this all is that riders of ALL types of bikes should possess a good skill set. And that our licensing system should be revamped to force that.
Good post. You are right.
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post #30 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 3:40 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Quote:
Originally Posted by fpmlt
Gotta say, Mike, that your comment is very offensive. Or perhaps nothing more that a statement of your own ignorance. Like my daddy always used to say sometimes: no one knows you're stupid until you open your mouth and tell them.
I have a HD Deuce (and the LT). Neither my son-in-law or his friend, both on Yamaha FJRs can catch me in the mountains. I've dogged the R-1 through sweepers, only to lose ground on the straights. And I can run right with my son's Ninja 636. If you think a Harley can't handle, you don't know Harleys.
Enjoyed your sympathy and compassion for a fellow bike rider. Guess if you die on a Harley, no big deal.
Now this guy knows something about bikes, he's really been around.
Where were you at and this statement at when I walked away from harley.
Man I took a lick just because I thought that their bikes wouldn't run, and if and when you did get them running it took a fourty acre field to get them stopped. Now your not talking about some souped up bike with aftermarket braking system that you have done or had done are you???
I have had 8 or 10 Harleys in my life, if I had only purchased the Deuce I might of stayed with Harley.
Man I never knew that thing would run like that thru the mtns., you are talking about curves included aren't you. And I am sure that you are not including anything like the dragon. I know when your coming out of a curve up there on the dragon and you throw the throttle to it you damn sure better have some good brakes before you start into the next curve. I am going to have to go try one of those little Deuce puppies out. I do know or I do think that Harley makes the prettiest bike on the planet, but out run the FJR and the R1 over the river and thru the woods in the mtns. If they do what you say my man I will go back to Harley and thumb my nose at BMW, take a picture of me doing it and post it here on this site with me sitting on the bike that I purchased. Man I love those Harleys, just the name puts shivers up my spine. I did tell you that I did own an FJR didn't I. Fast, man I do mean fast, smooth, man I do mean smooth, breaking power out of this world, but you know it is just a big piece of something you don't ever want to step in. I love Harleys, yea.

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post #31 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 4:39 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Another Dead Harley

WoW! I never meant to stir the pudding this hard.
There is definately a lot of positive and negative feedback on this issue.
Much more spirited than I would have ever imagined.

As far as satistics, of age in the ER, I don't know.
I do know that I support Trauma units all over the US and my job has something to do with imaging.

I see more fifty and older riders visiting the trauma units.
Let's face it we're not as young as we once were.
Fifty plus individual would go to the ER after a minor motorcycle crash. A lot of younger riders crash bikes and never report it or seek medical attention.

I have seen terrible motorcycle accidents and I suppose this is why I take it lighter than some of you.

A short story of a recent trauma I saw:
52 YO Male on a Harley. He was at an intersection stopped and fell over.
I happened to be sitting with the Radiologist when the x-ray came across and he asked me to look at it. There was a huge mass on the right side of the heart.
A CT was ordered, this reveiled that when the rider fell over he stuck out his arm to stop his fall. His right ball popped out of the socket in his shoulder and puntured his heart. He was and instant trauma case.

Motorcyles are dangerous. Life is short.
There is no need to get bent out of shape over things you read on the internet.
Just take as it is, just words.
Some of us have seen more than we would ever want to see when it come to vehicle accidents.

A Harley that can out manuver an R1 would have to be an impressive site.
Please post a video soon.

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post #32 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 5:01 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

A Harley that can out manuver an R1 would have to be an impressive site.
Please post a video soon.

Never said that. Never said I beat an R1 or Ninja. Said I dogged him through the sweepers. He was hot dogging, pissed me off, so I laid into it, got on his ass through some high speed turns, then he kicked my ass on the straights. Same with the Ninja. Yes, I built the Deuce. Had to, was about to grind through the primary case and brake lever. My point, well I guess it doesn't matter much. Seems the cruisers are giving motorcycling a bad name for crashing all the time, and the crotch rockets are giving motorcycling a bad name for wheelies and busting through traffic. Thank God for us BMW riders who seem to set the world right.
I've enjoyed my short stay here. Ride safe all.
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post #33 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 5:11 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

[QUOTE=dwsdad]
Quote:
Originally Posted by CalLT
2 days ago, a guy on a Harley was cruising down 35 by New Braunfels and ran into a parked car. He was not wearing a helmet. So how does one run into a parked car, on the freeway?
It was on business 35. The old Austin Hwy. He ran into the back of a car stopped at a light. Still enough to make you go, "huh?"

I'm leaving town May 1-4. Texas State HOG Rally will be in New Braunfels this year. This, right after the huge stink the City Council created trying to quiet the noise on the river.



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post #34 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 7:39 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Quote:
Originally Posted by KIC

I do wonder if omurphy and ka0mlh even have a Beemer. Just wondering.

Anyway, state your point...don't make it personal.

Taking aside a fellow rider went down, I thought the statement: When will they learn that those bikes are for straight roads lined with bars and strip clubs?...was actually quite funny !

Movin' on to work.....
Guess I owe an apology to omurphy and ka0mlh as they do ride a BMW.

But I must restate that I don't think the original and some of the subsequent responses were uncalled for. Nothing was stated about leaving or passing a fellow rider crashed on the side of the road because of what he was riding. I haven't gotten the slightest hint of an idea that anyone I have read on this forum would not stop immediately and help ANY biker, crashed or not.

One of our own here, MotoGirl (name close I hope) just took a lot of flack and written spankings because some kid on a Harley hit her cage from behind when she was stopping. She showed some class and gave the kid a break ( read the thread).

So..harassing a Harley guy on this forum is no different than a Chevy guy harassing a Ford lover ( and they deserve it too !). Part of the fun of life.

And Remember: It's all fun and games until somebody blows a Final Drive !

Now, I have to go get on my LT and ride across town to a meeting. Such a life.

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post #35 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 8:07 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

From NHTSA, 2006: I don't know if 2007 stats are available yet but there certainly is a trend here:

Older motorcycle riders, who account for an increasingly larger proportion of all motorcyclists, now account for about half of all motorcycle rider fatalities. NHTSA data show that in 2006, 47 percent of motorcycle riders killed in crashes were age 40 or over, compared with 30 percent ten years earlier. In contrast, fatalities among young motorcycle riders have declined in the past 10 years, relative to other age groups. In 2006 fatalities in the under 30-year old group dropped to 32 percent, from 45 percent in 1996. Fatalities among motorcyclists in the 30- to 39-year old group fell to 21 percent in 2006, from 26 percent ten years earlier.

From my experience I see very few NEW motorcyclists 40 and over march into a BMW dealership and buy one as their first bike. I see TONS of these customers buying a Harley as their first bike so that they can "join the club".

I can only assume that the drop in younger rider deaths is probably due to the fact that they wear helmets more often than the older "cruiser" crowd, have vastly superior reflexes and "bounce" when they hit pavement. I know I used to....

It is truly regrettable when anyone crashes and is injured - no matter what brand they are riding.


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post #36 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 8:28 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Quote:
Originally Posted by KIC
So..harassing a Harley guy on this forum is no different than a Chevy guy harassing a Ford lover ( and they deserve it too !). Part of the fun of life.
What???!!!! Chevy sucks!



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post #37 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 8:52 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Not taking sides on the issue BUT let me pose this question ....... If YOU (on the HD Deuce) would chase YOU ( on the R-1) , who do you think would smoke who?
My point is assuming skill level is EQUAL ..... guess who wins?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fpmlt
I have a HD Deuce (and the LT). Neither my son-in-law or his friend, both on Yamaha FJRs can catch me in the mountains. I've dogged the R-1 through sweepers, only to lose ground on the straights. And I can run right with my son's Ninja 636. If you think a Harley can't handle, you don't know Harleys.
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post #38 of 55 Old Apr 22nd, 2008, 9:59 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Another Dead Harley

I would like to see what a Deuce could do to my twin...

Kind of apples to lemons if you ask me.



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post #39 of 55 Old Apr 23rd, 2008, 6:47 am
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeERideWNC
I would like to see what a Deuce could do to my twin...

Kind of apples to lemons if you ask me.


Mike I have dreams with all those toys in the garage and then she shows up and poof

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post #40 of 55 Old Apr 26th, 2008, 5:03 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Mike, you started a great thread. I think the half-cocked responses you elicited from the easily excited (or offended) is what made it so good.

"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." (Some really OLD friggin' White dude who couldn't have possibly known what he was talking about!) WARNING: Official HATE speech!
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post #41 of 55 Old Apr 26th, 2008, 5:48 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Is that a Porshe in the foreground? Is it, huh? IS IT?

I "get" the "she shows up and poof" statement. Being married "poof" happens too often. My wife would say that I wouldn't have the toys I do if it weren't for her. I'll never admit it, but she's right. Oops. No, she's not!

Boy, Mike, you sure dumped out a whole bucket full with post number 1. I found the straight roads, bars, and strip clubs statement funny, but then, you didn't hit me with that ruler. I rented an Ultra Classic last May. Still get the shakes every now and then. (Think Wile E. Coyote after taking ACME Earthquake Pills)

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post #42 of 55 Old Apr 26th, 2008, 7:05 pm Thread Starter
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Re: Another Dead Harley

The funny thing is, in Western North Carolina there are like two bars because all of the counties are dry...
And God forbid there be a strip club here in the bible belt.
That would just be wrong to see some of the gourgous mountain girls naked.
I would pay to see them.


As for the car, it is a 2000 Toyota Midship Runabout Spyder, or so I don't tax brains of all the people that I offended, it is an MR2.


I like to think that I am an equal oppertunity offender.
Being I am Polish with a totally f' d up last name --- It's pay back time.

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post #43 of 55 Old Apr 27th, 2008, 8:21 am
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Another Dead Harley

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeERideWNC
....I like to think that I am an equal opportunity offender....
Good deal! Though it appears VERY EASY to be offensive over nothing around here.

"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." (Some really OLD friggin' White dude who couldn't have possibly known what he was talking about!) WARNING: Official HATE speech!
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post #44 of 55 Old Apr 27th, 2008, 9:59 am
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Re: Another Dead Harley

A great thread to read !!!!!!!!!!

I think the point was, and is, that people crash that is a fact. I would love to see statistics on HD, Age, and Years Ridden.

I believe in my heart HD would win in the fist two, and loose big time in the last one.

When I went into riding again I bought a 600cc Yamaha cruiser, then a 1200 Sportster Custom and rode the snot out of it for two years and then bought a 05 Road Glide.

I think Harley has the attraction to "getting back into" buyers. They have a very effective advertising strategy.

With that said, I think with our crises in disposable income shrinking over the last 5 years, the demographics would point to an "older" fist time or, "back into" buyers. Of course there are younger higher income buyers but I would think they are on more "exotic" bikes.

That is why this thread was so great. It finally got around to the true meaning of discussion in open forum, INFORMATION

I can say from going from the Harley to the BMW, and MOSTLY being on this forum I have adopted ATGATT. A huge thing from no helmet and t shirt, jeans and always good riding boots for about 7 years "back into"

Also I was drilled by the experienced Harley riders on technique. There are quite a few Harley riders that do ride well, and often.

I think the #1 post was a great thought provoker, however harsh or offensive it was to some.

Also sure does look like MikeERideWNC has the toys to back up his statements on riding, and sounds like his job sees the ugly side of our Sport a LOT closer then all of us, short of the LEO's.

Again, worth every minuet to read, and worth every penny of SUPPORTING this Site

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post #45 of 55 Old Apr 27th, 2008, 11:41 am
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Talking Another Dead Harley

Quote:
Originally Posted by LAF
....I think with our crises in disposable income shrinking over the last 5 years....
I love this site because so much of what we learn has nothing to do with riding. I had no clue we had a "crises in disposable income."

Perhaps Al Gore should divert from the "climate crises?!"

"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." (Some really OLD friggin' White dude who couldn't have possibly known what he was talking about!) WARNING: Official HATE speech!
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post #46 of 55 Old Apr 27th, 2008, 6:27 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Quote:
Originally Posted by jayjacobson
I love this site because so much of what we learn has nothing to do with riding. I had no clue we had a "crises in disposable income."

Perhaps Al Gore should divert from the "climate crises?!"
Well has your income gone up to match your expenses? If so you are very lucky.

700 Harley workers loosing their jobs about 28 miles down the road in York.

And there are two to three columns of bikes in the classifieds.

While not poverty by any means I have not been able to keep pace with inflation over the last 3 years at least, and that was not always so. Therefore I have less disposable income as in none, so to me that is a crisis. When raises and investments do not counter or better inflation, that is a crises for me.

Well at least I hold the title on the LT. That should be a great hedge on inflation for me

I guess I am alone on that disposable income thing compared to you, and other members of this forum

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Re: Another Dead Harley

Quote:
Originally Posted by LAF
....700 Harley workers loosing their jobs about 28 miles down the road in York....
700 H-D workers?! WTF?! I had no idea of the depth of this crises. We do need Al Gore yesterday!

"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." (Some really OLD friggin' White dude who couldn't have possibly known what he was talking about!) WARNING: Official HATE speech!
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post #48 of 55 Old Apr 27th, 2008, 10:54 pm
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Quote:
Originally Posted by LAF
I guess I am alone on that disposable income thing compared to you, and other members of this forum
You aren't alone. My job went south 4/1. I'm still on payroll until 6/1, so we're being careful with any "extra" cash. My knee surgery of a week ago, MRI before, has bills coming in. Not something we needed. I fixed the knee, because a company I interviewed with gave me a "We want you to join our team" verbal statement. I wanted the knee to be fixed prior to starting work, which I hoped would be pretty quickly. A week and a half later and "We're waiting on HR to process the offer letters, but we want you on our team, so don't leave us." I'm depending on what I've been told and hope they are straight up. I have no reason to believe otherwise, just my own self-doubts. It would be nice to start a new job and have doubles coming in for as long as possible.

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post #49 of 55 Old Apr 28th, 2008, 7:04 am Thread Starter
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Re: Another Dead Harley

I don't think that I have met a BMW rider who think he has disposable income.

The beemer riders that I know and ride with are all cheap bastards, including my self.

Think about it...
Almost everyone on this site is a "Do it yourselfer."
We buy our parts from the cheapest online retailer.
We don't spend thousands of dollars on crome or as the sportbiker, carbon fiber.

We are just plain frugal.
Besides, we must bank our money so we have it when our final drive fails.

As for the Harley workers loosing their jobs, you could see that coming many years ago. I would have thought it sooner than now.
Face it they have had a good run.
They could have done better if they would have hired non-union employees.

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post #50 of 55 Old Apr 28th, 2008, 7:23 am
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Re: Another Dead Harley

Not here for a pissing match.

I paid a complement to your though provoking thread.

I agree on your assessment of training and education for riders no matter what they ride.

I did not want to digress to economics or any other of this bull crap.

So lets just leave it at that.

I get so sick of this crap, some smart ass just taking one part of a large post and then just pissing away at it.

And I can tell you are hurting real bad, and are frugal, with a garage full of toys like yours

Enough allready..........

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeERideWNC
I don't think that I have met a BMW rider who think he has disposable income.

The beemer riders that I know and ride with are all cheap bastards, including my self.

Think about it...
Almost everyone on this site is a "Do it yourselfer."
We buy our parts from the cheapest online retailer.
We don't spend thousands of dollars on crome or as the sportbiker, carbon fiber.

We are just plain frugal.
Besides, we must bank our money so we have it when our final drive fails.

As for the Harley workers loosing their jobs, you could see that coming many years ago. I would have thought it sooner than now.
Face it they have had a good run.
They could have done better if they would have hired non-union employees.

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