Payload capacities of New BMW bikes - BMW Luxury Touring Community
 
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post #1 of 23 Old Dec 11th, 2006, 10:01 am Thread Starter
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Payload capacities of New BMW bikes

In looking over the specs for new bikes from their site, BMW is now making very readily available the weights of the new bikes. It is useful and refreshing that they use the "unladen" weight that includes fuel or "wet". The maximum permissible weight (GVW?) is also given in the sales specs. Great...you don't have to delve into the bowels of the manual to find them anymore. Here's a sample:

Bike--------Max perm.-----------Unladen--------- Payload

LT ---------1322-----------------835 ------------487
GS Adv. ----1025-----------------564-------------461
800ST-------884------------------412-------------472

I believe that all of them are excellent, but the GS Adv. is probably going to be the one that will be carrying the largest load, and out of this selection has the lowest payload. With the excellent brakes of the BMW's, it would seem that they have a payload capacity that won't affect the braking or handling all that much. The 800 ST is especially impressive, since it only weighs 412 lbs. wet. Good deal. Haven't compared other brands, but have a hunch they wouldn't fare as well, based of experience.

Pete Jessen
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post #2 of 23 Old Dec 11th, 2006, 10:25 am
 
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How does BMW, or Yamaha, or any manufacturer come up with these specs? And are there any standards for producing these numbers?
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post #3 of 23 Old Dec 11th, 2006, 12:11 pm Thread Starter
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I know of no mfr that puts up a GVW except in the manual, and all others use "dry" weight, which is always without fuel, and in a couple cases, empty of all fluids. Not very useful. I know of no standard in the industry. I believe there should be more attention paid to payload, and that riders should calculate what they are stacking on their bike...it really does affect handling and braking. Without full info, you can't do it.

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post #4 of 23 Old Dec 11th, 2006, 5:31 pm
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and I'm assuming that all the options we put on our bikes (lights, pegs, electronics, tattoo parlor bumperstickers (Uncle Rock), etc.) are included in the "Payload" category, thus reducing the remaining weight of rider, passenger, and other 'stuff' that can be carried.

Howard Schisler
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2009 BMW K1200LT - 60k miles
2012 BMW F650GS (sold)
2005 BMW K1200LT - "Gray Ghost", traded at 120k miles
2005 Honda Shadow 650 (sold)
AMA, IBA, BMW MOA. CCRs: Braselton 2006, Osage Beach 2007, Duluth 2012


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post #5 of 23 Old Dec 11th, 2006, 8:07 pm
 
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"Haven't compared other brands, but have a hunch they wouldn't fare as well, based of experience."

My point is; who governs or regulates what "max payload" is? Seems to me like BMW can slap any number they want on there...yes? No? Why not? The fact that BMW allows the LT to have a payload of 487 pounds proves my point. Those OEM shocks SUCK to high heaven, and we all know it. But BMW tells you that you can load the LT that heavy, because they know anything less would be unacceptable.

The only spec that EVER is important to me is wet weight. And that's only for the sake of comparing bikes, and putting them in categories according to their respective wet weights.
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post #6 of 23 Old Dec 11th, 2006, 9:51 pm
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There are these guys called engineers, whose job it is to figure all this stuff out. Honest.

But who weighs their bike before riding? I figure the specs are about as useful as published specs on horsepower ratings.

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Some people see the gas tank as half empty. Some see it as half full. All I care is that I know where the next tankful is coming from...
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post #7 of 23 Old Dec 11th, 2006, 9:57 pm
 
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Originally Posted by meese
There are these guys called engineers, whose job it is to figure all this stuff out. Honest.
But let's not forget the guys upstairs in marketing.
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post #8 of 23 Old Dec 11th, 2006, 10:04 pm
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Trust me, I've been fighting with Marketing and Sales for years. "You promised what?!" Dilbert isn't so funny when you have to live it every day.

Ken
Pacific NorthWet
'13 Dark Graphite Metallic K16GTLD, 24K miles
'09 Magnesium Beige Metallic K13GT, 63K miles
'03 Anthracite Metallic K12LTC, 66K miles
'02 Mauve Metallic K12LTC, 106K miles and sold
BMWLT#143, IBA# 366, MOA# 111996, SCMA# 24032


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Some people see the gas tank as half empty. Some see it as half full. All I care is that I know where the next tankful is coming from...
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post #9 of 23 Old Dec 11th, 2006, 10:14 pm
 
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Hijack? I don't think so...

Quote:
Originally Posted by meese
Trust me, I've been fighting with Marketing and Sales for years. "You promised what?!" Dilbert isn't so funny when you have to live it every day.
Though our conversation in this thread may seem like a hijack, it has brought this whole topic full circle. Regarding specs like "payload capacity", they mean very little. There's no tool to measure how much an LT can truly carry, verses how much a Gold Wing can. It's all left to the engineers, and the guys in sales, and marketing, and, and, and...
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post #10 of 23 Old Dec 11th, 2006, 10:28 pm
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I don't think sales guys get to determine the specs after the bike is built. Those numbers are left to engineers who probably use Finite Element Analysis methods. However, I wouldn't be surpised to find out that sales has an input on dimensions on the front-end process.

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post #11 of 23 Old Dec 11th, 2006, 10:48 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by messenger13
"Haven't compared other brands, but have a hunch they wouldn't fare as well, based of experience."

My point is; who governs or regulates what "max payload" is? Seems to me like BMW can slap any number they want on there...yes? No? Why not? The fact that BMW allows the LT to have a payload of 487 pounds proves my point. Those OEM shocks SUCK to high heaven, and we all know it. But BMW tells you that you can load the LT that heavy, because they know anything less would be unacceptable.

The only spec that EVER is important to me is wet weight. And that's only for the sake of comparing bikes, and putting them in categories according to their respective wet weights.



Those of you who do not labor under the attainment of 'THE GOOD LIFE' might not have any reason to even think about GVW or max payload.

Me? It is one of the 1st things I need to look at when considering a bike. There are too many bikes out there with specifications that do not allow me to ride them, one-up! For many of the smaller bikes, I outweigh the bike!

Max payload, and thus GVWR, is concerned with the ability of the transmission to get the bike going, the brakes to stop the bike, the tires to keep the bike off the rims, the suspension to keep it handling properly, the engine to enable acceptable mobility, the frame to deal with flex, etc, etc.

Is there a standard? I don't know.

Are the numbers absolute? I doubt it. The lawyers wouldn't accept that!

Are the numbers useful for bike-to-bike comparisons? I presume so. In fact, I would suggest that is the ONLY valid comparison. I would not consider a bike with a 275 # payload if I expected to use it for 2-up riding. I would think long and hard for solo riding, too, unless I lost a lot of weight!

You got to ask yourself one question. Do you feel like filing a lawsuit if the bike can't handle the pressure? Well, do ya', lightweight?

Jay Slomka
Johnson City, TN

Y2K LT Champagne Class Act


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post #12 of 23 Old Dec 12th, 2006, 1:38 pm
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Payload

I would imagine that if you exceeded the gvw, it would void your insurance in the event of an accident. There are very few places where you could weigh your bike prior to a trip. 487lbs doesn't sound that much once you subtract an average sized rider and pillion, and a few accessories.


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post #13 of 23 Old Dec 12th, 2006, 1:46 pm
 
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Question

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I would imagine that if you exceeded the gvw, it would void your insurance in the event of an accident.
When's the last time you've heard of an insurance company weighing you, your passenger, and all of the other payload after an accident?
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post #14 of 23 Old Dec 12th, 2006, 3:41 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by messenger13
When's the last time you've heard of an insurance company weighing you, your passenger, and all of the other payload after an accident?
The fact that did not do it YET doesn't mean they are not going to sometime.
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post #15 of 23 Old Dec 12th, 2006, 4:02 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by axamax
I would imagine that if you exceeded the gvw, it would void your insurance in the event of an accident. There are very few places where you could weigh your bike prior to a trip. 487lbs doesn't sound that much once you subtract an average sized rider and pillion, and a few accessories.
Well let's see... I about 210 Lbs all geared up, Kathy does not reach 135 Lbs all geared up... Cool! I can still load up the bike with 142 Lbs of luggage!!!
Trying to keep the COG as low as possible!!!
Oh wait!!! We just had coffee and a bagel. Better adjust these numbers again!

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post #16 of 23 Old Dec 12th, 2006, 5:07 pm
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Payload

I weigh in at around 230lb, my other passenger around 170. Add an 18lb tent (just weighed it) that's 418lb. Luggage capacityleft is 69lbs. Or 34.5lbs each.

At 230lb I'm sure I'm not the heaviest rider on this board. Without upsetting your other half what are other members remaining luggage allowances?


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post #17 of 23 Old Dec 12th, 2006, 5:14 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by axamax
I weigh in at around 230lb, my other passenger around 170. Add an 18lb tent (just weighed it) that's 418lb. Luggage capacityleft is 69lbs. Or 34.5lbs each.

At 230lb I'm sure I'm not the heaviest rider on this board. Without upsetting your other half what are other members remaining luggage allowances?




I'll only say that I, alone, am 320. My riding jacket is near 25 more. Should I go on???

Jay Slomka
Johnson City, TN

Y2K LT Champagne Class Act


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post #18 of 23 Old Dec 12th, 2006, 5:20 pm
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For up to a 4-day trip I have the trunk and both cases loaded (we use RKA side and trunk bags), although mostly clothes which is not really heavy. We don't camp, so all we need is riding gear and plastic to pay for the motel/hotel. I don't see a trailer in my future, and rarely do I use the cute luggage rack on the top of the trunk. For longer trips, such as CCR, I'd probably ship some stuff ahead and ship back our dirty laundry.
I have the fortune of having a better half who packs light...!

Gilles & Kathy
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2011 Ostra Gray RT
06 Mercedes-Benz E350 Estate (parts and people hauler)
2012 BMW X3 (parts and people hauler)
86 Porsche 911 Cabriolet (my "new" baby)



For her I climbed the highest mountain!
For her I swam across the deepest ocean!
For her I walked through the largest desert!
And then she left me... She said I was never home!!!


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post #19 of 23 Old Dec 12th, 2006, 9:03 pm
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payload

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Originally Posted by jayz9705
I'll only say that I, alone, am 320. My riding jacket is near 25 more. Should I go on???
I hope you travel light and your other half is a match for twiggy.


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post #20 of 23 Old Dec 30th, 2006, 4:52 pm
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I was reading a thread about the GW1800 breaking the frames and not just main frame now it's the rear sub frame that the bags and seats mount on. They were talking about a how much the average rider and passenger weighs plus luggage and then showed a picture of the rear sub frame and where the cracks are appearing. Just because these bikes are big doesn't mean you can load them without thinking about what is supporting the weight. Rear frame on the LT is much stronger looking than the GW but GVW is all about the weakest link in the system be it the frame, brakes or tire loads we all need to pay attention to how much and where we place the loads.

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post #21 of 23 Old Dec 30th, 2006, 11:31 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jayz9705
....You got to ask yourself one question. Do you feel like filing a lawsuit if the bike can't handle the pressure? Well, do ya', lightweight?
Well, in all the excitement, I can't quite remember. Was it 500, or 600 pounds? Seeing how this bike tipping over could squash you like a grape, you have to ask yourself: are you feeing lucky punk--well are ya'?!

"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." (Some really OLD friggin' White dude who couldn't have possibly known what he was talking about!) WARNING: Official HATE speech!
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post #22 of 23 Old Jan 2nd, 2007, 12:15 am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by axamax
I hope you travel light and your other half is a match for twiggy.


Yeah, riiiight! What you said!!!

Jay Slomka
Johnson City, TN

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post #23 of 23 Old Mar 13th, 2012, 8:01 pm
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Re: Payload capacities of New BMW bikes

A word on specs, not to throw gasoline on a fire but here goes. The load rating for the "other" Metzler M880 (not Reinforced) fits the LT. However, when you ask Metzler to explain why that tire is not fit for the LT you get a lot of "not supposed to be within 80% of max load". I would suspect that push came to shove, the bike OEM's would adopt a similar stance.
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