Dyno #s - BMW Luxury Touring Community
 
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post #1 of 20 Old Jul 29th, 2006, 6:20 pm Thread Starter
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Dyno #s

Buddy of mine has a dyno in his garage. So here is what the blue ox made. Did not use the gas analyzer because it did not fit in the pipe.
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Jim
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post #2 of 20 Old Jul 29th, 2006, 7:09 pm
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Would love to be able to see it more clearly.. a little fuzzy...at least on my system.. I expect others can probably see it better..

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post #3 of 20 Old Jul 29th, 2006, 8:03 pm
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looks like 90 hp ?
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post #4 of 20 Old Jul 29th, 2006, 8:19 pm
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Here's the dyno run Rhinewest did on my '99 after installing their chip.


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'99K1200LT - "Bertha" - gone, but not forgotten!
'86 Concours - "Horse with no name" (under reconstructive surgery)
'06 K1200GT - "Road Rocket"
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post #5 of 20 Old Jul 30th, 2006, 7:40 am Thread Starter
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Sorry... I'm not that good with photo Shop yet.

Fist pull was 87.4 @ 5944 rpm, 2nd 89.5 @ 5904 rpm, and the last was 90.9 @ 5953 rpm.

Torque was 83 @ 4765, 85 @ 4724, and 86 @ 4701 respectively.

Temp in the dyno room was 88F and about 70% humidity.

Bike is a bone stock '02.

Jim
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post #6 of 20 Old Jul 30th, 2006, 3:50 pm
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We have a sweet spot

Looks like approx 5200rpm is the intersection of the HP and torque curves - let the shifting begin!
post #7 of 20 Old Jul 30th, 2006, 4:08 pm
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dwsdad
Here's the dyno run Rhinewest did on my '99 after installing their chip.
Broken link Doug. Of course, I would expect that RW's charts would show some improvement after installing their own product.


Quote:
Originally Posted by NM99K12LT
Looks like approx 5200rpm is the intersection of the HP and torque curves - let the shifting begin!
Um...5252 is (almost) always the intersection of torque and HP. That gives no indication of when to shift at all, IMHO. Unless one is afraid of ponies, that is.
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post #8 of 20 Old Jul 30th, 2006, 10:50 pm
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5252 it is; what is the exception, other than mispublished charts on some sites or uncorrected charts? 5252 is the constant in the equation that converts torque values into horsepower. Dyno charts should always cross at 5252 RPM, since this is where the constant and the RPM number cancel each other out, leaving HP=Torque.

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post #9 of 20 Old Jul 31st, 2006, 2:57 am
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shogun54
5252 it is; what is the exception, other than mispublished charts on some sites or uncorrected charts? 5252 is the constant in the equation that converts torque values into horsepower. Dyno charts should always cross at 5252 RPM, since this is where the constant and the RPM number cancel each other out, leaving HP=Torque.
I thought that 5252 was a constant...but I have seen a few dyno charts in reputable rags that showed a slightly different value. Though this confused me, I figured there was something that I didn't know. Perhaps you, or someone else could shed some light on the subject. I guess I was never curious enough to Google it and find out...
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post #10 of 20 Old Jul 31st, 2006, 9:50 am
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Google search = humble pie

I did a google search after having this same thing pointed out to me by David Shealey on another thread - an enlightening experience to say the least. I had never bothered to research this - 5252 is a mathematical constant and I am once again impressed by the seemingly endless bounty of knowledge available on this forum.
post #11 of 20 Old Jul 31st, 2006, 12:05 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by messenger13
I thought that 5252 was a constant...but I have seen a few dyno charts in reputable rags that showed a slightly different value. Though this confused me, I figured there was something that I didn't know. Perhaps you, or someone else could shed some light on the subject. I guess I was never curious enough to Google it and find out...
I have seen a couple of dyno charts in magazines which seemingly defied this, but if you see one look at it carefully. You will find that they have not conformed to the "normal" way of doing these, with the horsepower and torque in ft/pounds using the the same number scale to the left, with RPM at the bottom. I have seen a couple that had horsepower on one scale, torque on a different one, either on the left side parallel to the hp numbers, or even on the right side, and not lined up the same. Those are not "normal" though.

Also, there have been some done in other countries that use different values altogether, such as KW for power, and Kg/M or other metric torque measurement for torque, on these all bets are off!

I don't want to achieve immortality through my work...I want to achieve it through not dying.

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EX: '01 Black LT, BAT BYKE (Totaled at 110,000 miles)
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post #12 of 20 Old Aug 1st, 2006, 7:28 pm
 
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Question

What about the engines where the redline is well below 5252, specifically some diesel's and both torque and hp starts to drop say at 4000? Will the lines still intersect if the engine was revved to the 5252 point (momentarilly, if possible, etc.)?
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post #13 of 20 Old Aug 1st, 2006, 10:19 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mantan
What about the engines where the redline is well below 5252, specifically some diesel's and both torque and hp starts to drop say at 4000? Will the lines still intersect if the engine was revved to the 5252 point (momentarilly, if possible, etc.)?
If the engine can get to 5252, yes the lines would intersect. That is why I said that large, slow engines will not have torque/hp charts with intersecting lines.

However, on some charts they make two vertical scales, one for torque, one for HP, and they are not numerically aligned, so the lines may intersect, but that is not the norm for torque/hp charts.

I don't want to achieve immortality through my work...I want to achieve it through not dying.

David Shealey
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EX: '01 Black LT, BAT BYKE (Totaled at 110,000 miles)
IBA SS, BB, BBG, 10/10ths.
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post #14 of 20 Old Aug 2nd, 2006, 10:17 am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dshealey
I have seen a couple of dyno charts in magazines which seemingly defied this, but if you see one look at it carefully. You will find that they have not conformed to the "normal" way of doing these, with the horsepower and torque in ft/pounds using the the same number scale to the left, with RPM at the bottom. I have seen a couple that had horsepower on one scale, torque on a different one, either on the left side parallel to the hp numbers, or even on the right side, and not lined up the same. Those are not "normal" though.
I was at the Honda dealer the other day waiting for my wife's CR-V, and picked up a brochure for a Ridgeline. The HP vs torque chart caught my eye as the lines cross at 3200. !?! Assuming these charts are re-arranged to make HP figures appear to soar, I replotted the lines when I got home. Sure enough even on these phonied up charts, if you plug the numbers into the formula (Torque x Engine speed / 5,252 = Horsepower) the values at 5252 are the same albeit on different plot lines. And as expected the redrawn HP line doesn't *look* as impressive as the published one with its 247 HP way up at the top of the scale and the 245 lb-ft in the middle.

What did P.T. Barnum say, a truck shopper's born every minute?

Motor On ,/'


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post #15 of 20 Old Aug 2nd, 2006, 10:52 am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NM99K12LT
I did a google search after having this same thing pointed out to me by David Shealey on another thread - an enlightening experience to say the least. I had never bothered to research this - 5252 is a mathematical constant and I am once again impressed by the seemingly endless bounty of knowledge available on this forum.

I'm convinced that David could (should) have his own web site: "Ask David" comes to mind. Got a question about how a stapler works? Ask David. Need to know how to fix your nuclear reactor? David knows. Looking for a source for that valve bucket on your LT? David can tell you where to get it and what it's used for, along with its relationship to any other piece of the LT.

I don't know if David is retired or not, but I think venture capitalists would jump at the chance to set him up on a web site that charged $5 per question.

Howard Schisler
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post #16 of 20 Old Aug 2nd, 2006, 11:06 am
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Ditto
post #17 of 20 Old Aug 2nd, 2006, 11:19 am
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It is better to make torque at high rpm

After "researching" the net to hopefully eradicate my ignorance of this subject matter - which was graciously pointed out to me by David and Joe - I came upon this: http://vettenet.org/torquehp.html

3 things:

1. It appears we are indeed fortunate to possess an engine in the LT which produces torque at higher rpm as this is apparently optimal. I will not dare utter a conclusion as to wether this validates the "shift at higher rpm" camp as that is best left to David's analysis, insight, etc.

2. Shift at higher rpms

3. Wait for David's reply
post #18 of 20 Old Aug 2nd, 2006, 5:27 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NM99K12LT
After "researching" the net to hopefully eradicate my ignorance of this subject matter - which was graciously pointed out to me by David and Joe - I came upon this: http://vettenet.org/torquehp.html

3 things:

1. It appears we are indeed fortunate to possess an engine in the LT which produces torque at higher rpm as this is apparently optimal. I will not dare utter a conclusion as to wether this validates the "shift at higher rpm" camp as that is best left to David's analysis, insight, etc.

2. Shift at higher rpms

3. Wait for David's reply
That is a fairly decent article, and pretty much in line with most of what I have read, and experienced over the years. I was involved in drag racing WAY back in the early 1960s where I first started studying engine performance.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with someone cruising around all the time on an LT never reaching over 4K RPM, except likely carbonization in the cylinders, possible reduced life of the catalytic converter,and as I said before, full throttle in the 3K-4K range, where the combustion pressures are high but low crank bearing speeds are low, the bearing surfaces may be damaged much earlier than on an engine that spends it's high throttle time at 4000 and above. Your bike, your choice.

That person just is not riding like what I think a larger percentage of us do, and if he should be found riding with a group of other LT riders in the twisties at any time and the going got even a little spirited, he would have to forget the low RPM riding, or forgo keeping up with the group at all. An LT ridden between 2500-4000 RPM has no hope of staying anywhere within sight of one ridden between 4000-7500. In 10 minutes, he will never see the group again unless they stop and wait somewhere.

I don't want to achieve immortality through my work...I want to achieve it through not dying.

David Shealey
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EX: '01 Black LT, BAT BYKE (Totaled at 110,000 miles)
IBA SS, BB, BBG, 10/10ths.
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post #19 of 20 Old Aug 2nd, 2006, 6:53 pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hschisler
I don't know if David is retired or not, but I think venture capitalists would jump at the chance to set him up on a web site that charged $5 per question.
as long as it's after I get all my questions answered....
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post #20 of 20 Old Aug 3rd, 2006, 2:19 am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dshealey
An LT ridden between 2500-4000 RPM has no hope of staying anywhere within sight of one ridden between 4000-7500. In 10 minutes, he will never see the group again unless they stop and wait somewhere.
BTDT, and eventually they caught up as I relaxed in a nice, shady spot.

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Some people see the gas tank as half empty. Some see it as half full. All I care is that I know where the next tankful is coming from...
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