How does Gear Shift Assist work? - BMW Luxury Touring Community
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post #1 of 82 Old Mar 28th, 2014, 7:49 am Thread Starter
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How does Gear Shift Assist work?

Just curious about this new feature -

The BMW Gear Shift Assistant Pro, available as a factory option, ... It enables upshifts and downshifts to be made without operation of the clutch or throttle valve in the proper load and rpm speed ranges while riding.

Does this mean you can tap up/down if you're within a RPM range? What happens outside of the range? Almost sounds like paddle shifters on a car.

Thanks.


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post #2 of 82 Old Mar 28th, 2014, 8:26 am
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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Originally Posted by Gruivis View Post
Just curious about this new feature -

The BMW Gear Shift Assistant Pro, available as a factory option, ... It enables upshifts and downshifts to be made without operation of the clutch or throttle valve in the proper load and rpm speed ranges while riding.

Does this mean you can tap up/down if you're within a RPM range? What happens outside of the range? Almost sounds like paddle shifters on a car.

Thanks.
There have been a few posts about this but here is my opinion.

I have used it a lot but it takes some learning to get it right. Iím not sure what ďoutside of the rangeĒ means because I havenít tried all RPM ranges Ė Iím a little afraid to try it at really high RPMs but will soon. 1st to 2nd will give you a kick, 2nd to 3rd a little smoother. All other changes seem spot on. It seems to work smoother on more throttle position and higher RPMs. I also use it quite extensively on downshifts and it works great. Just donít use any throttle on downshifts. Iím really enjoying it Ė it just takes time to get it right but itís a blast. I only have 900 miles now but will add lots soon.
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post #3 of 82 Old Mar 28th, 2014, 12:43 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

A quick shifter cuts the ignition for a millisecond to allow a clutchless upshift; pretty simple stuff and always works better when you're on the gas with increasing rpms.

What I'm not clear on is what the BMW system does on downshifts other than rev matching, i.e., what, if anything, it does with the clutch automatically. I haven't a clue, but I assume it's doing something.

Personally, I love quick shifters on the upshift, but don't really have any interest in clutchless downshifts, so I doubt I'll ever use my gear assist in that way.
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post #4 of 82 Old Mar 28th, 2014, 1:43 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

Oh, but you will! Smooth as a smelt on the downshifts. Significantly smoother than using the clutch. Truely appreciated by a passanger when two-up. My problem will be riding my other bikes. This one is making me lazy.
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post #5 of 82 Old Mar 28th, 2014, 1:49 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

I loooooove the downshift as well, reminds me of my BMW 3 series SMG transmission from a few years back.

Also clicking around between 4-5-6 at speed could not be smoother, it is easy to get lazy.

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post #6 of 82 Old Mar 28th, 2014, 3:15 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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Originally Posted by nbtstatic View Post
I loooooove the downshift as well, reminds me of my BMW 3 series SMG transmission from a few years back.

Also clicking around between 4-5-6 at speed could not be smoother, it is easy to get lazy.

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post #7 of 82 Old Mar 28th, 2014, 3:43 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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Originally Posted by CaptainB View Post
Oh, but you will! Smooth as a smelt on the downshifts. Significantly smoother than using the clutch. Truely appreciated by a passanger when two-up. My problem will be riding my other bikes. This one is making me lazy.
For me it's about the visceral feel of doing it manually. It's one of the joys of riding for me, and I enjoy the challenge of rev matching. Been doing it so long, it would be hard to change.

Same as paddle shifters in a car, I really don't care much for them, regardless of how smooth they are. I much prefer to row through the gears manually. The only time I really use a quick shifter is when I'm trying to maximize acceleration and don't want to chop manually to do a clutchless upshift.
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post #8 of 82 Old Mar 28th, 2014, 4:58 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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Originally Posted by ArchimedesRT View Post
For me it's about the visceral feel of doing it manually. It's one of the joys of riding for me, and I enjoy the challenge of rev matching. Been doing it so long, it would be hard to change.

Same as paddle shifters in a car, I really don't care much for them, regardless of how smooth they are. I much prefer to row through the gears manually. The only time I really use a quick shifter is when I'm trying to maximize acceleration and don't want to chop manually to do a clutchless upshift.
I am still waiting for my RT but have had a quick shifter on my K1300S for the last two years. I also thought I wouldn't use it as I enjoy the clutch and shifting, but after a few rides you learn when to shift with just the right throttle settings and it's like butter, super fast and smooth. Now I never use the clutch and love the upshifts. It can be very jarring if you shift at the wrong moment though. It takes some getting used to but is wonderful once you get the timing right.
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post #9 of 82 Old Mar 28th, 2014, 6:02 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

How do you activate or deactivate the feature? Assuming a button or switch. Then, what if you forget whether it's on or off? Sorry, but I haven't seen one in a showroom yet, and couldn't find anything on the BMW web site.

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post #10 of 82 Old Mar 28th, 2014, 6:39 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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Originally Posted by ShooterSteve View Post
I am still waiting for my RT but have had a quick shifter on my K1300S for the last two years. I also thought I wouldn't use it as I enjoy the clutch and shifting, but after a few rides you learn when to shift with just the right throttle settings and it's like butter, super fast and smooth. Now I never use the clutch and love the upshifts. It can be very jarring if you shift at the wrong moment though. It takes some getting used to but is wonderful once you get the timing right.
I've had quick shifters on multiple bikes for years and have them on all three bikes I own at the moment. Love them, in the right situation, but I don't use them a ton.
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post #11 of 82 Old Mar 28th, 2014, 6:39 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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How do you activate or deactivate the feature? Assuming a button or switch. Then, what if you forget whether it's on or off? Sorry, but I haven't seen one in a showroom yet, and couldn't find anything on the BMW web site.
You don't. You just either use the clutch or don't. It doesn't do anything if you use the clutch.
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post #12 of 82 Old Mar 28th, 2014, 7:25 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

Any modern sport bike will do clutchless up shifts if you unload the throttle just a bit before you shift. At the track it is a poor man's quick shifter.

I'm on the fence about our BMWs system though. Love it on the down shifts, they have that well sorted. It's clunky on any thing below 3 to 4 on the up shifts.

I do love the hill assist. Not as it sold...I use it like a parking brake when I want to have both feet on the ground and use my hands. I pull to release it before I take off.
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post #13 of 82 Old Mar 28th, 2014, 8:20 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

Advantages:
  • 70-80% of all shifts based on riding condition can be executed without using the clutch.
  • Gear changes are still performed as normal by the foot lever. The Gear Shift Assistant Pro only assists the actual gear change operation. The rider remains responsible for actually shifting the gears. This is not an automatic or semi-automatic transmission.
Notes:
  • No assist for gearshifts is provided under the following conditions:
    • Shifting with the clutch disengaged
    • Upshifts with the throttle closed (coasting) or when decelerating
    • The shift lever is not in its neutral position before starting a shift
    • The system supports downshifts with an open throttle, but the shift quality is influenced by sudden or jerky throttle-on and throttle-off changes in lower gears
    • Shifts performed without disengaging the clutch in low gears at high engine RPM’s may be accompanied by substantial torque reaction during power transitions. BMW Motorrad recommends that the clutch is used to perform shifts under these operating conditions. Riders should avoid using the Gear Shift Assistant Pro at engine RPM’s approaching the engine’s rev limit.
  • To ensure safety, cruise control is automatically deactivated during gear changes with the Gear Shift Assistant Pro.
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post #14 of 82 Old Mar 28th, 2014, 9:23 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

Hello all

As others have said, the Quickshifter only works in a specific rev/load range.

3-4-5-6 is best, and the bike has to be under load - i.e. throttle open, accelerating.

I really enjoyed it - you don't use it all the time, but it is a lot of fun. It works surprisingly well on a boxer.

The downshifter works best on a closed throttle.

I also liked the hill assist - I thought I would hate it, but it is surprisingly useful.

The quickshifter on the S1000R is even better - it works smoothly with no load.

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post #15 of 82 Old Mar 28th, 2014, 10:49 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

The manual says that the throttle has to be held steady, not accelerating. I have tried both and the manual's way works best.

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post #16 of 82 Old Mar 28th, 2014, 11:07 pm Thread Starter
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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Originally Posted by Corvallis View Post
The manual says that the throttle has to be held steady, not accelerating. I have tried both and the manual's way works best.
Does the manual indicate the preferred shift range?

Sounds like a very useful feature. Will be nice to see that plus the Keyless Ride available on other K bikes.


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post #17 of 82 Old Mar 28th, 2014, 11:51 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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Originally Posted by Gruivis View Post
Does the manual indicate the preferred shift range?

Sounds like a very useful feature. Will be nice to see that plus the Keyless Ride available on other K bikes.
No. You have to use trial and error. Do it when you would do it using the clutch, except if you shift 2nd to third do it in lower rpm.

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post #18 of 82 Old Mar 29th, 2014, 5:57 am
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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Originally Posted by Corvallis View Post
No. You have to use trial and error. Do it when you would do it using the clutch, except if you shift 2nd to third do it in lower rpm.
Anybody seen the symbol to the right hand side of the gear indication that shows up? It's sort of an "UP" arrow.
I am wondering if that is to indicate that you are in the correct rev range to change gear.
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post #19 of 82 Old Mar 29th, 2014, 2:04 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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Anybody seen the symbol to the right hand side of the gear indication that shows up? It's sort of an "UP" arrow.
I am wondering if that is to indicate that you are in the correct rev range to change gear.
It is a prompt telling you to shift up. You can turn this off or on through the setup menu. I note that it comes on around 2500 rpm in low gears. That means that the RT says you can shift at this rpm. For that reason I judge it to be optimized around gas mileage, rather than performance. It will have you in 6th gear before 40 mph. There is no equivalent prompt for downshifting.

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post #20 of 82 Old Mar 29th, 2014, 5:03 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

Thanks Corvallis
That was the impression I got. Funny that the bike manual has no mention of it.

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post #21 of 82 Old Mar 29th, 2014, 5:11 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

There's a manual?

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post #22 of 82 Old Jul 15th, 2016, 12:22 am
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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There's a manual?
Whats a manual???

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post #23 of 82 Old Jul 15th, 2016, 8:27 am
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

I don't know, how does it work?

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post #24 of 82 Old Jul 15th, 2016, 12:04 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Corvallis View Post
It is a prompt telling you to shift up. You can turn this off or on through the setup menu. I note that it comes on around 2500 rpm in low gears. That means that the RT says you can shift at this rpm. For that reason I judge it to be optimized around gas mileage, rather than performance. It will have you in 6th gear before 40 mph. There is no equivalent prompt for downshifting.
I don't have a WLC but my friend has a S1000XR with that shift prompt.

On his bike, it is user adjustable to whathever RPM you want it to come on.

I don't know if it's the same on the RT

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post #25 of 82 Old Jul 15th, 2016, 1:47 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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I don't know, how does it work?
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post #26 of 82 Old Jul 16th, 2016, 7:41 am
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

I ordered a '16 w/o Shift Assist Pro and turns out is quite effective to upshift w/o the clutch and without Shift Assist Pro. Shifts are ultra fast and smooth--I accidentally discovered this when I had preloaded the shifter a little to much and twisted the throttle off w/ nary a hitch. I've don't it several times since then, but frankly doesn't add anything to my ride experience, quality, etc. The fact also remains the bike has enough range in 3-4-5-6 there's not much need to quick shift. I thought briefly about paying the $$ to add the feature but don't see much use for it. I ordered my RT primarily w/o that feature, the audio system, and the central locking feature and save a couple grand which went towards Nav V and side case liners and the right sided lockable cubby.

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post #27 of 82 Old Jul 18th, 2016, 3:56 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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Originally Posted by NoelCP View Post
I ordered a '16 w/o Shift Assist Pro and turns out is quite effective to upshift w/o the clutch and without Shift Assist Pro. Shifts are ultra fast and smooth--I accidentally discovered this when I had preloaded the shifter a little to much and twisted the throttle off w/ nary a hitch. I've don't it several times since then, but frankly doesn't add anything to my ride experience, quality, etc. The fact also remains the bike has enough range in 3-4-5-6 there's not much need to quick shift. I thought briefly about paying the $$ to add the feature but don't see much use for it. I ordered my RT primarily w/o that feature, the audio system, and the central locking feature and save a couple grand which went towards Nav V and side case liners and the right sided lockable cubby.
Well since you don't have shift assist you have no idea what you're missing. With shift assist you should be accelerating to up shift, and you can accelerate hard. It's quite exhilarating to take off from a dead stop and just keep shifting while rolling on the throttle. No way will you be able to shift that fast without shift assist pro.

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post #28 of 82 Old Jul 18th, 2016, 7:12 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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No way will you be able to shift that fast without shift assist pro.
Really, have you tried it w/o shift assist, but with clutchless? I read somewhere you needed to quickly back off the throttle fully before resuming hard acceleration in order for SA to work--not so you're saying? Also, w/o shift assist w/ the method I described, you absolute need to be accelerating and hard is fine, then it's a rapid full off-throttle, no clutch pull, and you're right back at hard acceleration up to the next shift, w/o shift assist. I don't know if shift assist is a feature you can disable, but if it is try doing what I'm talking about. I get the sense is only a software change that is required, but that is just a sense as I"m not sure. Shockingly smooth and fast clutchless upshifting, in fact arguably it can be smoother than carefully done clutched shifting. The only thing that holds me back on this is not knowing if I can potentially do harm doing it. As I say it's very smooth and ultra quick and doesn't seem to feel like it's stressing anything. It's happened by accident on a downshift, but that seemed a bit jerky as revs weren't high enough, so I haven't played w/ it for downshifting.

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post #29 of 82 Old Jul 19th, 2016, 2:28 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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I read somewhere you needed to quickly back off the throttle fully before resuming hard acceleration in order for SA to work--not so you're saying?
That's incorrect.

Yes really, you stay on the throttle for up shift, off the throttle for downshift.

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post #30 of 82 Old Dec 4th, 2016, 2:45 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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That's incorrect.

Yes really, you stay on the throttle for up shift, off the throttle for downshift.
I agree with above statement. On the throttle for upshift and closed throttle for down shift. I use it about 50% of the time. I find upshifting below 3k RPM works best with clutch lever pulled not using shift assist . Above that I like to upshift around 4 - 5 KRPM. It is a great feel upshifting around 8 KRPM though.
What I am noticing is I am wearing a bald spot on the top of my left boot.
Downshifting with throttle closed causes a slight throttle blip. Upshifting kills the ignition to unload the gear train and allow the shift. Something I have been noticing while using the throttle and clutch lever is when upshifting between 2 to 3 is if I hesitate a bit during the shift I get a throttle blip like I was down shifting. Maybe something is out of adjustment. I am due for a 6 K service in another month and will have that issue addressed.
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post #31 of 82 Old Dec 4th, 2016, 10:56 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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I use it about 50% of the time. I find upshifting below 3k RPM works best with clutch lever pulled not using shift assist . Above that I like to upshift around 4 - 5 KRPM. It is a great feel upshifting around 8 KRPM though
I'm doing clutch-less shifts w/o SAP about 50% of the time--from 5-6th almost 100%, 4-5th maybe 65%. It's not automatic I just forget from years of using a clutch. One can get quite good at it with a little practice, by 'good' I mean smooth and fast w/ nary a hitch. I'll have to try some at higher rpms clutch-less shifts. I'm usually 3000 to 4500 most of the time.

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post #32 of 82 Old Dec 5th, 2016, 7:03 am
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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Originally Posted by NoelCP View Post
Really, have you tried it w/o shift assist, but with clutchless? I read somewhere you needed to quickly back off the throttle fully before resuming hard acceleration in order for SA to work--not so you're saying? Also, w/o shift assist w/ the method I described, you absolute need to be accelerating and hard is fine, then it's a rapid full off-throttle, no clutch pull, and you're right back at hard acceleration up to the next shift, w/o shift assist. I don't know if shift assist is a feature you can disable, but if it is try doing what I'm talking about. I get the sense is only a software change that is required, but that is just a sense as I"m not sure. Shockingly smooth and fast clutchless upshifting, in fact arguably it can be smoother than carefully done clutched shifting. The only thing that holds me back on this is not knowing if I can potentially do harm doing it. As I say it's very smooth and ultra quick and doesn't seem to feel like it's stressing anything. It's happened by accident on a downshift, but that seemed a bit jerky as revs weren't high enough, so I haven't played w/ it for downshifting.
So my big question is why are you doing this? When all you have to do is pull a clutch handle in?

You DO NOT have Shift Pro so what are you trying to say when you post you can do this and that and almost this without the clutch?

I applaud your "skill" but is is not a substitute for Shift Pro.

I just do not see the point or reason? I will say the first time you miss and you are in the higher rev range you might get cured of your faux Shift Pro exercises.

I think it bad forum to even encourage that type of shifting on this bike not only because a miss is going to cost you dearly, some other less experienced riders may try it with very bad results, and all you have to do is pull the damn clutch handle in.

Your bike treat it as you like without question, however you will never approach the safety and smoothness of Shift Pro doing what you are doing. Never going to happen. You do not have Shift Pro.

And we all might be in for a rude awakening with the new drive shaft, bearing, anti shudder and redesigned shifting forks that the '17 has. Like I say gotta be a reason and it is not just "oh hey we will improve this for our riders". And you may be just tearing up, and at, those "weaknesses" by your "I don't need no stinking Shift Pro" actions.

I for one have driven stick and bikes my whole life. If it got a clutch pedal, or a clutch handle, use the thing, it is there for a reason.

My advice to anyone who does not have Shift Pro and is even considering trying to imitate what has been said here (and so many other times Shift Pro comes up) , use the flippen clutch, less to think about and process, cant be much slower on the shift time, and a bunch safer for you and your bike.

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post #33 of 82 Old Dec 5th, 2016, 9:33 am
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

I think he does it to avoid the clunky shifting of the LC that many of us dislike: That 1->2 and 2->1 make me clench my teeth at times.

Probably a point for a new thread but when I raced bikes years ago the only time I used the clutch was taking off from a start. Never had a failure and that was some very hard riding; However, I didn't put 1000's of miles on the bikes either so I can't speak for the longevity of the transmission.

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post #34 of 82 Old Dec 5th, 2016, 10:05 am
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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So my big question is why are you doing this? When all you have to do is pull a clutch handle in?

You DO NOT have Shift Pro so what are you trying to say when you post you can do this and that and almost this without the clutch?

I applaud your "skill" but is is not a substitute for Shift Pro.
Apparently from your reaction I've gone and threatened your reality bubble--sorry about that! Yes it's an acquired skill, just like any skill in riding, and IT IS a substitute for SAP. Never said it was identical, but it captures a lot of what SAP offers, truly. Yes, feels very much like I'm cheating the technology to be able to do this w/o SAP so like to talk about it and also to let others know like the OP that it's possible to enjoy w/o paying for SAP.

I do it because it's easy to do, is SMOOTH and fast. As I understand it the primary trickery involved in SAP is all software driven--the hard parts in the clutch mechanism are the same w and w/o SAP. So one can learn to duplicate the software ignition kill, and what you would find IF you tried on a non SAP equipped machine is that it's not that hard to do--and it's definitely easier on the clutch than using the clutch! If there was a herky jerkiness to it I wouldn't proceed but Lee--it's TOTALLY SMOOTH once you develop a little skill. You might have trouble believing this because presumably you didn't know it's as easy to pull off as it is. If you were a pillion on my bike you likely WOULD NOT feel the shifts at all going from 4-5, 5-6, it's that smooth. So yes, no need to upgrade to SAP for me--it's simply not needed--I'll save the $700-$900 and call it good 'nuf. I mention it to pass on to the rare person who might not have SAP-equipped machines.

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post #35 of 82 Old Dec 5th, 2016, 10:11 am
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

Understood. Completely different thing.

Kinda apples to brick kind of comparison

Point is, speed shifting it is not Shift Pro, and will never be Shift Pro

While Shift Pro is a mechanical/electronic equivalent to what you said, it should never be construed or even hinted that these bikes will do Shift Pro without it enabled or without fear of harm. It is pretty integrated into many systems to function correctly, or as correctly as it does

In a racing situation a transmission swap/rebuild, car or bike is an expected and easily done thing by those who are wrenching them.

A R1200RT LC not so much

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post #36 of 82 Old Dec 5th, 2016, 10:14 am
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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I think he does it to avoid the clunky shifting of the LC that many of us dislike: That 1->2 and 2->1 make me clench my teeth at times.

Probably a point for a new thread but when I raced bikes years ago the only time I used the clutch was taking off from a start. Never had a failure and that was some very hard riding; However, I didn't put 1000's of miles on the bikes either so I can't speak for the longevity of the transmission.
There you go. I've read this in several posts, clutch-less shifting, and people have been doing it forever. I'm only doing it because it's easy to do and fast and smooth and one gets better and better at it w/ a little practice, and I see no downside--it's really just preserving clutch plates as I see it. I do not do this from 1-2, or 2-3--always use the clutch here as the smoothness is lacking w/o the clutch. Pretty much limited to 3 to 6th, and in this set, 4-5, 5-6 mostly.

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post #37 of 82 Old Dec 5th, 2016, 10:19 am
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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it should never be construed or even hinted that these bikes will do Shift Pro without it enabled or without fear of harm:
Bologna Lee. You'd quickly learn that one can do this w/ complete smoothness with just a little skill. No massive lockup of the gears, rupture of the driveshaft, etc. I know that must be your fear, but it's unfounded. SAP basically idiot-proofs clutchless shifting and does that very well even to the point of coordinating RPMs for smooth downshifts.

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post #38 of 82 Old Dec 5th, 2016, 5:45 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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Bologna Lee. You'd quickly learn that one can do this w/ complete smoothness with just a little skill. No massive lockup of the gears, rupture of the driveshaft, etc. I know that must be your fear, but it's unfounded. SAP basically idiot-proofs clutchless shifting and does that very well even to the point of coordinating RPMs for smooth downshifts.
Do what you like your bike as I will always say. Just when you answer new peoples questions on a specific function of a bike you should have some experience with that feature. Speed shifting is not Shift Pro no matter how much you would like it to be.

Again no way you can match the gear shifting as Shift Pro does. Either up or down. I have no fears I have Shift Pro and still do not use it all the time as it is not smooth in the lower gears.

You miss a gear in a high rev situation and while it may not destroy you gears, or your driveshaft bearing, you are going to put metal into your oil pan. Not to mention what you are doing in that split second of missing to your transmission gears, your shift forks, and any other component that takes the impact of a missed shift trying to stop all that spinning mass. A lot more than your clutch plates are involved in a missed shift. As a matter of fact the clutch plates are the least of your worries on a missed shift.

You have to see there is a reason BMW changed so much on the drive/shift line to accommodate shift pro. If you think a new bearing, drive shaft, anti shudder, and shifting forks are a small thing you got another thing coming. Most guys in our club are waiting to '18 to upgrade their 14 and 15 wet heads. They are closing in on 50 K and trade when they get close, as after 50K the bike is really worth nothing at a dealer according to them. They are very excited about these changes.

You can not match Shift Pro in what it does up and down, shift in and shift out by speed shifting. Hell you cant ride 100% clutch free on Shift Pro and still keep your fillings in your teeth

Lets just agree that you do not have Shift Pro so I will pretty much disagree with you when you speak to it as you have no clue "how does it work"? You know how to speed shift your bike and that is good for you. However that does not give you any experience with Shift Pro or how it actually works for those of us who have it and use/not use it.
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post #39 of 82 Old Dec 5th, 2016, 7:21 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

Here we go again. It ain't new, BMW just figured out they could sell an old idea for a lot of money to folks if you add a fancy name. Truth is any bike will shift just fine up or down and without breaking anything. Anyone who believes otherwise has never raced motorcycles.
Believe whatever you want, but give it a rest.... nothing new to see here.
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post #40 of 82 Old Dec 5th, 2016, 7:27 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

Yes Lee, I don't have SAP on my '16 RT and never said I did. And yes Lee, I can shift I would predict very close to exactly how SAP would afford shifting WITH MY STYLE OF RIDING. I don't 'speed shift' intentionally, it's just faster to shift w/o the clutch because in the end quick shifting involving pulling a clutch is more difficult to coordinate and literally takes longer, that's all. So yes, one can shift, quicker, w/o the clutch, and w/o SAP, and cause no harm. In fact Lee--the bike will WEAR LESS due to less friction between clutch plates....CORRECTION: due to MORE friction between clutch plates ;o)

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post #41 of 82 Old Dec 5th, 2016, 7:36 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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Here we go again. It ain't new, BMW just figured out they could sell an old idea for a lot of money to folks if you add a fancy name. Truth is any bike will shift just fine up or down and without breaking anything. Anyone who believes otherwise has never raced motorcycles.
Believe whatever you want, but give it a rest.... nothing new to see here.
There you go. What I would add to that is not only will you not break anything, but you can do it w/ excellent smoothness and bonus, you can save some wear and tear on your clutch. I like it myself and find myself using it more and more, almost to an automatic level. Then other times I find myself falling back on old habits of using the clutch. It's all good, it's such a freaking awesome bike. I bought my RT new March 18, 2016 and I have put 17K+ on it loving every second of it. I just retired as of Dec 1 and hopefully can do lots of touring with any luck.
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post #42 of 82 Old Dec 5th, 2016, 7:38 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

How about everyone agree any bike can be shifted without a clutch and some folks prefer the SAP over none SAP bikes?
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post #43 of 82 Old Dec 5th, 2016, 7:56 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

Some time ago I was sitting in a bar (To quote the sage Gomer Pyle "SURPRISE. SURPRISE. SURPRISE.") talking to an old trucker. Somehow we got on the subject of changing gears, etc. He totally floored me when he said he almost never used the clutch unless from a dead stop. (I was brought up that you don't even LOOK at the gear selector unless you are ready to depress the clutch.)

I asked about tearing stuff up in the driveline, he just laughed and said "The mechanics hate those yunguns because they do it the "right way" and tear stuff up all the time." While I'm sure there are more variables than just the shifting habits, it does bring home the fact that a rider or driver in harmony with their machine will be hard to beat in keeping their equipment happy.

I understand motorcycles have very little to do with big ole trucks, but the point I took away from the ole timer is that there is more than one way to do something "right".
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post #44 of 82 Old Dec 6th, 2016, 3:03 am
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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Here we go again. It ain't new, BMW just figured out they could sell an old idea for a lot of money to folks if you add a fancy name. Truth is any bike will shift just fine up or down and without breaking anything. Anyone who believes otherwise has never raced motorcycles.
Believe whatever you want, but give it a rest.... nothing new to see here.
The Australian bikes have it as standard equipment along with what other countries call options our bikes have the lot as standard . I love the Pro shift and at first thought it was waste but I use it all the time , I am not a fan of the hill start assist but !! .
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post #45 of 82 Old Dec 6th, 2016, 8:13 am
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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I am not a fan of the hill start assist
As Yoda once said: "You will be......you will be".
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post #46 of 82 Old Dec 6th, 2016, 12:35 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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Some time ago I was sitting in a bar (To quote the sage Gomer Pyle "SURPRISE. SURPRISE. SURPRISE.") talking to an old trucker. Somehow we got on the subject of changing gears, etc. He totally floored me when he said he almost never used the clutch unless from a dead stop. (I was brought up that you don't even LOOK at the gear selector unless you are ready to depress the clutch.)

I asked about tearing stuff up in the driveline, he just laughed and said "The mechanics hate those yunguns because they do it the "right way" and tear stuff up all the time." While I'm sure there are more variables than just the shifting habits, it does bring home the fact that a rider or driver in harmony with their machine will be hard to beat in keeping their equipment happy.

I understand motorcycles have very little to do with big ole trucks, but the point I took away from the ole timer is that there is more than one way to do something "right".
Clutches are standard equipment so they're probably installed for a reason.

That said, before buying a 16 RT I thought shift assist would be a silly gimmick that I'd never use. I was wrong!
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post #47 of 82 Old Dec 6th, 2016, 1:16 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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..... I am not a fan of the hill start assist but !! .
Quote:
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As Yoda once said: "You will be......you will be".
Actually, I agree with Geoff! I have the hill-start option, and the one time that I had used it was to try it out! The reason that I don't use it is simply because I have no needs to do so. I have never had any problems with starting from stop going up hills, regardless of how steep, and I have ridden on some very steep hills (look for my video of my rides in Scotland last year, as examples). I will bet that Geoff have the same riding style that I do, which is to keep the right foot on the peg at all time, rather than putting both feet down at stops. This way, the right foot will be on the brake pedal whenever it's needed. In my old riding days, I had never ever seen anybody comes to a stop with both feet down, but that was a very long time ago, and in another country (next door neighbor to Geoff!)
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post #48 of 82 Old Dec 6th, 2016, 3:24 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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So yes, one can shift, quicker, w/o the clutch, and w/o SAP, and cause no harm.
I say we drag race your non-SAP RT and my RT with SAP, it's the "shift quicker" claim that I'm not buying.

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post #49 of 82 Old Dec 6th, 2016, 4:26 pm
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See this is what I was trying to point out earlier, one guys belt buckle is brighter than someone else's.
Does it really matter if you have no shift assist and are content with shifting clutch less, or the other way around? I say NO as long as you're happy with what you have/do. The old saying, "one man's garbage is another man's treasure" comes to mind.
As for all the bikes in a country coming with all the bells? Again that's great. I know when the F6B came out all the Canadian bikes came with abs for the same price all US bikes came without abs.
I know lots of folks love TPMS and I have no use for it. We could and have argued about this but at the end of the day, those who like it will have it, and those who don't, won't.
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post #50 of 82 Old Dec 6th, 2016, 5:48 pm
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Re: How does Gear Shift Assist work?

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The Australian bikes have it as standard equipment along with what other countries call options our bikes have the lot as standard . I love the Pro shift and at first thought it was waste but I use it all the time , I am not a fan of the hill start assist but !! .
I dont use Hill Hold feature very often. Where I find it useful is if stuck in traffic ,at a stop light or other facing up hill or down hill I can set it and not have to hold the brake lever. Pull it a second time and it cancels. It will also cancel if you put your side stand down. I found that out by accident and did not have one. The bike started rolling backwards when I parked going up a hill. Whew.

Hill Hold requires too much throttle to get it to release .
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