New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video - BMW Luxury Touring Community
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post #1 of 51 Old Jan 22nd, 2014, 11:45 am Thread Starter
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New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

Another instructional guide for those wishing to do without the dealer.
http://illinoisbmwriders.com/service...eos/15-k-bikes

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post #2 of 51 Old Jan 22nd, 2014, 5:09 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

Two things That would be helpful.
One, when Filling the bike with oil you need to start the bike after 4 quarts , then finish filling the bike with the bike running. If not you can not properly fill the bike with oil.
Two, put some aluminum foil over the exhaust below the filter to keep oil off the exhaust. Less mess the using a towel.

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post #3 of 51 Old Jan 22nd, 2014, 5:14 pm Thread Starter
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

Good Catch! I forgot to mention that... I may have forgot to add it in the vid.... better go check!

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post #4 of 51 Old Jan 22nd, 2014, 5:52 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

Nice video. And good idea to include the shift ball lube as well.

As Steve says, there is a specific procedure for refilling the bike that needs to be followed. And the aluminum foil trick on the exhaust is quite helpful. So a Refill section is probably necessary.

Also, you should remove any references to the K1300, as the oil changes are noticeably different. The K13's external sump means there's no second internal drain plug, but rather a plastic hose that needs to be removed to drain the external sump tank. And that refill procedure differs as well. A separate K12/1300 video would be better.

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'13 Dark Graphite Metallic K16GTLD, 24K miles and counting . . .
'12 Mineral Silver Metallic K16GTLD, 59K miles and gone.
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'07 Dark Graphite Metallic K12GT, 138,220 miles & now rebuilt!
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All lower 48 states plus Alaska on the K13GT in two weeks . . .

Some people see the gas tank as half empty. Some see it as half full. All I care is that I know where the next tankful is coming from . . .
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post #5 of 51 Old Jan 22nd, 2014, 10:00 pm Thread Starter
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

Thank you for your suggestions! A new video will be posted shortly with the missing info.

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post #6 of 51 Old Jan 23rd, 2014, 8:53 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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Originally Posted by 14wntr View Post
Another instructional guide for those wishing to do without the dealer.
http://illinoisbmwriders.com/service...eos/15-k-bikes
Tried to view, but got a "video not currently available" message.

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post #7 of 51 Old Jan 24th, 2014, 6:23 am
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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Originally Posted by Voyager View Post
Tried to view, but got a "video not currently available" message.
He is most likely editing the Video to add the things Ken & I asked him to update.

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post #8 of 51 Old Jan 24th, 2014, 6:50 am Thread Starter
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Re: New DIY K1600 Oil Change Video

All fixed! Thanks for letting me know. I forgot to put the part adding the oil to it.

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Last edited by 14wntr; Jan 24th, 2014 at 6:59 am.
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post #9 of 51 Old Jan 25th, 2014, 12:37 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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Originally Posted by katnapinn View Post
He is most likely editing the Video to add the things Ken & I asked him to update.
Yes, that must have been it as I can view it now. One error remains as it is stated that 4.5 liters is less than 4 quarts. Just the opposite is true. A liter is larger than a quart. 4.5 liters is about 4.75 quarts.

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post #10 of 51 Old Jan 25th, 2014, 2:21 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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Yes, that must have been it as I can view it now. One error remains as it is stated that 4.5 liters is less than 4 quarts. Just the opposite is true. A liter is larger than a quart. 4.5 liters is about 4.75 quarts.
You can also put all 5 quarts in the bike with no problems too.

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post #11 of 51 Old Jan 25th, 2014, 2:23 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

Great Job !
One last service point regarding the shift linkage service. Be sure to verify the Ball stud on the shift lever is properly torqued. These have been known to back out then break on the LT. I assume the GTL ball studs are similar to the LT..

OOPS my bad went to parts fische the ball stud is one with the shift lever, Sorry.

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post #12 of 51 Old Jan 27th, 2014, 5:07 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

Thanks for taking the time to make the video - appreciate it.

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post #13 of 51 Old Feb 3rd, 2014, 7:58 am
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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Another instructional guide for those wishing to do without the dealer.
http://illinoisbmwriders.com/service...eos/15-k-bikes
Kirk,

When are you buying a 1600?

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post #14 of 51 Old May 18th, 2014, 7:21 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

I'm strongly considering returning to the fold, the video was very informative. I understand that there is an oil change notification that needs to be reset.

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post #15 of 51 Old May 18th, 2014, 7:52 pm Thread Starter
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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Originally Posted by Voyager View Post
Kirk,

When are you buying a 1600?
Unknown... I really like the 1300 though!

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post #16 of 51 Old Sep 4th, 2014, 3:27 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

Everybody is a movie critic. Thanks for your efforts but the mood music is to much.

I cannot for the life of me understand how a competent BMW engineer would ever design the drain system where you blindly stick an Allen wrench up inside the engine fumbling for the sump plug then having to lower the plug through a hole with the possibility of knocking the plug off into the pan. Absolutely piss poor design and something that just should not be.

I never cease to be amazed how some of the most seemingly obvious stupid things are built into bikes ie: canister that turns to concrete, LT transmission drain access, trunk latch handle made of pot metal, windshields that don't, seats the can't, maintenance procedures that would stump Houdini and on and on and on. If these were $15,000 bikes you could understand but they are the most expensive out there and you still have to spend money to correct very poorly thought out design and tackle cumbersome maintenance.

Sorry for the bitching my back hurts and had a bad day.
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post #17 of 51 Old Sep 4th, 2014, 6:31 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

The inner sump drain plug works just fine if you use the proper tool, which is an extended 5mm allen socket.



It's not meant to be undone with a cheap ball-end allen wrench. The allen socket holds the plug securely, and allows you to torque it down to the proper spec.

That said, RL's Oil Sump SuperPlug works very well, even for fumble-fingered home mechanics.



And the same goes for the rest of your complaints. Every one has a known aftermarket solution. Sure, that may mean spending some extra $$ on something that the factory should've gotten right, but that's the cost of owning a BMW loaded with leading-edge technology. If you're willing to put some time in to dial the bike in perfectly for your tastes and riding style, you end up with a fine machine that tackles city streets, mountain passes, and interstates with equal comfort and agility.

And if not, there are plenty of other nice bikes out there that may or may not need some personalization.

When you do find the perfect bike, be sure and let us all know, OK? Because I sure haven't found it yet . . .

Ken
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'13 Dark Graphite Metallic K16GTLD, 24K miles and counting . . .
'12 Mineral Silver Metallic K16GTLD, 59K miles and gone.
'09 Magnesium Beige Metallic K13GT, 32,690 miles & now rebuilt!
'07 Dark Graphite Metallic K12GT, 138,220 miles & now rebuilt!
'02 Mauve Metallic K12LTC, 106K miles and sold
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All lower 48 states plus Alaska on the K13GT in two weeks . . .

Some people see the gas tank as half empty. Some see it as half full. All I care is that I know where the next tankful is coming from . . .
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post #18 of 51 Old Sep 5th, 2014, 7:11 am
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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I cannot for the life of me understand how a competent BMW engineer would ever design the drain system where you blindly stick an Allen wrench up inside the engine fumbling for the sump plug then having to lower the plug through a hole with the possibility of knocking the plug off into the pan. Absolutely piss poor design and something that just should not be.
I chuckle every time I hear someone praise "German engineering". Only the Germans could take something simple like draining the oil and make it complex. Same goes for checking the oil.

If the answer is, "look to the aftermarket", then it's pretty clear that the manufacturer screwed something up. Comfort issues (seats, windshields) are expected because comfort is subjective.

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post #19 of 51 Old Sep 5th, 2014, 8:48 am
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

The point of my rant is that most if not all of the poorly engineered items on bikes are remedied by some inventive guy in his garage. If he can do it why can't the engineers which have state of the art software, multiple development design and trials meetings, road tests, mechanics review and input yet still they build bikes with really dumb things.

As an example the drain plug for the K1600 could have been done in many different ways to completely eliminate the slightest possibility of knocking the plug off the "proper" allen wrench as you lowered it through the pan drain hole. Yes it may not happen often but for the poor guy who does knock it off in the pan, and you know it will happen, he then has to worry will the damn thing cause me any problems. What if I hit a bump and it bounces up into the crank etc. This could have been easily re-engineered to completely eliminate that possibility.

Hey at least get the mechanical stuff right I'll put up with correcting the ergonomic blunders.
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post #20 of 51 Old Sep 5th, 2014, 9:48 am
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

The integrated dry sump allows the engine to be more compact, and to allow it to be set lower and further forward in the frame. That's how they fit that wonderful Slant/6 engine in there. Yes, there are two oil drain plugs, but the tradeoff is a bike with massive torque and impressive sporty handling. That works just fine for me . . .

And again, there is absolutely no problem with removing or installing the inner plug if you use the right tools. An extended 5mm allen socket holds the drain plug just fine without fear of it falling off or stripping out.

You might as well complain that your cheap ball-end allen wrenches don't fit the Torx body screws, and how stupid BMW is for using them . . .

BMW designs high-end bikes that maximize comfort and performance. They do not design it to be wrenched on by clumsy home mechanics that can't be bothered to use the proper set of tools . . .

Sorry, no sympathy here . . .

Ken
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'13 Dark Graphite Metallic K16GTLD, 24K miles and counting . . .
'12 Mineral Silver Metallic K16GTLD, 59K miles and gone.
'09 Magnesium Beige Metallic K13GT, 32,690 miles & now rebuilt!
'07 Dark Graphite Metallic K12GT, 138,220 miles & now rebuilt!
'02 Mauve Metallic K12LTC, 106K miles and sold
BMWLT#145, IBA# 366, MOA# 111996, SCMA# 24032

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All lower 48 states plus Alaska on the K13GT in two weeks . . .

Some people see the gas tank as half empty. Some see it as half full. All I care is that I know where the next tankful is coming from . . .
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post #21 of 51 Old Sep 5th, 2014, 10:24 am
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

Come on Ken tell us how you really feel.

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post #22 of 51 Old Sep 5th, 2014, 10:34 am
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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Come on Ken tell us how you really feel.
I usually do . . .

Ken
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'13 Dark Graphite Metallic K16GTLD, 24K miles and counting . . .
'12 Mineral Silver Metallic K16GTLD, 59K miles and gone.
'09 Magnesium Beige Metallic K13GT, 32,690 miles & now rebuilt!
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All lower 48 states plus Alaska on the K13GT in two weeks . . .

Some people see the gas tank as half empty. Some see it as half full. All I care is that I know where the next tankful is coming from . . .
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post #23 of 51 Old Sep 5th, 2014, 8:30 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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The integrated dry sump allows the engine to be more compact, and to allow it to be set lower and further forward in the frame. That's how they fit that wonderful Slant/6 engine in there. Yes, there are two oil drain plugs, but the tradeoff is a bike with massive torque and impressive sporty handling. That works just fine for me . . .

And again, there is absolutely no problem with removing or installing the inner plug if you use the right tools. An extended 5mm allen socket holds the drain plug just fine without fear of it falling off or stripping out.

You might as well complain that your cheap ball-end allen wrenches don't fit the Torx body screws, and how stupid BMW is for using them . . .

BMW designs high-end bikes that maximize comfort and performance. They do not design it to be wrenched on by clumsy home mechanics that can't be bothered to use the proper set of tools . . .

Sorry, no sympathy here . . .
You seem to assume that there is no way to have a compact design and have it be easy to work on. I don't accept that.

However, this is a pretty good rationalization for a stupid design. Almost as good as the Harley rationalization ... The "if you have to ask, you won't understand" one.

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post #24 of 51 Old Sep 7th, 2014, 8:22 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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You seem to assume that there is no way to have a compact design and have it be easy to work on. I don't accept that.

However, this is a pretty good rationalization for a stupid design. Almost as good as the Harley rationalization ... The "if you have to ask, you won't understand" one.
No matter the brand you'll find the people who will rationalize anything rather than criticize the brand they've bought into.

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post #25 of 51 Old Sep 7th, 2014, 9:08 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

And you obviously don't realize that the K16 is easier to do basic maintenance on than the K12 is. Sure, there are two oil drain plugs, but there's no separate tranny drain plug that's blocked by the centerstand. The K16 air filter is easy to get to, without removing the entire fuel tank like on the K12. And there is no fuel filter to mess with, unlike the K12 that requires removing the entire pump assy from the tank (good thing you've already pulled the tank out for the air filter, right?). Changing the final drive gear oil is a wash, except that the K16's FD doesn't come grinding apart at random . . .

Nor do you have to change out frayed throttle cables, crappy "factory" intercoms, leaky clutch slave cylinders, broken trunk latches, or failed power ABS units. (Does that count as criticizing the brand? )

I'll give you that the valve check is more involved because you have to pull the radiator, but that's only every 18K (or more, as the Slant/6 valves hardly ever move at all). And if you want to be pedantic, the Boxer valve check is much easier that the LT's anyway . . .

Sure, my two K16s have had minor issues, all dealt with quickly and easily under warranty. Unlike my two LTs, which both left me stranded far from home with major repairs that I had to pay out of pocket. The reasons I went away from the LT are still justified, and pretty common knowledge based on the amount of similar failures I've seen on this board over the years . . .

It's not about rationalization, unless you're talking about rationalization of how horrible it is by folks who don't own a K16.

As an engineer and a lifelong gearhead, I understand on a deep level many of the design tradeoffs that BMW has made, why they did so, and what benefits it offers to the rider.

I truly enjoyed both of my LTs, and put 135K quite enjoyable miles on them across two different continents. But there's no way I'd trade my K16 for an LT.

I'm much happier with the K16's superior power, handling, gadgetry, and comfort, most of which can be directly attributed to many of the design choices that BMW has made.

If it's not the right bike for you, that's fine. Meanwhile, many thousands of us are putting many millions of miles on these fantastic bikes, and will continue to do so, no matter how or why you happen to rationalize keeping your "old" bike.

Ken
SoCal
'13 Dark Graphite Metallic K16GTLD, 24K miles and counting . . .
'12 Mineral Silver Metallic K16GTLD, 59K miles and gone.
'09 Magnesium Beige Metallic K13GT, 32,690 miles & now rebuilt!
'07 Dark Graphite Metallic K12GT, 138,220 miles & now rebuilt!
'02 Mauve Metallic K12LTC, 106K miles and sold
BMWLT#145, IBA# 366, MOA# 111996, SCMA# 24032

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All lower 48 states plus Alaska on the K13GT in two weeks . . .

Some people see the gas tank as half empty. Some see it as half full. All I care is that I know where the next tankful is coming from . . .
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post #26 of 51 Old Sep 7th, 2014, 9:18 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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Originally Posted by meese View Post
And you obviously don't realize that the K16 is easier to do basic maintenance on than the K12 is. Sure, there are two oil drain plugs, but there's no separate tranny drain plug that's blocked by the centerstand. The K16 air filter is easy to get to, without removing the entire fuel tank like on the K12. And there is no fuel filter to mess with, unlike the K12 that requires removing the entire pump assy from the tank (good thing you've already pulled the tank out for the air filter, right?). Changing the final drive gear oil is a wash, except that the K16's FD doesn't come grinding apart at random . . .

Nor do you have to change out frayed throttle cables, crappy "factory" intercoms, leaky clutch slave cylinders, broken trunk latches, or failed power ABS units. (Does that count as criticizing the brand? )

I'll give you that the valve check is more involved because you have to pull the radiator, but that's only every 18K (or more, as the Slant/6 valves hardly ever move at all). And if you want to be pedantic, the Boxer valve check is much easier that the LT's anyway . . .

Sure, my two K16s have had minor issues, all dealt with quickly and easily under warranty. Unlike my two LTs, which both left me stranded far from home with major repairs that I had to pay out of pocket. The reasons I went away from the LT are still justified, and pretty common knowledge based on the amount of similar failures I've seen on this board over the years . . .

It's not about rationalization, unless you're talking about rationalization of how horrible it is by folks who don't own a K16.

As an engineer and a lifelong gearhead, I understand on a deep level many of the design tradeoffs that BMW has made, why they did so, and what benefits it offers to the rider.

I truly enjoyed both of my LTs, and put 135K quite enjoyable miles on them across two different continents. But there's no way I'd trade my K16 for an LT.

I'm much happier with the K16's superior power, handling, gadgetry, and comfort, most of which can be directly attributed to many of the design choices that BMW has made.

If it's not the right bike for you, that's fine. Meanwhile, many thousands of us are putting many millions of miles on these fantastic bikes, and will continue to do so, no matter how or why you happen to rationalize keeping your "old" bike.
I never said it wasn't an easier bike to maintain. That doesn't change the fact that it still has some stupid design elements such as the goofy internal drain plug. Tell me why this design HAS to be this way?

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post #27 of 51 Old Sep 7th, 2014, 10:46 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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Originally Posted by Voyager View Post
I never said it wasn't an easier bike to maintain. That doesn't change the fact that it still has some stupid design elements such as the goofy internal drain plug. Tell me why this design HAS to be this way?
Here, found in google. I don't know what it means though...

Integrated dry sump lubrication for optimum oil supply.

The 6-cylinder in-line engine of the K 1600 GT and K 1600 GTL uses an integrated dry sump lubrication system. In addition to a high level of operating reliability, it allows a flat construction of the crankcase and therefore a lower installation position of the engine and a concentration of masses close to the centre of gravity. This makes it possible to do without a conventional oil sump with oil reservoir, so the engine can be placed much lower in the vehicle than would be the case with a conventional construction. The oil reservoir forms an integrated oil tank in the rear section of the engine casing. A separate tank is therefore not required, which consequently has a positive effect in terms of
the compact construction of the motorcycle and overall weight.

The dual oil pump is housed in the rear section of the engine casing and driven by cogs from the clutch shaft, circulating 4.5 litres of lubricant (engine oil capacity including filter change). It draws the lubrication oil from the oil reservoir and initially feeds it into the oil filter (full-flow filter) as pressure oil. The latter is located on the left lower crankcase side where it is easily accessible. From here the pressure oil reaches the main oil ducts in the
crankcase and is distributed to the lubrication points via internal bores. The returning lubricant collects at the lowest point of the crankcase in the sump pan. The second pump supplies the returning oil to the oil cooler initially, and from here it flows back into the oil tank. The oil cooler is located below the headlamp in the front trim panel for optimum air flow. No monitoring of lubricant supply is necessary: if the oil level drops excessively, this is displayed in the instrument panel by means of an electronic oil sensor.

===================

All I know is that I like this engine and if it takes an extra screw to drian all the oil so be it.

Just Go
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post #28 of 51 Old Sep 8th, 2014, 4:11 am
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

Quote:
Originally Posted by Voyager View Post
Tell me why this design HAS to be this way?
I did, just above:

Quote:
Originally Posted by meese
The integrated dry sump allows the engine to be more compact, and to allow it to be set lower and further forward in the frame. That's how they fit that wonderful Slant/6 engine in there.
And you refused to accept it.

Kinda hard to have a real conversation that way . . .

Ken
SoCal
'13 Dark Graphite Metallic K16GTLD, 24K miles and counting . . .
'12 Mineral Silver Metallic K16GTLD, 59K miles and gone.
'09 Magnesium Beige Metallic K13GT, 32,690 miles & now rebuilt!
'07 Dark Graphite Metallic K12GT, 138,220 miles & now rebuilt!
'02 Mauve Metallic K12LTC, 106K miles and sold
BMWLT#145, IBA# 366, MOA# 111996, SCMA# 24032

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All lower 48 states plus Alaska on the K13GT in two weeks . . .

Some people see the gas tank as half empty. Some see it as half full. All I care is that I know where the next tankful is coming from . . .
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post #29 of 51 Old Sep 8th, 2014, 4:39 am
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

Quote:
Originally Posted by mwnahas View Post
I don't know what it means though...
I know exactly what that means. It means that by removing the lower oil pan entirely, the crank, pistons, and the rest of the engine can be placed lower and further forward in the frame. This lowers the overall center of gravity and balances front-to-rear weight distribution, vastly improving both low-speed and high-speed handling, as anyone who has really wrung out the K16 clearly knows.

But the oil still needs to go somewhere, so there's a small sump right next to the crank (the inner drain plug), while the rest of the oil resides in an upper reservoir (that's nicely tucked up behind the cylinder bank).

These design decisions were thought through very carefully, and optimized to fit the purpose of the bike, giving it a smooth, powerful, responsive, and fuel-efficient engine that simply blows away the competition.

And I'd bet that random backyard mechanics whinging because they don't have the proper tools to do an oil change in their garage wasn't high on BMW's list of design criteria . . .

Quote:
Originally Posted by mwnahas View Post
All I know is that I like this engine and if it takes an extra screw to drian all the oil so be it.
And I know that the bike handles really well for a large, comfortable tourer. BMW nailed this one . . .

Ken
SoCal
'13 Dark Graphite Metallic K16GTLD, 24K miles and counting . . .
'12 Mineral Silver Metallic K16GTLD, 59K miles and gone.
'09 Magnesium Beige Metallic K13GT, 32,690 miles & now rebuilt!
'07 Dark Graphite Metallic K12GT, 138,220 miles & now rebuilt!
'02 Mauve Metallic K12LTC, 106K miles and sold
BMWLT#145, IBA# 366, MOA# 111996, SCMA# 24032

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All lower 48 states plus Alaska on the K13GT in two weeks . . .

Some people see the gas tank as half empty. Some see it as half full. All I care is that I know where the next tankful is coming from . . .
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post #30 of 51 Old Sep 8th, 2014, 2:55 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

Quote:
Originally Posted by mwnahas View Post
Here, found in google. I don't know what it means though...

Integrated dry sump lubrication for optimum oil supply.

The 6-cylinder in-line engine of the K 1600 GT and K 1600 GTL uses an integrated dry sump lubrication system. In addition to a high level of operating reliability, it allows a flat construction of the crankcase and therefore a lower installation position of the engine and a concentration of masses close to the centre of gravity. This makes it possible to do without a conventional oil sump with oil reservoir, so the engine can be placed much lower in the vehicle than would be the case with a conventional construction. The oil reservoir forms an integrated oil tank in the rear section of the engine casing. A separate tank is therefore not required, which consequently has a positive effect in terms of
the compact construction of the motorcycle and overall weight.

The dual oil pump is housed in the rear section of the engine casing and driven by cogs from the clutch shaft, circulating 4.5 litres of lubricant (engine oil capacity including filter change). It draws the lubrication oil from the oil reservoir and initially feeds it into the oil filter (full-flow filter) as pressure oil. The latter is located on the left lower crankcase side where it is easily accessible. From here the pressure oil reaches the main oil ducts in the
crankcase and is distributed to the lubrication points via internal bores. The returning lubricant collects at the lowest point of the crankcase in the sump pan. The second pump supplies the returning oil to the oil cooler initially, and from here it flows back into the oil tank. The oil cooler is located below the headlamp in the front trim panel for optimum air flow. No monitoring of lubricant supply is necessary: if the oil level drops excessively, this is displayed in the instrument panel by means of an electronic oil sensor.

===================

All I know is that I like this engine and if it takes an extra screw to drian all the oil so be it.
Dry sump systems have been used for decades. Their advantages are well known. BMW is the only dry sump system designer that I know of that had to have a second drain plug inside the crankcase though...

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post #31 of 51 Old Sep 8th, 2014, 3:00 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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Originally Posted by meese View Post
I know exactly what that means. It means that by removing the lower oil pan entirely, the crank, pistons, and the rest of the engine can be placed lower and further forward in the frame. This lowers the overall center of gravity and balances front-to-rear weight distribution, vastly improving both low-speed and high-speed handling, as anyone who has really wrung out the K16 clearly knows.

But the oil still needs to go somewhere, so there's a small sump right next to the crank (the inner drain plug), while the rest of the oil resides in an upper reservoir (that's nicely tucked up behind the cylinder bank).

These design decisions were thought through very carefully, and optimized to fit the purpose of the bike, giving it a smooth, powerful, responsive, and fuel-efficient engine that simply blows away the competition.

And I'd bet that random backyard mechanics whinging because they don't have the proper tools to do an oil change in their garage wasn't high on BMW's list of design criteria . . .

And I know that the bike handles really well for a large, comfortable tourer. BMW nailed this one . . .
BMW has not cared about serviceability since the airhead days.

And they aren't the first by a long shot to understand the advantages of a dry sump system. As far as I know though, they are the first to implement one with a goofy drain plug design!

I agree the 1600 does many things very well. I just don't agree that this excuses the stupid drain plug design. My engineering standards are higher than that.

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post #32 of 51 Old Sep 8th, 2014, 4:19 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

Quote:
Originally Posted by Voyager View Post
Dry sump systems have been used for decades. Their advantages are well known. BMW is the only dry sump system designer that I know of that had to have a second drain plug inside the crankcase though...
BMW is the only 1600, six cylinder that fits in the space of the in line 4 that I know of.

Just Go
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post #33 of 51 Old Sep 8th, 2014, 4:22 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

Quote:
Originally Posted by Voyager View Post
BMW has not cared about serviceability since the airhead days.

And they aren't the first by a long shot to understand the advantages of a dry sump system. As far as I know though, they are the first to implement one with a goofy drain plug design!

I agree the 1600 does many things very well. I just don't agree that this excuses the stupid drain plug design. My engineering standards are higher than that.
Well then design us a plug that will get both holes done at the same time. Easy.

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post #34 of 51 Old Sep 8th, 2014, 4:43 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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Originally Posted by Voyager View Post
BMW has not cared about serviceability since the airhead days.
Says you.

BMW has specifically addressed serviceability issues on the newer models. The K12/13GT was easier to service than the LT, and the K16 is easier still. Hll, just getting the body panels off takes about half the time as the LT, and 90% of those screws are the same length, with none of those prone-to-failure rubber well nuts.

And the changes they've made are specifically related to increased performance, which is obvious to anyone who's ridden the bike (even you, from your previous ride report).

Look, you've ridden the K16, and decided it's not the bike for you. That's fine.

But when you get irritated by trivial things (30 seconds longer for the second oil drain plug) and then ignore all the advancements (significantly easier servicing), never mind all the power, handling, comfort, and gadgety improvements, then you're simply being stubborn.

Ride whatever you want, but your current arguments against the K16 really have no basis in reality . . .

Ken
SoCal
'13 Dark Graphite Metallic K16GTLD, 24K miles and counting . . .
'12 Mineral Silver Metallic K16GTLD, 59K miles and gone.
'09 Magnesium Beige Metallic K13GT, 32,690 miles & now rebuilt!
'07 Dark Graphite Metallic K12GT, 138,220 miles & now rebuilt!
'02 Mauve Metallic K12LTC, 106K miles and sold
BMWLT#145, IBA# 366, MOA# 111996, SCMA# 24032

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All lower 48 states plus Alaska on the K13GT in two weeks . . .

Some people see the gas tank as half empty. Some see it as half full. All I care is that I know where the next tankful is coming from . . .
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post #35 of 51 Old Sep 8th, 2014, 4:44 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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Originally Posted by mwnahas View Post
BMW is the only 1600, six cylinder that fits in the space of the inline 4 that I know of.
Exactly. What they did works, and the second oil plug really is just a triviality, unless you're simply looking for an excuse to denigrate the bike . . .

Ken
SoCal
'13 Dark Graphite Metallic K16GTLD, 24K miles and counting . . .
'12 Mineral Silver Metallic K16GTLD, 59K miles and gone.
'09 Magnesium Beige Metallic K13GT, 32,690 miles & now rebuilt!
'07 Dark Graphite Metallic K12GT, 138,220 miles & now rebuilt!
'02 Mauve Metallic K12LTC, 106K miles and sold
BMWLT#145, IBA# 366, MOA# 111996, SCMA# 24032

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All lower 48 states plus Alaska on the K13GT in two weeks . . .

Some people see the gas tank as half empty. Some see it as half full. All I care is that I know where the next tankful is coming from . . .
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post #36 of 51 Old Sep 8th, 2014, 7:53 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

Leave the K16 alone!






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post #37 of 51 Old Sep 9th, 2014, 8:34 am
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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Originally Posted by meese View Post
Says you.

BMW has specifically addressed serviceability issues on the newer models. The K12/13GT was easier to service than the LT, and the K16 is easier still. Hll, just getting the body panels off takes about half the time as the LT, and 90% of those screws are the same length, with none of those prone-to-failure rubber well nuts.

And the changes they've made are specifically related to increased performance, which is obvious to anyone who's ridden the bike (even you, from your previous ride report).

Look, you've ridden the K16, and decided it's not the bike for you. That's fine.

But when you get irritated by trivial things (30 seconds longer for the second oil drain plug) and then ignore all the advancements (significantly easier servicing), never mind all the power, handling, comfort, and gadgety improvements, then you're simply being stubborn.

Ride whatever you want, but your current arguments against the K16 really have no basis in reality . . .
I am not arguing against the K1600. I am continually amazed how people think a comment on one poor design element should be extrapolated to cover the entire machine. Rationalization is a powerful drug.

I never said the K1600 was a bad motorcycle. I said the oil drain plug design is stupid, and anyone who looks at it objectively will likely say something similar.

Sorry that it offends your sensibilities, but I am not a Kool-Aid drinker.

I ride an LT and it is my current favorite bike, but I don't defend the stupid design elements on the LT such as the inferior crankshaft o-ring and clutch slave cylinder design that are almost destined to spoil the clutch at some point way too early in the service life (mine didn't make it 30,000 miles). That is simply stupid design. It doesn't make the LT a bad motorcycle overall, but it is an inferior design element pure and simple.

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post #38 of 51 Old Sep 9th, 2014, 11:28 am
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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Originally Posted by 05Train View Post
Leave the K16 alone!
Or at least come up with something better than "Well, that's stupid!" Uh, yeah, OK then . . .

Ken
SoCal
'13 Dark Graphite Metallic K16GTLD, 24K miles and counting . . .
'12 Mineral Silver Metallic K16GTLD, 59K miles and gone.
'09 Magnesium Beige Metallic K13GT, 32,690 miles & now rebuilt!
'07 Dark Graphite Metallic K12GT, 138,220 miles & now rebuilt!
'02 Mauve Metallic K12LTC, 106K miles and sold
BMWLT#145, IBA# 366, MOA# 111996, SCMA# 24032

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All lower 48 states plus Alaska on the K13GT in two weeks . . .

Some people see the gas tank as half empty. Some see it as half full. All I care is that I know where the next tankful is coming from . . .
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post #39 of 51 Old Sep 9th, 2014, 11:32 am
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

The second oil drain plug really is a triviality. Another 30 seconds while doing an oil change at most. And it's not something that's gonna fail and leave you stranded, or cost thousands of dollars to fix.

So you don't like that bit of design. OK, fine . . .

Meanwhile, the rest of us have long since moved past it and are out riding and enjoying the hll out of these bikes . . .

Ken
SoCal
'13 Dark Graphite Metallic K16GTLD, 24K miles and counting . . .
'12 Mineral Silver Metallic K16GTLD, 59K miles and gone.
'09 Magnesium Beige Metallic K13GT, 32,690 miles & now rebuilt!
'07 Dark Graphite Metallic K12GT, 138,220 miles & now rebuilt!
'02 Mauve Metallic K12LTC, 106K miles and sold
BMWLT#145, IBA# 366, MOA# 111996, SCMA# 24032

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All lower 48 states plus Alaska on the K13GT in two weeks . . .

Some people see the gas tank as half empty. Some see it as half full. All I care is that I know where the next tankful is coming from . . .
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post #40 of 51 Old Sep 9th, 2014, 2:39 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

I think we're done here aren't we?


Just Go
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post #41 of 51 Old Sep 9th, 2014, 3:11 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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I think we're done here aren't we?

I hope so.

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post #42 of 51 Old Sep 9th, 2014, 3:15 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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I hope so.
I'm waiting to see if Meese will make a third reply that has no response.

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post #43 of 51 Old Sep 9th, 2014, 8:58 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

Now why would I do that?

Ken
SoCal
'13 Dark Graphite Metallic K16GTLD, 24K miles and counting . . .
'12 Mineral Silver Metallic K16GTLD, 59K miles and gone.
'09 Magnesium Beige Metallic K13GT, 32,690 miles & now rebuilt!
'07 Dark Graphite Metallic K12GT, 138,220 miles & now rebuilt!
'02 Mauve Metallic K12LTC, 106K miles and sold
BMWLT#145, IBA# 366, MOA# 111996, SCMA# 24032

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All lower 48 states plus Alaska on the K13GT in two weeks . . .

Some people see the gas tank as half empty. Some see it as half full. All I care is that I know where the next tankful is coming from . . .
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post #44 of 51 Old Sep 10th, 2014, 1:46 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

I think we can at least make it to two pages? Can't we?

[B]It STILL don't make me no nevermind![/B]
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post #45 of 51 Old Apr 6th, 2015, 3:15 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

Not to high-jack the thread, but...

this weekend I changed oil on my GTL, but didn't thoroughly plan ahead. I forgot to get an oil filter at the dealership last time I was in. So, I ran down to Cycle Gear and bought a K&N oil filter; priced about the same. They look to be identical to the BMW filter. True, it has the nut on the top of the filter, scraping the shift lever, but I figured I could get around that. I ground the nut off and painted it with high-temp gloss black.

You'd have to take a good second look to notice that it's not a BMW filter. All's well so far...

Kevin

2015 BMW K1600GTL (current ride)
2012 BMW K1600GTL
2008 BMW K1200LT
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1998 BMW R1100RT
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1996 BMW R1100R
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post #46 of 51 Old Jun 9th, 2016, 8:55 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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Originally Posted by katnapinn View Post
... when Filling the bike with oil you need to start the bike after 4 quarts , then finish filling the bike with the bike running. l.
So...what happens if you don't?
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post #47 of 51 Old Jun 10th, 2016, 6:48 am
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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So...what happens if you don't?
After about 1/4 of the 5th quart is put into the bike it will be full. If you try to put in more oil it will spill out on the floor. The motor has to be run to fill the motor with oil from the sump to make room for more oil. This is why you can put a full 5 quarts in even tho the manual show 4.75 +- oil.

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post #48 of 51 Old Jun 10th, 2016, 7:55 am
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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Originally Posted by katnapinn View Post
After about 1/4 of the 5th quart is put into the bike it will be full. If you try to put in more oil it will spill out on the floor. The motor has to be run to fill the motor with oil from the sump to make room for more oil. This is why you can put a full 5 quarts in even tho the manual show 4.75 +- oil.
I get that. What I don't get is why the bike has to be running.
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post #49 of 51 Old Jun 10th, 2016, 9:54 am
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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I get that. What I don't get is why the bike has to be running.
I guess it does not have to be running but it does have to be started to pull the oil into the motor. I just find it easier to leave it running to make sure oil gets into all parts of the motor before shut down.

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post #50 of 51 Old Jun 10th, 2016, 1:15 pm
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Re: New DIY K1600/1300 Oil Change Video

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Originally Posted by katnapinn View Post
I guess it does not have to be running but it does have to be started to pull the oil into the motor. I just find it easier to leave it running to make sure oil gets into all parts of the motor before shut down.
OK....I agree with you.
I filled 4 qts then ran the engine for a couple minutes, shut it down and topped it up.
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