Tire Mileage (Metzler ME880)

[km5bh]

I have read somewhere that the LT goes through front tires faster than the rear. Or at least I thought that was what I read.



Well I have got at least 18,000 miles on the front tire on my 2001 LTC and it still looks good. I went about 9,000 miles on the Metzler on the back and changed it to Bridgestone BT020. Now this was a hard thing for me to do as a lifetimes experience with Bridgestone’s and Firestone’s told me that it was going to be a mistake.



I had Bridgstone’s on a Kawasaki Nomad and they were pieces of crap. Noisy, didn’t hold the road in the rain, and wore out in a hurry.



I am glad to tell you that the BT020 on the rear is wearing well and will handle in the rain. And I have about 9,000 miles on it and it looks fine. The Metz on the rear was worn to the point that I wasn’t going to Arkansas on it last fall by the time it had 9,000 miles on it.



I had seen someone post that they were using the Metzler’s on the front and the BT020 on the back and how good it felt. I don’t know if I am good enough on the thing to tell someone how good a tire feels, but this combination is satisfying me and unless something changes, this will be the combination that I choose next time.



I am not perfect at it, but I try to keep the pressures as stated here, at 42 for the front and 48 for the back.



Thanks for the resources I have found here. Now if that BMW dealer would just get done with the bile. I am going into withdrawal.



Thanks

Lewis

[messenger13]

I have read somewhere that the LT goes through front tires faster than the rear. Or at least I thought that was what I read.This is the first I've ever heard of that claim.

[JMMRoad]

I did wear out the front (at about 5,000 miles) faster than the rear on the original Bridgestone Azzaro's (Sp?). But then I went to Dunlop 205's better but not good and then the Metzler 880's. I get 10 to 12 thousand from the rears and about 15 or so from the fronts.

Jerry Miller

[meese]

Depends on the tires, and the riding style. I get not quite two rear tires to one front, and I usually take them pretty much down to the wear bars unless I have a long trip planned.

[dshealey]

This is the first I've ever heard of that claim.

Where have you been all this time Joe? Depends on the tire brands though.

For me:
Dunlops: wore pretty evenly, fronts and rears toasted at about the same time.
Lousy tires though.
Metzelers: fronts outlast the Metzeler rear.
BT020s: rear outlasted the BT020 front, approx. 14,000 vs 9,000 avg.
Avon: front lasted about the same as the BT020 rear.
For me, Avon rear lasted 2-300 miles! That is as long as I could stand them and pulled them off. Thought the first one was bad, Avon sent me a new one, it was just as bad.

[jkersh1]

The fronts on mine have been good for about 20K; the rears, if I can go without a puncture, last maybe 14K. A riding buddy of mine had an 1150 RT that went through fronts in about 6 - 8K which was considerably faster that the rear.

[murray]

>Snip Lewis Wrote
I had seen someone post that they were using the Metzler’s on the front and the BT020 on the back and how good it felt. I don’t know if I am good enough on the thing to tell someone how good a tire feels, but this combination is satisfying me and unless something changes, this will be the combination that I choose next time

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Lewis, Are you currently mixing the 880 bias with the 020 radial? If so that is a no no. Could it be the 880 radial with 020 radial?

[Signman]

>Snip Lewis Wrote
I had seen someone post that they were using the Metzler’s on the front and the BT020 on the back and how good it felt. I don’t know if I am good enough on the thing to tell someone how good a tire feels, but this combination is satisfying me and unless something changes, this will be the combination that I choose next time

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Lewis, Are you currently mixing the 880 bias with the 020 radial? If so that is a no no. Could it be the 880 radial with 020 radial?


I have had 020 radials front and rear and 880 bias front and rear, but as said before the 020 fronts don't last very long, and the 880's didn't give me the performance that the 020's do. Then one day I tried a "take-off" 020 radial on the rear, (with the 880 on the front) and it felt great! Since then I've gone back to all 880's but didn’t care for them. Now I’m back to the combination of 880 bias on front and 020 radial on the rear and for me, they are the best for handling and mileage.

As for radials and bias plys being a no no, that may be so on a car but I don't know about on a motorcycle. They work for me.

[TMH]

[Hijack Alert On]
Pete,

Stroudsburg PA, really?

As shown elsewhere on this Board, one of my other hobbies deals with historic fire engines. The first one I ever bought was a 1963 American La France, which had served its whole life as Chemical Engine No. 1 with the Stroudsburg FD. I bought it from a guy in Carlisle and drove it home to CA.

When I later sold it, I was sure that it would have more value being on the West coast of the US, because there are fewer small departments out here, and therefore fewer rigs of this vintage. But the winning bidder was from... Anapolis MD! So he had her trucked back to the East.

I always wanted to know a bit more about Stroudsburg, and plan to get back there some day. [Hijack Alert Off]

Tom

[murray]

As for radials and bias plys being a no no, that may be so on a car but I don't know about on a motorcycle. They work for me.
Not wishing you any Ill fate but, If you keep mixing the Bias Radial combo your opinion will change. There is a incompatibility issue

[tbl160]

WARNING, WARNING Will Robinson! The combination of a bias and radial tire is not recommended.

Jim in GA

[JATownsend]

Not wishing you any Ill fate but, If you keep mixing the Bias Radial combo your opinion will change. There is a incompatibility issue
I delaminated a BT020 rear in the Badlands last year. When I finally got to the Sturgis, SD BMW dealer all they had were 880 rears.

I was concerned at first with the "Compatibility Issue". :eek:

It rapidly became a non-issue! :D

I ran that radial front / bias rear set-up until my front wore out. About 4,000 more miles AND there were NO issues. It performed fine, one-up, two-up, with the trailer, running fast, in the twisties, everywhere.

The compatibility issue is a myth! :alien:

[glenn]

New 2005 with bias ply F&R. Went through the front in short order. dealer installed a new BT020 radial in front. I didn't notice until just before I replaced that tire 8k later that I had been running bias/radial combo. Handled fine.

[TMH]

My most local dealer (SJ BMW) told me that they would not even install a mis-matched set of tires for the standard "liability reasons."

Obviously as a business they need to be even more cautious than we are, but if there was "not an issue" mixing tires I don't believe they would be turning down business.

Tom

[lnowell]

I have been running a varied combo of Radial 020's and Bias 020's over the last year. To date, I have not noticed any problem with the combinations. The next tire change is back to a rear 020 radial. My 020 front tire usage, either bias or radial is better than two to one for the rear - either bias or radial. Actually I could NOT tell the difference between the bias and radial 020 as far as overall ride and semi - aggressive cornering.

[markbreen]

Hello Guys,


I have Metzlers at the momemt. I am not a sports rider so I am accustomed to seeing my tyres being square, flat on the bottom and plenty on the sides. On the LT, the back tyre is not completely flat, almost like a car tyre, I have two new bridgestores waiting to go on. But what I am so surprised to see is the shape of the front tyre. It has a high point in the centre and then the two side walls are completely gone.

The only explanation I can think is that the centre is harder, much harder than the sides. But the tyre is such a strange shape. It is also the shape of the Omega symbol!

Any comments?

Thanks

Mark

[dshealey]

Hello Guys,


I have Metzlers at the momemt. I am not a sports rider so I am accustomed to seeing my tyres being square, flat on the bottom and plenty on the sides. On the LT, the back tyre is not completely flat, almost like a car tyre, I have two new bridgestores waiting to go on. But what I am so surprised to see is the shape of the front tyre. It has a high point in the centre and then the two side walls are completely gone.

------
Any comments?

Thanks

Mark

That center standout is VERY prominent with Avon front radial, and Metzeler front radial, but not so much with the Metzeler front bias ply. The Dunlop bias plys feathered badly, but wore somewhat round. The BT020 Radials feather a little, but wear very evenly across the tread. The Avon and Metzeler RADIAL fronts have a very prominent hard center tread and much softer side treads. For me, they both wore fast on the sides, with a lot of tread left in the center. OK for high highway mileage, but handled terribly in the twisties once worn in this manner. For me, the BT020 radial front handled the most consistently from new to worn out, just has lower life than the others.

[jwd98056]

I have 14k on my front ME880 with 45% (3/32") tread remaining and 9k on my rear with about 35% (4/32") tread remaining.

[markbreen]

That center standout is VERY prominent with Avon front radial, and Metzeler front radial, but not so much with the Metzeler front bias ply. The Dunlop bias plys feathered badly, but wore somewhat round. The BT020 Radials feather a little, but wear very evenly across the tread. The Avon and Metzeler RADIAL fronts have a very prominent hard center tread and much softer side treads. For me, they both wore fast on the sides, with a lot of tread left in the center. OK for high highway mileage, but handled terribly in the twisties once worn in this manner. For me, the BT020 radial front handled the most consistently from new to worn out, just has lower life than the others.

Hello Again David,

Thank you for your comprehensive reply. I am glad to see that this is a common phenonomon. I am also slightly relieved to find that I have not been pushing the bike and tyres to their limits, although while I may fantasise that this is the case, I knew it is not.

Safe Riding

Mark

[meese]

For me, Avon rear lasted 2-300 miles!True, but remember that I put another 7,500 miles on that same Avon tire. I didn't like how it handled for the first couple of thousand miles, but it sure beat the brand-new BT020 radial with a huge nail sticking out of it. :)

[stefan]

The combination of a bias and radial tire is not recommended.

Not recommended by who and why? I recently ran a BT020 on the back with a Metzeler ME880 bias on the front...with no issues.

Since the front was due for replacement, I have now replaced it with a Michelin bias tire.

Although there is a difference in the tires, I cannot say that I have ever noticed anything negative with this combination. That is regardless if I've been riding solo, with a passenger, pulling the trailer, doing 30 MPH or 100 MPH pulling the trailer, etc.

Unless somebody states some facts, my opinion is that the "not recommended" statement is "just talk" and nothing else.

Stefan

[afterburner]

I put on 880's ~2000 miles ago and am very pleased with them. The only problem I had was when I hit a patch of black ice on Hyw 64 in 44 degree weather !! I quickly learned how important it is to be on the sunny side of the mountains under 45 degrees. I am sure that if my tire pressure had been under 42/48 I could have been in trouble. As it was the only thing I suffered was a HUGE adrenalin RUSH !!

[motorhead]

True, but remember that I put another 7,500 miles on that same Avon tire. I didn't like how it handled for the first couple of thousand miles, but it sure beat the brand-new BT020 radial with a huge nail sticking out of it. :)

Funny you say that :p
Purchased my first set of AVONS off a fellow member who rode them less than 500 miles then took em off and sold them to me :)

** Agreed the rear was loosy goosey feeling for @ 1500 miles untill it wore a tad flatter in profile, then was just fine for the rest of it's short life. (5400 miles)

After 2 sets of 880's ... No more !!:eek: Those suckers are like grease on tar snakes & hot smooth asphalt surfaces ( we have a LOT of that)
The Avons handled & held onto the most varied surfaces best too date.
Now on the Avon front / Stone rear combo, so far it feels as solid traction wise at the Avon set but hopefully mileage will be a LOT better.

Scott

[oldracer1943]

Having raced 4 wheels for a living I find it absolutely ludicrous that up on two wheels radials and bias plys are being mixed. Just ask any qualified tire engineer and he will gasp for his breath. This is a certain wreck looking for a place to happen, especially in wet conditions, and hard braking.

Net, what puzzles me is that in all the tire threads I have read not once has BMW been turned to for their spec or recommendation. I wouldn't think BMW would build a bike such as the K/LT and not have done ]"extensive" [/B] tire testing of their National brands as well as others. And, certainly would not turn to threads in a forum to design a spec for the tire.

SO, what is the recommendation(S) of BMW?? Anyone know?? :confused:

[jzeiler]

Having raced 4 wheels for a living I find it absolutely ludicrous that up on two wheels radials and bias plys are being mixed. Just ask any qualified tire engineer and he will gasp for his breath. This is a certain wreck looking for a place to happen, especially in wet conditions, and hard braking.



That is very true for automotive applications where you have a large difference in side wall flex dynamics between radial and bias tires. Not so on MC tire where there is little if any side wall flex to interfere with handling.

[StLHeadake]

My two cents...I had new dunlops (if I recall correctly) on the bike when I bought it (used from a Honda dealer). I took the bike home in POURING rain. Of course it is a new (to me) bike and I didn't press the issue. I rode gingerly yet confidently the long way home.

I got a flat tire and had the dealer change the flat. Took the bike home and it litterally 'snaked' all the way home (10 miles at interstate speed). It felt like I was riding on marbles. I took it back and complained about the whole thing. The shop guy says "no wonder, you've got one radial and one bias" I split the cost of a new set of BT020's. I have had nothing else since!

I too adhere to the don't mix rule. Someone (with serious credentials) says different, then OK. I've had my bad BAD spill. I'm still riding, why tempt fate?

[mikedoyle]

I have on 05' (OEM are Bias ply tires either Metzler or Bridgestone) , I recently had to replace a damaged 020 Bias with an ME880 Bias due to being out of town and having no choice. I was told by the dealer that sold me the Metzler Front that the Bridgestone was a softer compound and if I did this that I may run the risk of the harder Metz up front breaking loose on a hard turn , he said that I should replace the rear with a metz also (even though my rear BT020 only had 2500 miles on it). I called my dealer in Houston & he said that the main thing was that both tires were Bias Belted (not to use a radial on an 05' or newer , or to ever mix a Bias & radial). I decided to chance it & run the Mets up front with existing 020 rear. So far no handling problems. As has already been mentioned I too have found that the 020's wear better on the rear & the ME880 fronts do better.

Mike Doyle

[tobiwan]

The original Bridgestone (not sure of Rating) front was toast in just 5K miles. replaced with Metzler 880. rear tire fine replaced at 16K and could have lasted a few K more but logistics of getting back to dealer was cumbersome so changed a little early. rear 880 changed again at 16K during recent four corner trip. front tire replaced at same time with 25K. Check tire pressure almost every day and top off as needed to 42 front and 48 rear