Does this make sense, or not?

[jayz9705]

I am sorry but after hearing they want to sing the National Anthem in
Spanish - enough is enough. Nowhere did they sing it in Italian,
Polish, Irish (Celtic), German or any other language because of
immigration. It was written by Francis Scott Key and should be sung
word for word the way it was written The news broadcasts even gave the
translation -- not even close. Sorry if this offends anyone but this
is MY COUNTRY - IF IT IS YOUR COUNTRY SPEAK UP -- please pass this
along.
I am not against immigration -- just come through like everyone else.
Get a sponsor; have a place to lay your head; have a job; pay your
taxes, live by the rules AND LEARN THE LANGUAGE as all other
immigrants have in the past -- and GOD BLESS AMERICA!

PART OF THE PROBLEM
Think about this: If you don't want to forward this for fear of
offending someone -- YOU'RE PART OF THE PROBLEM!
It is Time for America to Speak up

[tmgs]

I am sorry but after hearing they want to sing the National Anthem in
Spanish - enough is enough. Nowhere did they sing it in Italian,
Polish, Irish (Celtic), German or any other language because of
immigration. It was written by Francis Scott Key and should be sung
word for word the way it was written The news broadcasts even gave the
translation -- not even close. Sorry if this offends anyone but this
is MY COUNTRY - IF IT IS YOUR COUNTRY SPEAK UP -- please pass this
along.
I am not against immigration -- just come through like everyone else.
Get a sponsor; have a place to lay your head; have a job; pay your
taxes, live by the rules AND LEARN THE LANGUAGE as all other
immigrants have in the past -- and GOD BLESS AMERICA!

PART OF THE PROBLEM
Think about this: If you don't want to forward this for fear of
offending someone -- YOU'RE PART OF THE PROBLEM!
It is Time for America to Speak up


I agree Jay!

[NOGILLS2]

If you think thats something check this out! BTW I agree also Jay!

Please forward to as many people as you know. WE NEED THIS INFORMATION PASSED ON TO EVERY RED-BLOODED AMERICAN!!!!!!


These senators need their people to do something to oust them. Let them kow that you don't approve of the way they are selling out America...


33 Senators Voted Against English as America's Official Language June 6,
2007

On Wed, 6 Jun 2007 23:35:23 -0500, "Colonel Harry Riley USA ret" wrote:

Senators,

Your vote against an amendment to the Immigration Bill, 1348, to make English America's offical language is astounding. On D-Day no less when we honor those that sacrificed in order to secure the bedrock character and principles of America. I can only surmise your vote reflects a loyalty to illegal aliens.

I don't much care where you come from, what your religion is, whether you're black, white or some other color, male or female, democrat, republican or independent, but I do care when you're a United States Senator, representing citizens of America and vote against English as the official language of the United States.

Your vote reflects betrayal, political surrender, violates your pledge of allegiance, dishonors historical principle, rejects patriotism, borders on traitorous action and, in my opinion makes you unfit to serve as a United States Senator... impeachment, recall, or other appropriate action is warrented.

Worse, four of you voting against English as America's official language are presidential candidates: Senator Biden, Senator Clinton, Senator Dodd, and Senator Obama.

There are 4 Senators vying to lead America but won't or don't have the courage to cast a vote in favor of English as America's official language when 91% of American citizens want English officially designated as our language.

This is the second time in the last several months this list of Senators have disgraced themselves as political hacks... unworthy as Senators and certainly unqualifed to serve as President of the United States.

If America is as angry as I am, you will realize a back-lash so stunning it will literally rock you out of your panties... and preferably totally out of the United States Senate.

The entire immigration bill is a farce... your action only confirms this really isn't about America, it's about self-serving politics... despicable at best

"Never argue with an idiot; they'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." ~ anonymous


The following senators voted against making English the official language of America:

Akaka (D-HI) Bayh (D-IN) Biden (D-DE) Wants to be President? Bingaman
(D-NM) Boxer (D-CA) Cantwell (D-WA) Clinton (D-NY) Wants to be President? Dayton (D-MN) Dodd (D-CT) Wants to be President? Domenici (R-NM) Coward, protecting his Senate seat... Durbin (D-IL) Feingold (D-WI) Not unusual for him Feinstein (D-CA) Harkin (D-IA) Inouye (D-HI) Jeffords (I-VT) Kennedy (D-MA) Kerry (D-MA) Wanted to be President Kohl (D-WI) Lautenberg
(D-NJ) Leahy (D-VT) Levin (D-MI) Lieberman (D-CT) Disappointment here..... Menendez (D-NJ) Mikulski (D-MD) Murray (D-WA) Obama (D-IL) Wants to be President? Reed (D-RI) Reid (D-NV) Senate Majority Leader Salazar (D-CO) Sarbanes (D-MD) Schumer (D-NY) Stabenow (D-M)

"Congressmen who willfully take actions during wartime that damage morale, and undermine the military are saboteurs and should be arrested, exiled or hanged." ~ President Abraham Lincoln

[SilverBuffalo]

It is Time for America to Speak up
All this political correctness and concern for possibly offending someone is total BS

"Ask the American Indians
What Happens When You
Don't Control Immigration."

So, is that loud and clear enough? :)

[dwsdad]

I am sorry but after hearing they want to sing the National Anthem in
Spanish - enough is enough. Nowhere did they sing it in Italian,
Polish, Irish (Celtic), German or any other language because of
immigration. It was written by Francis Scott Key and should be sung
word for word the way it was written The news broadcasts even gave the
translation -- not even close. Sorry if this offends anyone but this
is MY COUNTRY - IF IT IS YOUR COUNTRY SPEAK UP -- please pass this
along.
I am not against immigration -- just come through like everyone else.
Get a sponsor; have a place to lay your head; have a job; pay your
taxes, live by the rules AND LEARN THE LANGUAGE as all other
immigrants have in the past -- and GOD BLESS AMERICA!

PART OF THE PROBLEM
Think about this: If you don't want to forward this for fear of
offending someone -- YOU'RE PART OF THE PROBLEM!
It is Time for America to Speak up

Couldn't agree with you more! Think of all the tax dollars wasted converting everything to Spanish. By gawd, I want it all converted to German, Russian, Italian, Greek, Hebrew, Canadian, Chinese, Japanese, Gaelic, Turkish, and Arabic.

[KMC1]

WOOOHOOOOO!!!!!
FINALLY!! A thread I can REALLY get on board with!!!!

I could NOT agree more with this thread! :cool: :beer:

[Ted Shred]

That just pisses me off!!!! When is this going to become so absurd that the American people actually do something about it??? The level of apathy towards this kind of thing is staggering!!! I heard a radio report this morning that a school district in West Virginia had banned the wearing of any flags at schools (pins, t-shirts etc...) including the American Flag. This was on 9/11. We don't want to offend any one. Well I say F&*K em!! If they're offended by MY flag, they can get the HELL out of MY country!!!

*"*RANT OFF***

[tmgs]

All this political correctness and concern for possibly offending someone is total BS

"Ask the American Indians
What Happens When You
Don't Control Immigration."

So, is that loud and clear enough? :)


If anyone ever had a reason to be pissed and offended, it is the american indian

(May Grandma Rest in peace)

[kdog]

I am sorry but after hearing they want to sing the National Anthem in Spanish...

Ahem, who's "they"? I'm sorry Jay, but whenever I read something that says "please pass this along", my BS meter pegs.

Google is your friend, and will tell you that this "controversy" dates back to April of 2006 when a Spanish pop-star decided to record the National Anthem in Spanish, presumably for air play on Spanish radio stations. So who cares? It raised a few eyebrows back them, and then the matter disappeared. But this is the Internet, where things never die. Instead, pranksters like to bring up old news completely out of context like some big new scandal, along with the words "please pass this on", and laugh at how much shit they can stir up.

Now mind you, I'm all for ENGLISH being the official language of the country, and for much stronger immigration enforcement (I didn't say laws, because they're already there.) My pet peave is urban legends, which this story seems to be.

That being said, here's an interesting side-story that surfaced.

It is claimed that George W. Bush had the Spanish pop star sing that spanish version at the Whitehouse in 1991.

(click on the image to see the story on the whitehouse website.)
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2001/05/images/20010518-7.jpg (http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2001/05/images/20010518-7.html)

Or at least, that's the interpretation by this story (http://thinkprogress.org/2006/05/02/national-anthem-sung-in-spanish-at-first-bush-inaugural/). ;)

Cheers,
-joel

[hschisler]

I agree that anything that includes a phrase similar to "this MUST be passed on to everybody in the country" is usually an urban legend. I did a quick check of snopes.com and truthorfiction.com -- didn't see anything about this particular issue.

[jayz9705]

Couldn't agree with you more! Think of all the tax dollars wasted converting everything to Spanish. By gawd, I want it all converted to German, Russian, Italian, Greek, Hebrew, Canadian, Chinese, Japanese, Gaelic, Turkish, and Arabic.




Just for the record, CT gives the drivers license test in 14 different languages.

Names of streets are only in one.
Signs of information (black on white rectangles) are in one.
Speed limits are in one.

[jayz9705]

No problem from me, Joel. I'll accept your statement and feelings on the post.
Some things, however, to me, just seem to be wrong, no matter if they be true or false. The fact that there was ANY truth to it, in ANY context, under ANY condition, is enough to make me want to help disseminate it and to spread it thicker than my favorite peanut butter!

[deputy5211]

No problem from me, Joel. I'll accept your statement and feelings on the post.
Some things, however, to me, just seem to be wrong, no matter if they be true or false. The fact that there was ANY truth to it, in ANY context, under ANY condition, is enough to make me want to help disseminate it and to spread it thicker than my favorite peanut butter!

Great going, Jay. You had to bring that up and start another peanut butter thread, eh? :histerica

(for the record, I like Skippy Brand, Chunky Style, but Gina and the kids prefer JIF in the creamy style. Guess what brand we have in our pantry? I say "No Skippy, No Peace!")

[grifscoots]

GROAN. Another peanut butter thread? Unsubscribe!

[dshealey]

Great going, Jay. You had to bring that up and start another peanut butter thread, eh? :histerica

(for the record, I like Skippy Brand, Chunky Style, but Gina and the kids prefer JIF in the creamy style. Guess what brand we have in our pantry? I say "No Skippy, No Peace!")

Here it is Peter Pan all the way! Creamy for me, Chunky for my wife. We were forced to use JIF during the recent disapperance of Peter Pan, tried Skippy once, did not like it. Am so glad to see Peter Pan back on the store shelves once again.

I tell people that my brother and I would have never grown over 4 feet tall if not for Peter Pan. :rotf:

Now back to the political thread-------------------------------.;)

[alindsay]

Yeah! That just sticks to the roof of my mouth! :mad:

[kdog]

Yeah! That just sticks to the roof of my mouth! :mad:

Want some jelly with that? :D

[CalLT]

Some things, however, to me, just seem to be wrong, no matter if they be true or false.

MAN did I get a good laugh offa that! Thanks! :rotf:

[deputy5211]

Ever hear of a Fluff-R-Nutter? Heck, I still remember the jingle for their 60's & 70's TV commercials. My singing is so bad that even if I type the words you all would cringe and cover your ears! :D

Marshmallow Fluff is basically a spreadable marshmallow creme. Jet Puff has a similar product here in Texas.

Peanut Butter on one slice of bread (Skippy Chunky, of course) and Fluff on the other, put 'em together and SHAZAM! A Fluff-R-Nutter. Sometimes I'll even put some jam in between, or some Granny Smith apple slices. I just gained five pounds writing about it. . . may as well head to the kitchen and indulge now! :eek:

[zippy_gg]

Having the privilege of currently being unemployed I get mail from the Sate of California which contains a slew of phone numbers, one for each language supported.

Wait a minute!!! Aren't unemployment benefits for US citizens and legal residents, all of which had to take an English test???

That is more money wasted to support Spanish, Korean, Japanese, Cantonese, Mandarin, etc...
Just for the record, CT gives the drivers license test in 14 different languages.

Names of streets are only in one.
Signs of information (black on white rectangles) are in one.
Speed limits are in one.

[mikedoyle]

Ditto on "if you don't pass this along" being a meter pegger.

[meese]

Ahem, who's "they"? I'm sorry Jay, but whenever I read something that says "please pass this along", my BS meter pegs.I'm with you, Joel. The other one that raises my guard is "I don't care if it's true, because it's right. :eek: Thanks for doing the research that I didn't have time to do. :)

And yes, I agree that if you live here, you need to learn the language. And if you're not here legally, then you have no rights to demand things go your way.

My wife and I traveled all over Europe, Japan, and Korea and in reality, most of the people spoke some rudimentary English. Granted, we were dealing mostly with work references and business owners who need to communicate in order to reach the huge American and English-speaking markets but still, America is so self-centered and so far behind the rest of the world in so many ways that it's actually pretty scary.

So instead of sitting home and bitching about it over the 'net, or forwarding every little caustic tidbit that comes your way, how about learning Spanish yourself? Or Japanese, Korean, German, Dutch, etc. Then when they start talking smack in their own language, you can meet them head on have a proper debate. And just maybe, you'll find out that they're people too, with their own hopes, dreams, and problems.

Now this isn't a cry for open immigration or total amnesty, but more a realization that sitting on your a$$ and bitching about how the world has gone so wrong while pressing Send really isn't doing anyone any good.

But if I had kids, I'd make damn sure that they could speak and read Chinese fluently, in whatever dialect. That's where the world is headed, and sooner than we may think.

[meese]

GROAN. Another peanut butter thread? Unsubscribe! :histerica :histerica :histerica

[STEBS]

Ahem, who's "they"? I'm sorry Jay, but whenever I read something that says "please pass this along", my BS meter pegs.



Heres an email that was passed along to me and it says to please pass it along. I don't know whats true or not, the only link I looked at is snopes, which says the main text of the email is true.




Bank of America, can I help you?
Customer: Yes, I want to cancel my account. I don't want to do business with you any longer.
The Bank: Why?
Customer: You're giving credit to illegal immigrants and I don't think it's right. I'm taking my business elsewhere.
The Bank: Well, Mr. Customer, we don't want to see you do that, but we can't stop you. I'll help you close the account. What is your account number?
Customer: (gives account number)
The Bank: For security purposes and for your protection, can you please give me the last four digits of your social security number?
Customer: No?
The Bank: Mr. Customer, I need to verify your information, but in order to help you, I'll need verification of who you are.
Customer: Why should I give you my social security number? The reason I'm closing my account is that your bank is issuing credit cards to illegal immigrants who don't have social security numbers. You are targeting that audience and want their business. Let's say I'm an illegal immigrant and you've given me a credit card. I have a question about it and call for assistance. You wouldn't be asking me for a Social Security number, would you?
The Bank: No sir, I wouldn't.
Customer: Why not?
The Bank: Because you would have pressed '2' to speak in Spanish. We don't ask for that information when calling in on the Spanish line.
I provided "snopes" for doubters: http://www.snopes.com/politics/immigration/bankofamerica.asp
Now .

I hope the following 14 reasons are forwarded over and over again until they are read so many times that the reader gets sick of reading them. I have included the URL's for verification of the following facts.

1. $11 Billion to $22 billion is spent on welfare to illegal aliens each year. http://tinyurl.com/zob77


2. $2.2 Billion dollars a year is spent on food assistance programs such as food stamps, WIC, and free school lunches for illegal aliens. http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html



3. $2.5 Billion dollars a year is spent on Medicaid for illegal aliens.
http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html

4. $12 Billion dollars a year is spent on primary and secondary school education for children here illegally and they cannot speak a word of English! http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.0.html

5. $17 Billion dollars a year is spent for education for the American-born children of illegal aliens, known as anchor babies.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html

6. $3 Million Dollars a DAY is spent to incarcerate illegal aliens.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html

7. 30% percent of all Federal Prison inmates are illegal aliens.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html

8. $90 Billion Dollars a year is spent on illegal aliens for Welfare & social services by the American taxpayers.
http://premium.cnn.com/TRANSCIPTS/0610/29/ldt.01.html

9. $200 Billion Dollars a year in suppressed American wages are
caused by the illegal aliens.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html

10. The illegal aliens in the United States have a crime rate that's two and a half times that of white non-illegal aliens. In particular, their children, are going to make a huge additional crime problem in the US
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0606/12/ldt.01.html

11. During the year of 2005 there were 4 to 10 MILLION illegal aliens that crossed our Southern Border also, as many as 19,500 illegal aliens from Terrorist Countries. Millions of pounds of drugs, cocaine, meth, heroine and marijuana, crossed into the U. S from the Southern border. Homeland Security Report: http://tinyurl.com/t9sht

12. The National Policy Institute, "estimated that the total cost of mass deportation would be between $206 and $230 billion or an average cost of between $41 and $46 billion annually over a five year period." http://www.nationalpolicyinstitute.org/pdf/deportation.pdf

13. In 2006 illegal aliens sent home $45 BILLION in remittances back to their countries of origin. http://www.rense.com/general75/niht.htm

14. "The Dark Side of Illegal Immigration: Nearly One Million Sex Crimes Committed by Illegal Immigrants In The United States ".
http://www.drdsk.com/articleshtml


The total cost is a whooping .

$ 338.3 BILLION DOLLARS A YEAR
If this doesn't bother you then just delete the message, but on the other hand, if it does raise the hair on the back of your neck, then forward it to every human in the country including every representative in Washington, DC four time a week for a month.

[kdog]

Well, the premise about BofA seems to be true, but I doubt the phone conversation is. BofA clearly needs a kick in the ass.

However, the rest of the "facts" with supporting links are highly prejudicial. Look at the sources -- they're mostly transcripts of Lou Dobbs interviews. If you research Lou Dobbs, you find out he's very anti-immigration. I only scanned a few of the transcripts, because they're very long and I don't have all day to devote to this, but the economic figures cited in the transcripts appear to come from him, not the people he's interviewing. Wikipedia has this to say about him "Dobbs' critics have at times accused him of presenting unclear or inaccurate information on his program to buttress his reporting on illegal immigrants." The references get even more bizarre after that.

For example, the National Policy Institute. Honestly, I don't know a thing about them, but their website instantly smacks of white supremacy. Check it out and see if you don't agree. http://www.nationalpolicyinstitute.org/aboutus.php
Ok, digging a little deeper, I picked just one random NPI board member to research, Jared Taylor. Didn't take long before I found out he's a holocaust denier and highly praised by David Duke, head of the KKK.


Also, rense.com appears to be another crackpot site that's referenced in the article.

There are some links provided to whitehouse reports too that really don't supply any figures but do show ugly results of illegal immigration. Of course, all good urban legends contain veneer elements of truth to cover the bullshit.

So basically what you have here is a big pile of prejudicial crap and you can't trust any of it (except for the BofA part I already commented on).

My perception is that we have a major illegal immigration problem in the country. However, BS articles like this really undermine the very cause they claim to support. When I see stuff like this, it makes me question my own assumptions and look more closely at the matter. I do not want to keep company with white supremists.

-joel

PS: So once again, the "please pass this on" test proves to be accurate.

[CalLT]

If you research Lou Dobbs, you find out he's very anti-immigration.

I think it is more accurate to say Dobbs is anti-ILLEGAL immigration. He is married to a Mexican immigrant.

Frankly, I don't know many people who are against immigrants in general. I came here on a boat myself, but legally.

I also don't understand the animosity against people who choose to speak their own language. But that's just me.

But the idea that our borders should be thrown open and that illegal immigration should just be tolerated ... that's just stupid.

My opinion.

[kdog]

I think it is more accurate to say Dobbs is anti-ILLEGAL immigration.

Yeah, that was a typo.

Thanks,
-joel

[eljeffe]

All this political correctness and concern for possibly offending someone is total BS

This PC crap has gotten so bad that ABC had to create the program Caveman in order for people to laugh at without offending some special interest group.

[kdog]

This PC crap has gotten so bad that ABC had to create the program Caveman in order for people to laugh at without offending some special interest group.

I'm pretty offended by it.
http://www.johnlehr.com/images/caveman5.jpg

[zippy_gg]

Press 1 for Cave-talk :rolleyes: I'm pretty offended by it.
http://www.johnlehr.com/images/caveman5.jpg

[KMC1]

When I see stuff like this, it makes me question my own assumptions and look more closely at the matter. I do not want to keep company with white supremists.

-joel

PS: So once again, the "please pass this on" test proves to be accurate.
I wouldn't worry too much about being associated with white supremacists because of your views on illegal immigration. The majority of NON-whites are against illegal immigration, and the displeasure with the new Democratically controlled congress has reached an all time high, with 71% of the populace saying that they do not approve of the "job" it is doing. (or NOT doing as the case may be)

[tmgs]

I have a question or two,

How much is given in welfare to legal citizens?

Why is it the only workers you can find are Mexican? (at least here in Ga and many parts of florida)


want to solve the illegal issues

CUT THE WELFARE SYSTEM OFF!









<snip the bank stuff>
I hope the following 14 reasons are forwarded over and over again until they are read so many times that the reader gets sick of reading them. I have included the URL's for verification of the following facts.

1. $11 Billion to $22 billion is spent on welfare to illegal aliens each year. http://tinyurl.com/zob77


2. $2.2 Billion dollars a year is spent on food assistance programs such as food stamps, WIC, and free school lunches for illegal aliens. http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html



3. $2.5 Billion dollars a year is spent on Medicaid for illegal aliens.
http://www.cis.org/articles/2004/fiscalexec.html

4. $12 Billion dollars a year is spent on primary and secondary school education for children here illegally and they cannot speak a word of English! http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.0.html

5. $17 Billion dollars a year is spent for education for the American-born children of illegal aliens, known as anchor babies.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html

6. $3 Million Dollars a DAY is spent to incarcerate illegal aliens.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html

7. 30% percent of all Federal Prison inmates are illegal aliens.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html

8. $90 Billion Dollars a year is spent on illegal aliens for Welfare & social services by the American taxpayers.
http://premium.cnn.com/TRANSCIPTS/0610/29/ldt.01.html

9. $200 Billion Dollars a year in suppressed American wages are
caused by the illegal aliens.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0604/01/ldt.01.html

10. The illegal aliens in the United States have a crime rate that's two and a half times that of white non-illegal aliens. In particular, their children, are going to make a huge additional crime problem in the US
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0606/12/ldt.01.html

11. During the year of 2005 there were 4 to 10 MILLION illegal aliens that crossed our Southern Border also, as many as 19,500 illegal aliens from Terrorist Countries. Millions of pounds of drugs, cocaine, meth, heroine and marijuana, crossed into the U. S from the Southern border. Homeland Security Report: http://tinyurl.com/t9sht

12. The National Policy Institute, "estimated that the total cost of mass deportation would be between $206 and $230 billion or an average cost of between $41 and $46 billion annually over a five year period." http://www.nationalpolicyinstitute.org/pdf/deportation.pdf

13. In 2006 illegal aliens sent home $45 BILLION in remittances back to their countries of origin. http://www.rense.com/general75/niht.htm

14. "The Dark Side of Illegal Immigration: Nearly One Million Sex Crimes Committed by Illegal Immigrants In The United States ".
http://www.drdsk.com/articleshtml


The total cost is a whooping .

$ 338.3 BILLION DOLLARS A YEAR
If this doesn't bother you then just delete the message, but on the other hand, if it does raise the hair on the back of your neck, then forward it to every human in the country including every representative in Washington, DC four time a week for a month.

[kdog]

I wouldn't worry too much about being associated with white supremacists because of your views on illegal immigration. The majority of NON-whites are against illegal immigration, and the displeasure with the new Democratically controlled congress has reached an all time high, with 71% of the populace saying that they do not approve of the "job" it is doing. (or NOT doing as the case may be)

While "displeasure" with the democratic congress may be high, the voters aren't quite ready to switch to a republican congress according to this poll taken within the past two weeks. http://rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/congressional_ballot

And you'll remember Americans didn't seem to mind when Congress fought Bush on selling US shipping ports to the arabs. (http://people-press.org/reports/display.php3?ReportID=271)

I know you're against everything Democrat, but neither party is perfect, and a two-party government beats a single party government any day of the week.

-joel

[zippy_gg]

I know you're against everything Democrat, but neither party is perfect, and a two-party government beats a single party government any day of the week.

-joelStill I would love to have a 3rd or 4th option, not being satisfied with the only 2 we currently have.

[KMC1]

While "displeasure" with the democratic congress may be high, the voters aren't quite ready to switch to a republican congress according to this poll taken within the past two weeks. http://rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/congressional_ballot

And you'll remember Americans didn't seem to mind when Congress fought Bush on selling US shipping ports to the arabs. (http://people-press.org/reports/display.php3?ReportID=271)

I know you're against everything Democrat, but neither party is perfect, and a two-party government beats a single party government any day of the week.

-joel
I didn't intend to promote or defend our current crop of professional politicians as they ALL are pretty much spineless and worthless it seems, or the issue would have been solved last year when Congress was not Democratically controlled.
My intention was to point out that the illegal immigration issue is not a racial issue as much as the main stream media has tried to present it that way.
I don't think that bringing race into the issue is morally or factually responsible, and though you may find there are some elements of the fringe who share your views, you shouldn't worry about being lumped in with them as there are plenty of people of ALL races who share your view.

[kdog]

Ok, fine. I think we've gotten a little off track, so I'll try to explain my issue.

There are two internet messages running around that were posted in this thread. The first one was posted by Jay and was about the national anthem being sung in Spanish. That turned out to be based on old news and was misleading. The second post by STEBS contained a big list of sensationalist "facts" that come from suspect sources and are clearly designed to rile people up. Neither of those make a cogent argument against illegal immigration, and yet those are the messages that are making the rounds. Why do you suppose that is?

Since moving out to the desert a year ago and trying to construct a yard out of a patch of desert, we've got to know a lot of contractors. Some of them use undocumented Mexican workers. No surprise there. But the reason is surprising. It seems that there's a shortage of white laborers who aren't on drugs. The contractors learn to hire the Mexicans because they work hard and get the job done. While the white laborers work for a week or two, get a paycheck, buy a big pile of drugs and disappear.

I don't think anyone has any clue what kind of economic impact there would be to our country if we could all of a sudden snap our fingers and make all the illegals from Mexico disappear. But don't think it's a slam dunk that the impact would be in our favor. And we'll never figure that out by sending around chain-mail propoganda.

Respectfully,
-joel

[KMC1]

This is just a thought, but..... I wonder what the effect would be if we took all the money being spent on illegal aliens for child birth / child care, loss of taxes, education, law enforcement, etc. and spent that money on programs to help the drug addicted white people who won't work that you speak of??
Sounds to me as though our system is failing our own citizens, while benefitting those who should not be here to begin with.

[tmgs]

This is just a thought, but..... I wonder what the effect would be if we took all the money being spent on illegal aliens for child birth / child care, loss of taxes, education, law enforcement, etc. and spent that money on programs to help the drug addicted white people who won't work that you speak of??
Sounds to me as though our system is failing our own citizens, while benefitting those who should not be here to begin with.


Why stop with just our drug addicted white people? why not all of our citizens?

shut down the welfare system spend that money in that direction. the illegal problem will go away, eventually.

[CalLT]

This is just a thought, but..... I wonder what the effect would be if we took all the money being spent on illegal aliens for child birth / child care, loss of taxes, education, law enforcement, etc. and spent that money on programs to help the drug addicted white people who won't work that you speak of??
Sounds to me as though our system is failing our own citizens, while benefitting those who should not be here to begin with.

Better yet ... what if we took all the money and resources currently dedicated to being the worlds' policeman, and instead used that money to:

1) Secure our borders
2) Improve our infrastructure
3) Boost education and healthcare

If one candidate would champion the above three points, I'd vote for 'em, whether they be Republican or Democrat.

Here's another tidbit:

Republicans are owned by big biz
Democrats are owned by big labor

Until we as voters demand better (choice "c"), we will get precisely the government we deserve.

[KMC1]

Why stop with just our drug addicted white people? why not all of our citizens?
Because he specifically stated it was drug addicted white people causing the influx of illegal aliens............If they are the root cause of the problem, then we should address the root cause, right? :rolleyes:

[KMC1]

Better yet ... what if we took all the money and resources currently dedicated to being the worlds' policeman, and instead used that money to:

1) Secure our borders
2) Improve our infrastructure
3) Boost education and healthcare

If one candidate would champion the above three points, I'd vote for 'em, whether they be Republican or Democrat.

Here's another tidbit:

Republicans are owned by big biz
Democrats are owned by big labor

Until we as voters demand better (choice "c"), we will get precisely the government we deserve.

Amen brother! You said a mouthful and I couldn't agree more!

[tmgs]

Because he specifically stated it was drug addicted white people causing the influx of illegal aliens............If they are the root cause of the problem, then we should address the root cause, right? :rolleyes:


guerss i should have read his post, sorry.


hehe, yup it's all one little segments fault ok :histerica

you would not believe how hard it is to get something done up here (NE Georgia) it seems there are only a few people that are willing to work, and they are so busy you can;t get them to even come out to give a quote, the others jsut never show up, hell I had one show up half loaded. Now I'm not against drinking but I'oll tell ya, i'm not hiring someone to do a job that whos up half dang loaded

I think I can borrow a friends "Mexican" as soon as they get caught up, that guy is willing to bust his ass for a fair wage.

the only one I have got to show up to do anything so far in a year of owning this new house.

Tom

[kdog]

Because he specifically stated it was drug addicted white people causing the influx of illegal aliens............If they are the root cause of the problem, then we should address the root cause, right? :rolleyes:

I never specifically stated anything of the kind.

[jayz9705]

Republicans are owned by big biz
Democrats are owned by big labor







......but isn't the gov't SUPPOSED to be 'owned' by the people?????

[kdog]

I think I can borrow a friends "Mexican" as soon as they get caught up, that guy is willing to bust his ass for a fair wage.

the only one I have got to show up to do anything so far in a year of owning this new house.

Imagine your chagrin if he was deported as part of "securing the border" before he had a chance to do your job. Can't have it both ways, you know.

[tmgs]

Imagine your chagrin if he was deported as part of "securing the border" before he had a chance to do your job. Can't have it both ways, you know.

I'm not the one complaining about them, I say
dig a moat at the border, fill it gators bunches of em from FL (we have plenty to spare)

Trade one for one,
one person that is able to work that is on welfare for one person that is willing to work with no welfare.
I don't care who they are, then let them apply for legal work status. make them proove themself.

and for the record this one is legally here.

my point you shut down the borders and there is going to be no one to build your foundations, pick our fruits, or do any labor jobs.



that is why I say shut down the welfare system. it would make many get out and work for the pay these illegals are working for.

I worked in groves when i was pretty young dang those folks worked thier ass off all day

sad this country has trained so many to sit and collect a free check

Tom

[KMC1]

I never specifically stated anything of the kind.
Sorry Joel, you are correct. You never did specifically state that. You have however intimated several key things throughout your posts on this thread however, that are part of the mainstream media and the left leaning folks "reasons" for the ongoing debacle.
You have intimated that Lou Dobbs is stating incorrect figures about the costs involved with illegal immigration (while providing no evidence of same) and therefore concluded that everything he says cannot be trusted.
You have intimated that the real reason anyone wants border security is racially motivated, and found one person with some connections to white supremacy organizations and David Duke.
And you have intimated we need illegal immigrant workers to do the work that white people won't do. (I'm not sure why you only singled out white people in your posts, but I'm going to leave that alone)
All of these things are basically the tag lines for the Left and the MSM in their reasoning for no need for border security, amnesty and no limits on both legal and illegal immigration.
On an interesting sidenote however; The company I currently work for has a position identical to mine open in Los Angeles right now. I am going to be relocating in about 22 months, but am not sure where right now (long story) but Southern CA is one of my top choices. So I took a look at the position to see if I could possibly start to line something up... well lo and behold... I am not qualified for the position.... why do you ask.. because the candidate MUST BE fluent in Spanish......Now I can actually speak some and write some, enough to communicate basic needs... but it looks like I am not empoyable in my own country, by my own employer...........for the job I am already doing for them....I can't see why anyone would be angry about the immigration situation at all :rolleyes: Not to mention the unwillingness to assimilate into the culture, or the alienation of ALL the other immigrant groups who now will need to learn both English AND Spanish in order to thrive in our country.

[tmgs]

And you have intimated we need illegal immigrant workers to do the work that white people won't do. (I'm not sure why you only singled out white people in your posts, but I'm going to leave that alone)


I have to agree with him there, although its not just white that won't do these jobs, however there are many white that just will not!! they would rather complain about being broke or only show up a few days a week here and there. it is really sad.


On an interesting sidenote however; The company I currently work for has a position identical to mine open in Los Angeles right now. I am going to be relocating in about 22 months, but am not sure where right now (long story) but Southern CA is one of my top choices. So I took a look at the position to see if I could possibly start to line something up... well lo and behold... I am not qualified for the position.... why do you ask.. because the candidate MUST BE fluent in Spanish......Now I can actually speak some and write some, enough to communicate basic needs... but it looks like I am not empoyable in my own country, by my own employer...........for the job I am already doing for them....I can't see why anyone would be angry about the immigration situation at all :rolleyes: Not to mention the unwillingness to assimilate into the culture, or the alienation of ALL the other immigrant groups who now will need to learn both English AND Spanish in order to thrive in our country.

Now that bites plain and simple. Sorry to hear that.

BTW what company do you work for

[tmgs]

Republicans are owned by big biz
Democrats are owned by big labor







......but isn't the gov't SUPPOSED to be 'owned' by the people?????

Of course not, it is owned by the Democrats
(for now <g>)

[meese]

On an interesting sidenote however; The company I currently work for has a position identical to mine open in Los Angeles right now. I am going to be relocating in about 22 months, but am not sure where right now (long story) but Southern CA is one of my top choices.Cool. Maybe I'll be able to buy you that drink after all. :)

But if you're gonna learn a new language, I'd look towards Chinese. In another few years, the Mexicans will be the least of our concerns.

[CalLT]

Cool. Maybe I'll be able to buy you that drink after all. :)

But if you're gonna learn a new language, I'd look towards Chinese. In another few years, the Mexicans will be the least of our concerns.

Yup, yup. Exactly.

[kdog]

But if you're gonna learn a new language, I'd look towards Chinese. In another few years, the Mexicans will be the least of our concerns.

Hey, if they're willing to pull weeds for $8/hr, I say bring 'em on. :histerica

[grifscoots]

Look at history: France, England, Russia were all super powers in their time. Many empires have rose and fallen: Roman, Greek, etc. America's experiment is just a blink in history and I agree, China will be the next super power in another 100 years.....

....or a parking lot.

[kdog]

You have intimated that the real reason anyone wants border security is racially motivated,...

Bullshit. As I've already indicated, I'm for increased border security. Heads-up and listen carefully, because I've already explained my position and this is the last time I'll do it. I'm against illegal immigration. I'm also against using misleading propaganda to make my points. Maybe YOU want to get YOUR information by white supremists and right-wing talk show hosts, but that's not where I want to get MY information from. If Lou Dobbs' figures were accurate, that email would have referenced his sources, not transcripts from his TV show. Get real.

My point is that folks want to argue for increased border security then do so rationally, not by spreading propaganda from obviously biased sources. It only serves to weaken your argument.

[kdog]

BTW, here's what I'd like to see. I'd like to stop illegal immigration. I think the illegals should be rounded up and shipped back home. I'm not aware that we have illegals in this country that are on welfare. If that's true, that's an abomination, and needs to be stopped.

I also think we need a source of laborers in this country, and millions of Mexicans need the jobs. The solution therefore is to make it easy to for properly identified Mexicans to get work visas in this country. That way they can live here, work here, pay taxes and be accounted for. Stop working and you get shipped back home. Seems simple to me.

-joel

[KMC1]

Bullshit. As I've already indicated, I'm for increased border security. Heads-up and listen carefully, because I've already explained my position and this is the last time I'll do it. I'm against illegal immigration. I'm also against using misleading propaganda to make my points. Maybe YOU want to get YOUR information by white supremists and right-wing talk show hosts, but that's not where I want to get MY information from. If Lou Dobbs' figures were accurate, that email would have referenced his sources, not transcripts from his TV show. Get real.

My point is that folks want to argue for increased border security then do so rationally, not by spreading propaganda from obviously biased sources. It only serves to weaken your argument.
Wow, settle down sparky...
I never said where I wanted to get my information from, or even that the illegal immigration argument is my argument. If I remember correctly I responded to your post about being worried you would be associated with white supremacists, not that this is my argument - which by the way sounds like we pretty much agree on, except for that exploitation of cheap labor part - I was pointing out that the vast majority of Americans feels the same way about illegal immigration, regardless of ethnicity or political affiliation.