Replacement bolts for oil filter cover

[KBandit]

i'm changing my oil this weekend and hoped to replace the oil filter cover bolts, since they are known to be rather fragile ... prone to snap off.

does anyone have a good source for replacement bolts? should they be stainless? tempered steel?

thx in advance.

[TPadden]

i'm changing my oil this weekend and hoped to replace the oil filter cover bolts, since they are known to be rather fragile ... prone to snap off.
thx in advance.

That's one I haven't heard - must have missed something. I think you are MUCH more likely to strip the oil pan (filter cover holes) than have anything happen to the bolts.

[RaffyK]

David Shealey made the better grade ones available for IIRC $5 for a package of 3. PM him. He might still have some.

[dshealey]

I still have just a few sets left. They are ISO/DIN grade 12.9, the stock ones are grade 8.8, which are about the same as US/SAE grade 5. The 12.9 screws are considerably stronger than US/SAE grade 8.

You can PayPal $5 to me at:
theshealeys@cox.net.

If you don't use PayPal, PM me and I will give you my mail address.

[DaveDragon]

I just got a set from Dave, I think he has more.

[KBandit]

raffy ... thx.

david shealey ... i have not used paypal in a while; give me a bit to renew my account and i'll speed the digital bux to you. any mailing fee? thx.

[dshealey]

There have been quite a few people who have had the heads snap off of the bolts.

I have gone over this several times, here it is again.

The stock BMW bolts are DIN/ISO grade 8.8, and the lubricated torque by the book to reach 90% of yeild is 9.9 Nm, and BMW says to tighten these to 10 Nm! That is dangerously close to yield of the screw! The torque to reach 90% yield on the 12.9 grade screw is 16.5 Nm, so unless you really overtighten them you are not going to have the head snap off. There is about 16 MM of the screw engaged in the threads of the aluminum sump, so the bolt head of the 8.8 screw will snap off before you reach yield of that.

I think BMW may have gotten these screws from a lower quality manufacturer, or since they are plated may have suffered hydrogen embrittlement from poor plating controls. The grade 12.9 screws I have are Dacromet coated, which is a non-electrolytic coating that will not cause hydrogen embrittlement as electro plating can.

[dshealey]

They are $5 a set including postage.

[TPadden]

There have been quite a few people who have had the heads snap off of the bolts.


Dave,

I normally consider you the burning bush and you may have gone over this before but ...... I REALLY question "quite a few" - point me to any thread where this has happened .....

[DaFlake]

They are $5 a set including postage.

Dave,

Sent you a PM

Ramon

[KBandit]

david ... you have a PM.

[CWF]

Dave....I want a set. I'd read about this but didn't think you still had any. I'll paypal you in a moment.

[edonthenet]

Does anyone know the exact size of the OEM screws?

[DaveDragon]

Dave,

I normally consider you the burning bush and you may have gone over this before but ...... I REALLY question "quite a few" - point me to any thread where this has happened .....

Here is one where Grif (http://www.bmwlt.net/ubbthreads/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Board=K1200LT&Number=157190&page=&view=&sb=&o=) mentions it.

I know there were others posted, still looking.

[dshealey]

M6 X 20MM socket head cap screws.

If you can find grade 12.9 locally, use them. Carefull that you do not get electro-plated ones, plain black oxide would be better. The ones I furnished are Dacromet coated, look almost like the stock ones in color.

DO NOT use stainless steel ones! They have considerably less strength than the stock grade 8.8 ones!

[TPadden]

Here is one where Grif (http://www.bmwlt.net/ubbthreads/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Board=K1200LT&Number=157190&page=&view=&sb=&o=) mentions it.

I know there were others posted, still looking.

Me too - still haven't found ANYTHING other than David's "Several people have had the heads pop off" and Grif's "we've had the stock bolts break torqueing to the correct value".

Reading this board gives me enough to be paranoid about; if I haven't sheared em in 95,000 miles I think I'll live on the edge on this one.

[Billmer]

McMaster-Carr has all of the fasteners you might need. They have the SHCS M6x20mm. A box of 100 is about $7.49. This is for the class 12.9. Website is mcmaster.com. I order though there all the time for my go karts which is all metic. Good luck.

[munson]

i'm changing my oil this weekend and hoped to replace the oil filter cover bolts, since they are known to be rather fragile ... prone to snap off.

does anyone have a good source for replacement bolts? should they be stainless? tempered steel?

thx in advance.
In 66k miles worth of oil changes I never had a problem with them. I use a regular old L shaped allen wrench and my fingers, and never had a leak or a loss. Best of luck to you!

[dshealey]

I buy a lot of stuff from McMaster-Carr, both in my profession and for personal use. That is the first place I looked, but I wanted something grade 12.9 with at least the same corrosion resistance as the stock BMW grade 8.8s, which appear to be zinc plated.

McMaster part number 91290A326 $7.49 pkg of 100, are grade 12.9, but are black oxide, which WILL rust, and pretty quickly.

McMaster part number 91303A129 $7.08 pkg of 50, are Blue coated, more for identification of metric fasteners than anything else, and are a little more corrosion resistant than the standard black oxide, but still nowhere near the corrosion resistance of a galvanic coating.

I had to buy a box of 500 screws to get the Dacromet coated ones (we use a lot of those type of metric fasteners at my work). The Dacromet is a non electrolytically applied zinc/aluminum coating that gives the screws the same galvanic corrosion resistance that zinc plating does, but without the problem with possible hydrogen embrittlement from electroplating.

I forgot one IMPORTANT thing! I also had to special order DIN433 plated washers. The stock BMW screws have a captive washer, so I had to get washers that would fit into the counterbore, which standard metric washers will not, as they are too big. Even McMaster Carr does not carry them. These are 11 MM O.D., which just fits into the recess for the screw head. Standard metric washers are either 12 or 12.5MM O.D, and will not work. I furnish 4 washers in each set in case one gets lost.

Unfortunately, I will deplete my supply on this flurry, and may not be able to fill all the requests. I don't think there would be sufficient need for me to get another 500 screws!

[dshealey]

Forgot! You also need 11 MM O.D. washers, which are HARD to find. Standard 6 MM metric washers are either 12 MM or 12.5 MM O.D., which are too large, and will not fit into the recesses in the oil filter cover.

You DO NOT want to use socket head cap screws on aluminum without washers, damage will result, as the under head surface area is too small for the force that will be applied to the aluminum under 9-10 Nm torque.

[dshealey]

Here is one more, and there were others. Also a couple verbal ones at CCRs.

http://www.bmwlt.net/ubbthreads/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Board=K1200LT&Number=207735

[dshealey]

Sorry, but I had to disappoint a few people, this was a big run of requests compared to the past.

As I said in another post, these are only available to me in a box of 500, so I will not likely be getting any more.

[markbreen]

Dave,

I normally consider you the burning bush and you may have gone over this before but ...... I REALLY question "quite a few" - point me to any thread where this has happened .....

Hello Guys,

It happened to me when I removed the bolts on my European model LT. So, I ordered more from Motobins in the Uk and fitted them no problem.

Until I discovered I could remove the sump plate I was sick in the stomach. So I removed the plate, cleaned it all up and removed the bolt that was in the hole. Actually it was really easy to remove.

Two further things happend to me then, which I would like to share. When I re-installed the sump plate, one of the bolts on the corner nearest the brake pedel was constantly turning, ie the threads were rung in the engine casing. Now this to me is more serious, as I do not really wish to attempt a helicoil down there. As I had already fitted the sump plate and had installed all the 12 bolts, I decided to leave it and see how it went when it was full of hot oil and revved to 8,000 rpm :). So far, no leaking oil. Any comments on this situation are very welcome, do you guys think that I am being too risky by leaving this situation? I did apply plenty of the plastic gunk that they use instead of a gasket, so hopefully it is doing the job.

The other thing to tell you about was when I re-installed the cover for the oil filter, I re-installed it, torqued the bolts not too tight, in view my my recent experience of the threads shreading. I then filled the bike with oil. But guess what the oil was flowing from the oil filter cover, I mean it was really coming out. Initially I was sick again, thinking "what have I done now". I checked the gasket etc, but could see nothing wrong, finally I re-installed it only to notice that the bolts that I was using were too long, the cover was sitting quite loose, so it was entitled to leak. Once in installed a shorter bolt all was perfect and it has done about 1500 - 2000 miles so far with no problems.

Dave, finally as a foot note to my experience, it is actually possible that my threads were already damaged, but I would fear installing stronger bolts here. I would prefer to loose the bolt and have to remove the sump plate again than ring the engine casing. I am not suggesting that BMW anticipated this, and designed in these weak bolts, but for me, I felt nausious for a day or two.


Mark

[kip]

They are $5 a set including postage.

hey dave

got another set?

let me know...ill paypal u the $5 right away

thanks

[dshealey]

Dave, finally as a foot note to my experience, it is actually possible that my threads were already damaged, but I would fear installing stronger bolts here. I would prefer to loose the bolt and have to remove the sump plate again than ring the engine casing. I am not suggesting that BMW anticipated this, and designed in these weak bolts, but for me, I felt nausious for a day or two.
Mark

The stronger bolts are to avoid the heads snapping off when torqued to the RECOMMENDED torque, NOT to allow someone to tighten them more than that.

As I have posted before, the BMW stated torque of 10 NM is 95% of the yield point of a grade 8.8 screw! WAY too close for comfort. The grade 12.9 ones I was selling are rated over 16 NM to 95% yield.

If you had one stripped, someone tightened them WAY over spec.

It is important to use a torque wrench on most engine/tranny bolts, and if so done, one will likely never have this type of problem. BUT it seems that the filter cover bolts have had problems even when a torque wrench was used, so my suspicion is improper cold forming, or hydrogen embrittlement of the bolts in plating. Fortunately, all the failures have been the heads breaking off, so removing the plate allows easy removal of the threaded part.

[dshealey]

hey dave

got another set?

let me know...ill paypal u the $5 right away

thanks

I do not have any more. I had to get a box of 500, as the Dacromet coated ones are not readily available. I also had to order washers, as normal hardware store metric washers are too large to fit into the counterbores in the filter cover.

I may get another batch when our vendor comes in next time, since interest in them starts all over every time someone has another failure.

[Ron_Kendall]

You can add me to the list of those wanting a set.