Light and Radar Jamming

[lucky26]

I was pulled over by a laser radar set up. The officer said I was indicating a jammer being used. In Ontario Canada this is illegal. I didn't have and don't have a jammer. My question is would the stock high beam on the K1200LT do anything to effect the return signal of laser radar? I can not think of anything else that might of caused the jamming.

Cliff

[DaveDragon]

I was pulled over by a laser radar set up. The officer said I was indicating a jammer being used. In Ontario Canada this is illegal. I didn't have and don't have a jammer. My question is would the stock high beam on the K1200LT do anything to effect the return signal of laser radar? I can not think of anything else that might of caused the jamming.

Cliff

If the headlight is emitting light in the 850, 880, 900 or 940nm range it's possible their detector threw a false positive.

[sanjaun2]

Tell us more, Did he ticket you? What did you have to do to clear yourself?

[lucky26]

The officer took about an 1/2 hour to inspect the bike more time to run my plates and driver license. He didn't ticket me because he never found anything, nothing to find. He kept asking me to tell him where it was because he could tear the bike down till he found it. He was upset at me and I know he didn't believe me, but I just kept denying and didn't give any attitude. The last thing he said to me was to get rid of it, the next time I could get charged and it I would loose my insurance.
The jammer is a line of sight so he spent most time looking at the front of the bike trying to see something or where it might be mounted. I am a new LT rider so the only add on's are deer whistles.
To the response on the Nm frequency of the light; I don't know what the Nm of the lights are but tomorrow I am dropping by the BMW dealer and ask if they have any ideas, or know what the Nm frequency is.
I want to know what would be causing the jamming, imagine if the officer was a rookie or of the mind to find the jamming device at any cost, I would still be trying to put the pieces back together.
On the up side if the brights do jam the laser radar and they are OEM, sweet.

Cliff

[jackd]

If the officer decides to start taking a wrench to your bike I would suggest that you respectfully ask him to call his shift or patrol supervisor.. so you can sort this out.

I think you are within your rights (if you don't have the device) to remind them that unless they can find one, they will be responsible to return the bike to proper and safe condition so you can ride away. If they don't return the bike to proper operational status and/or cause a safety concern they are opening up their jurisdiction and you to an exposure that could prove very costly. Cooler heads should prevail. LEOs understand very well that lawyers make mountains out of mole hills.. As long as you are respectful you really should not have an issue with an over zealous peace officer.. The object is not to get arrested.

[DaveDragon]

Incandescent bulbs such as the stock headlight bulbs are designed for the Visual Spectrum.

http://csep10.phys.utk.edu/astr162/lect/light/EMspectrum.gif

As you can see, the IR wavelengths are just above the visible spectrum.
High end head lamp manufactures design the bulbs for the "Warm End" of the visual range in order to get as white a light as possible.

If the headlight is emitting IR, even the very slightest amount, the very sensitive IR sensor in the Laser Speed Gun will see it.

Personally, I wouldn't worry about it.

[sanjaun2]

thanks for the cool chart Dave.
Cliff, I wouldn't be surprised if his equipment was malfunctioning. And his laser gun as well!! If It happens again I'll buy that disfunctional headlight from you.

[dfinazzo]

This was just an interested LEO getting a first hand look at your cool ride while on the job . . .:p

[D_R]

Were there any other vehicles around you at the time? If so, it's entirely possible a jammer was on a nearby vehicle and the officer mis-identified which one.

[lucky26]

There were other cars, but from everything I have read the laser radar is aimed at specific targets verses the wide span of the older type. At about 300 yards it only has an 18" diameter contact with the cars. They normally aim at license plates to get the best reading, light color cars, metallic paint give the best reflection, dark grey to black absorb more of the radar light. My LT is the dark grey. Without a license plate on the front he would have to of been aiming at the head lights.

That and after I stopped he turned the radar gun so he was only reading me, and kept going back and looking at it. He asked me to turn the bike off, and than turn it on. Jammers are normally wired to the ignition. I never thought to turn the head lights off. If I had I would know.

[D_R]

You are correct that the laser is aimed at a specific vehicle.

However when the laser reflects back to the LEO, it is still possible for some of the reflected beam to once again reflect off a surface and again trave down the highway in a slightly different direction and activate the jammers on an adjacent vehicle.

Since the LEO aimed at you, he assumed you had the jammers.

[mefly2]

... from your other similar thread ... :
Originally Posted by lucky26
...I was pulled over and was accused of having a jamming system ... however I did jam the officer's laser radar....



It is difficult to understand what you are telling us and asking :confused: I am confused ... did you or did you not have a device for jamming "the officer's laser radar"? Now in this thread you say that you had no jammer ???

Laser and radar are two different concepts ... in the US, laser jammers have not yet been deemed illegal by the feds (however, it may not be legal in all jurisdictions ... YMMV) but, since they are active transmitters goverened by FCC rules, radar jammers are illegal across the board!

dfinazzo This was just an interested LEO getting a first hand look at your cool ride while on the job . . . :rolleyes:

... can't say that I have known any leo's over the past 30 years that would risk an unwarranted traffic stop without PC to look at any ride; myself included! :eek:

[lucky26]

Didn't mean to confuse. First entry was not as clear as perhaps it could of been. New owner and first thread on this site.
I am in Ontario Canada and jammers are illegal here as are detecters, they can search and cease and you get the max points causing a loss of insurance. It is not worth the trouble to have one. I didn't even know jammers were available till he stopped me and I thought he was talking about a radar / laser detecter. Sense than I have done a lot of reading and realize the differences in radar and laser. The laser is aimed at each car and normally at the license plate, but the bike has no plates so I think he aimed at the head lights. I have a 05LT and the high beam was the only thing different from every other time I have gone through a speed trap. It was a bit foggy that morning and wanted as much light as possible. Even after I stopped it still jammed, bike on or off, but I forgot to shut off the lights. If I understand what I have read, there are passive jammers and active jammers. Active jammers use bright LED to jam the laser. How effective this is I don't know, but if there is anything to it than perhaps he aimed at my light and it was effected.
I went to the police station and talked with the traffic section and they never heard of head lights effecting a laser, nor had the BMW dealer went I went and talked with them. They reminded me that the HID's do not effect lasers, so maybe it was a one time occarance.
Until I find another laser set up and try my theory that the high beam effects the laser gun than it is a mystery. Looked for one on Friday and like a good coffee shop there isn't one when you want one.
Thanks for you reply.

[bone1]

Just another smart-a** COP! He should pay you for wasting your time.. Bone1.

[lucky26]

I talked with a friend tonight that is a Toronto traffic cop and he seemed to agree with you. He said he can not write a ticket for a laser jammer, or take it, they are not illegal, the law makers have not caught up with them yet. The radar detecter is though. He does not know what might of jammed the laser, does not think it is the lights, and has invited me down to Toronto and he will run some test. When it stops snowing and gets above 3C I am going to take him up on that offer.