K1200LT Bridgestone BT020R 160/70R-17 tire failure survey

[mudman]

I received a call today from Bridgestone Motorcycle tires engineering in Nashville, TN. We talked for about ten minutes discussing my BT020 rear tire failure. I will be sending the sectioned tire to them for further analysis. Hopefully something will come of this effort. If you have had any failures on your K1200LT using the Bridgestone BT020R 160/70R-17 tire, now would be the time to post your findings. The more data we can produce and document the better chances we have finding the root cause of this type of failure. I’ll keep you updated or the results.

CLICK HERE TO TAKE THE SURVEY (http://www.bmwlt.com/forums/survey.php?)

Links:

Bridgestone BT020R 160/70R-17 tire failure web page.

http://pulsefl.0catch.com/bt020r/ (http://pulsefl.0catch.com/bt020r/)

[RonKMiller]

You GO Don!

Guys like you keep the bastards on their toes!

I've never used a Bridgestone, but have been VERY concerned with the failures. So much that I would never consider buying one.

Don't let 'em BS ya - and with your background I don't think they have a chance.

[eljeffe]

Don,

Do you want me to create a survey of this in our survey system? That way, you could just download the data for an Excel spreadsheet.

Let me know, and I'll do it.

Regards,

Jeff

[mudman]

Jeff,

Sure, that would be great!

Thank you,

Don

[eljeffe]

Don,

The survey is out there.

CLICK HERE TO TAKE THE SURVEY (http://www.bmwlt.com/forums/survey.php?)

Let me know if there are any problems.

[artk50]

Just to let you know, when I click on the survey link on your reply it hangs. When I click on the link from the original post I am directed straight into the survey.

[dshealey]

Same for me. I got into it by using the "Surveys" link on the top tool bar.

[eljeffe]

I think I fixed the link.

BTW, if you have had more than one failure, please take the survey for EACH instance. That way we have data on each failure.

[artk50]

Are we also collecting information on how many people have run these tires and never had an issue other than cupping? If we collect data only on failures how can the numbers be used?

[mudman]

Jeff,
The survey works great. One thing you might change is the question that asks "Was the tire covered or replaced under warranty?" I never inquired about getting the tired replaced under warranty so a selection of yes or no does not work. You might add to the selection "Did not inquire".

Sure lets collect all data we can regardless if you had a failure or not. From what I have seen in my cross-sections I believe the cupping may be an indication of the tire is starting to separate. Anyone who is in the process of replacing their tire might want to cross-section it to provide more data. Give me a shout for tips of cutting the tire.

[eljeffe]

No, we are only collecting failures.

[messenger13]

I filled out the survey; but otherwise, I've decided to let me money do the talking. I just may never buy another Bridgestone tire as long as I live. I replaced the failed 020 with a set of Metzelers. And my Ninja currently has 020s on it also...but this winter when I replace the tires, I'm changing brands. What happened to the 020 at 3,800 miles was, IMHO, totally unacceptable!!! http://users.pandora.be/eforum/emoticons4u/sad/1004.gif

[paulcbrowne]

Uh, what if you have run Bridgestone radials and have had no problems? Other than short wear mileage, that is. Maybe there should be a no-problem input to the survey (knocking on wood). Like rear ends, I wonder how many have not had problems. It would be interesting to see if there are contirbuting factors -- trailering, 2-up, heavy loading, etc.

[messenger13]

No trailer...
One-up 90% of the time...
Tire had 3,800 miles on it...
Pressure checked religiously!

T O T A L L Y
U N A C C E P T A B L E ! ! !

Just the same as the rear drive issue. A 3 to 4% failure rate on a bearing is totally unacceptable. Fortunately for me, I can do something about the Bridgestone debacle. I am no longer an owner. http://www.sport-touring.net/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/clap.gif Problem solved.

[dshealey]

We each have our reasons for abandoning tires. You abandoned the BT020s because you had one failure. I had two BT020 delams, but abandoned the Metzelers because the rear slipping on wet, again, and again, and again, and again.

I will take the two blisters over the 5 wet slips, and have better twisty road handling to boot. :D :D

[messenger13]

When you get your next LT, let's ride through the twisties together so you can show me the massive performance gain of the 'Stones. http://www.r1-forum.com/gallery/images/wink.gif The Metzelers felt pretty good last week on the Tail of the Dragon. Not sure the 'Stones would've held up to that abuse. :D

[omurphy]

i've gone through one rear battle ax. i got about 18 k on it. i'm on the second. i've got about three or four k on it. no problems. i switched to bridgestone because, when i had a flat on the road, menphis bmw didn't have a metzeler. they only had the bridgestone and i got alot of miles off of the first, so i bought another. omurphy.

[beemer666]

Just a couple of thoughts:

I think it's a good idea to have such a survey, but:

There appears to be no questions about the pressure being used by everybody, possibly the most important factor with tyres, and there is nowhere to enter data if there have been no problems.

There could be 20 people with problems and 1000 without. It appears the survey assumes there is a problem from the start, should it not be an impartial collection of data, the conclusion to be drawn when there is enough information?

Please excuse the English spelling.

[Ranger6]

Had mine in to the dealer for a service on Friday and decided to replace the front BT020. Never would I have imagined that without asking, the shop would slap on a Metezler instead, making for a mixed set. I knew there was something weird about the ride home, but I didn't pickup on the cause until I got there. So I got the guy on the phone to ask why they would do such a thing, and I got the answer, "Well, nobody rides on Bridgestones anymore." "Really?!? Then why do you suppose that brand new, '06 Magnesium Black Metallic LT up there in the showroom you probably put together a couple of days ago has Bridgestones on it?" :confused: What a bonehead...ya gotta watch 'em like a hawk.

[DBHutchins]

Filled my survey out.

I reported on my rear tread separation (5700 miles or so) here about two summers back, right after it happened.

I'm with the others here who are willing to sacrifice a little traction for a LOT of security. Now on my fourth set of Metzlers, with good mileage and zero problems. The tread failure on the Stones (on an alpine pass road - NOT a good place to break down!) cured me of these buggers.

Rubber side down - whatever kind of rubber!!

Don

[BigJohn]

I just put some stones on my bike. I like the way they feel as compared to the Metz. But I will watch them like a hawk. The tread depth new compared to the Metz is impressive. I would think the stones would last a good bit longer.

[mudman]

I checked FedEx tracking and it shows the tire has been received. I called Bridgestone and talked to my contact to check if he had received the tire. He said he had not been notified it was received but would call receiving and arrange to pickup the tire.

I'll keep you updated of the progress.

[mudman]

I just talked with my Bridgestone contact today and he said he would be posting some information here on the message board to provide feed back to Bridgestone.

[hayabusa200]

Mine cupped really bad and had to replace them at 4000 miles.

[ltcommuter]

I know I'm getting into this way late butt does anyone think that the age of the tire might be a factor in the failures? I know we are asking about the mileage but most normal folks don't put enough mileage on a bike in a year to wear out the tires.

I've been running 020s for the last 110k miles without any problems but I go through three rears and four fronts a year. They are always relatively new.

Cheers!

[mudman]

I talked with my contact T.J. Tennent of Bridgestone Motorcycle Tires. T.J. said your welcome to call him about your problems with the BT020R Radial tire. T.J. was very interested in the failures of the BT020R tire, so give him a call. In my conversation with him he was concerned with the tire clearance to swing arm gap. He also mentioned that the Honda Goldwings had similar problems with some Bridgestone tires. T.J. sees all the warranted tire clams in the states and there was no significant number with the BT020R’s tires. I told him probably most riders just replace the tire and don’t even think about taking it in for warranty.

Remember Guys this is the Radial tire not the Bias ply tire.



Give him a call.



T.J. Tennent

Bridgestone Motorcycle Tires

800-543-7522 ext.3591

[Chuck_Gardner]

Yeah I can't believe it either but its true....

I put the tire on my 2000 LT at 30,000 miles. The bike now has 57,000 miles, original shocks and the tire was just down to the wear bars.

I'm probably not a typical rider. I use the bike to commute year-round 66 miles round-trip and on weekends it sits in the garage. Thus I ride at the same flat route at the same speeds with very little stop and go. When I stop for gas every 4 days the odometer is always the same, give or take a few miles. I've always used BT020 and typically get 12,000 miles from the fronts and 18,000 from the backs, with the back tire at 46-47psi and the front at 42psi. I usually replace due to cupping and handling before they are down to the wear bars.

There's another interesting variable which might explain the exceptional milage. For the last couple of years the back brake disk has been rattling as the floating spacers self-destructed. For the past year or so they've been gone completely to the point where the bike will shimmy slightly becuase the disk is out of balance. But above 50 mph the rear disk finds equilibrium and things settle down. I spend about 90% of my commute above 50mph so the shimmy doesn't bother me. Like the hesitation in the summer I just ride through it.

It's just a theory, but I suspect there is a cause and effect between my dynamic rear wheel balancing and the tire wear. I suspect it in part because the tire with 27,000 miles on it has less cupping than one with 18,000 miles does when I change it. The extra "float" in the disk does cause the pads to wear a bit faster, but they are easily replaced. I learned ancedotally that an LT rear brake without any pad left stops the bike about as good as the drum brakes on my /2 did.

The BT020 before that one lasted 600 miles before it picked up a huge sheetmetal screw and had to be replaced so I'm still only averaging 14,000 per tire.

Chuck Gardner